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  1. #61
    Fluffy Kitten Darsithis's Avatar
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    Jan 2011
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    Thats not a fact. The whole premise of the Sunwell was to introduce players more to Blood Elf architecture, as well as lore. The Sunwell was the source of the Blood Elf's power and corruption. It was not silvermoon city, it was located in a completely different location, and is completely structured differently. It was new.

    Yeah, and the fact that they reused Kael'thas for a 5 man dungeon was the start of the idea that rehashes were okay. I excuse it though because hes a completely different model, and its a new 5 man dungeon different from any of the BC dungeons at the time.
    It was still a rehash, and, in the true sense of the word: existing assets and characters improved in new or improved locations.

  2. #62
    who really cares if a model/zone is rehashed?

    SoO had some of the best raid bosses/mechanics ever in WoW.

    sure, after 7234872896729 months of raiding the place you want to cut your own eyes out because the place is boring and the fights are dull but on progression those fights were awesome

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Mystile View Post
    Yay another Jaylock thread with Guaranteed Replies.

    Dragon Soul was a bad raid, in environment and mechanics. The entire experience was poor.

    ZG was completely redone. The only thing that remained was the environment, which even then was still changed somewhat (no Bat area).

    ZA is similar to DS; same zone and mechanics. However it was still enjoyable (for awhile).

    Naxx was redone because of how few actually saw the content, and yes, it was a cheap cop out, but honestly it was a great starter raid.

    Scholo is completely different. Only the zone was reused, and even then (notice a theme yet?) it was changed.

    SFK was completely redone and given a heroic mode, nothing reused except the environment. Why would they change a classic dungeon instead of putting in a new one if it was going to be 100% different?

    VC (Deadmines) look at SFK, same shit.

    Siege of Orgrimmar?

    How you going to siege a place without going to it?

    Scenarios tell a story in a place where a quest line would be less helpful for the story. Their purpose is to tell the story (also for fast valor).

    Onyxia, this fucking red herring. It was redone as a bonus for their 6th(?) anniversary. You're welcome for getting a gift on Blizzard's day.

    BWD. Just because the bosses' names (Nefarian and Onyxia) are used does not, in any way, make them rehashed. This is a terrible attempt for your "argument."

    As for seeing original content? No, not by your standards, because the bosses are somewhat already in the game. Gul'dan? REHASHED GG BLIZZ. And so on.
    I agree with your entire post. And my only question is why the OP continually talks about what "we" find accaptable with WoW when he quit a long time ago and said he's not coming back.

  4. #64
    Legendary! Tharkkun's Avatar
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    Oct 2008
    Quote Originally Posted by Tragedia View Post
    Why do you have to be so negative all the time man!
    He's not negative. He's right and everyone else is obviously wrong.

  5. #65
    By OP's definition, every single reuse of an environment texture is a rehash, because you're seeing the exact same texture between zone A and zones G Q and V. Doesn't matter to me one way or another. I wouldn't have even seen Naxx in Wrath, had someone not been confident enough in my abilities to ask me to go with them. I have yet to see ZA, and don't care to. same goes for DS.

  6. #66
    It's not a matter of "how much". It comes down to whether I enjoy the content and whether I feel like I'm revisiting somewhere and enjoying nostalgia or if I'm just doing the same thing over again. The latter has never really happened in WoW.

    All of the raids you listed I enjoyed. Like the vast majority of the playerbase I never raided Naxx so the fact it was the same raid again meant nothing to me. Similarly I never raided Ony, and in any case that was one boss and it was mostly for nostalgia purposes. ZA/ZG were excellent dungeons (at least until the VP structure made me run them 1000 times), my only dislike is that they removed the old ZG mounts in the process of rehashing. Deadmines was fantastic, SFK was also really good - the only downside being that story changes meant it was no longer a dungeon full of Worgen. SoO reuses some rooms but I mean, it's the Siege of Orgrimmar - duh it reuses Orgrimmar.

    Scenarios are a great way of making content without Bliz having to spend dungeon/raid resources to do it, and they're super convenient, some of them are fun too. Also can be good from a lore/storytelling perspective. I wish there were more story scenarios in fact. And anyway, most of the MoP scenarios use terrain that was clearly made specifically for the purpose of being used in the scenarios.

    DS was kind of a mixed bag, IMO it was too soon after Wrath to be revisiting Dragonrest. I liked going back to the Eye, pity I hated Hagara so much. Would've preferred to see a bit less of that and more new rooms. I didn't mind the Ultraxion fight though, Dragonrest suited that. The last three fights were good as well.

    TLDR: I enjoy almost all of this content so I don't care that it's "rehashed" - at least in terms of the actual rooms/terrain.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    Black wing descent (rehashed Nefarian, Re-Rehashed Onyxia)
    Nothing about BWD was rehashed. You might as well say MGT rehashed TK because it had K-T in it.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by RaenavenBlacksun View Post
    By OP's definition, every single reuse of an environment texture is a rehash, because you're seeing the exact same texture between zone A and zones G Q and V. Doesn't matter to me one way or another. I wouldn't have even seen Naxx in Wrath, had someone not been confident enough in my abilities to ask me to go with them. I have yet to see ZA, and don't care to. same goes for DS.
    You're missing out, ZA is great.

    DS isn't half as bad as people make out either.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by det View Post
    ...and if there is anything that annoys me about SoO, then it is that there is still this peacefull SoO where I go to the AH during the day...and at night when I raid it is the besieged city.

    Would have expected us all to be exiled, live in fugitive camps or another city to stand in as a capital during the siege. THAT to me is immersion breaking. Using the assets of the city for a raid is fine. I you said, we are raiding freaking Orgrimmar. Why would it suddenly look like a totally new and different city?

    - - - Updated - - -

    This one is pretty easy to answer actually: Wrath pre-launch event. While many loved it, (I really wished I played then) many hated it because it disrupted their normalcy.

    I personally would've loved if they made Thunder Bluff the temporary main city, the amount of average players who would've rioted would've been immense.
    Quote Originally Posted by Unmerciful Conker View Post
    What?! They said soon? Well you dont hear that everyday, I dont know about you guys but that has put my mind at total rest.

  8. #68
    Rehashing is acceptable in my book, as long as it makes sense. It feeds my nostalgia hunger, and I always like something new!

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    SoO obviously has to take place in Orgrimmar for Christ's sake. Come on. You're invading the damn place. What, were they supposed to design a whole new Orgrimmar that no one has ever seen before and expected people to believe it?
    Exactly what I was thinking.

  10. #70
    Revamps are a really good thing in games as old as WoW. There's a lot of content people want to see again whether a vocal minority on a forum bitches about it or not.

  11. #71
    Bloodsail Admiral sscavenger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Quote Originally Posted by Manataurus View Post
    I agree with your entire post. And my only question is why the OP continually talks about what "we" find accaptable with WoW when he quit a long time ago and said he's not coming back.
    Because he is one of those people who feels they have to stick around until they get proven right. It will take years of bitching and complaining but when WoW finally dies he will be there to loudly and boldly proclaim that he was right all along. But seriously what fun is a world that doesn't change? What fun is playing a game where your actions have no effect upon the world at all. Congratulations you saved X place and X people but if you go back there they will be dealing with four expansions worth of crap.

  12. #72
    I don't like it when Blizzard rehash things, but I don't like when people exaggerate about things a lot more.

  13. #73
    5 mans have been progressively updated to keep up with the progressing story of wow which has changed since classic

    SoO wasn't a rehash it was a siege of the city of Ogrimmar

    Onyxia was given as an anniversary "gift" and wasn't a lore / story development, if that was today we would probably just have gotten the mount in the shop instead.

    And i'll stop as I realise this is just another whine for the sake of whining thread.

  14. #74
    I get to see how the story of an area developed past my last visit there years ago. What changed and how they dealt with it.

    I especially liked seeing many of the low level dungeons were updated in this manner (the ones that got heroic versions weren't the only ones to be updated).

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also let us note that the part of SOO actually dealing with the actual Orgrimmar ingame model did not even make up a majority of the raid.

    The vast majority of the raid is new areas outside of the 2nd act, which is the necessary "storming into ogrimmar" section.

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Shampro View Post
    Apperantly a character re-apearing is reashing. Word lost it's meaning a long time ago.
    it is especially when said character was killed and had their head cut off and gets resurrected for the sole purpose of dying again.

    Ragnaros, Onyxia and Nefarian returning certainly felt like a rehash to me. and many friends said to me "killing them again holds no appeal, feel like I finished the game"
    Last edited by Briga; 2014-06-18 at 12:48 PM.

  16. #76
    I find it unacceptable if the rehash itself defies the storyline. There are raids in which bosses should be dead and should stay dead. I have no problem with the likes of Dragon Soul since naturally, I don't imagine a world would simply disappear after you've explored it.

  17. #77
    Using the same location =/= rehash. If they progress the story they are something new. For the most part, the redone dungeons were just that, they had new story lines that progressed the original.
    There is a thin line between not knowing and not caring, and I like to think that I walk that line every day.

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    If you're assaulting the capital city of a faction, one would presume that you would not be presented suddenly with an entirely new urban environment. The world is the world. If you're going to have raids or scenarios staged partially or entirely in the world I wouldn't expect to see massive changes as it totally disrupts the story-telling.
    Right, but to me that seems like yet another good reason not to stage a raid in a faction capitol. Doing so has the potential for good storytelling, but the story is only going to matter to most players on the first few plays through. After that, it'll be the place they hang out every Tuesday and farm loot. At that point, it doesn't matter how awesome and climactic the story was; if it's your capitol being raided, you raid and queue and shop and bank without so much as a change of scenery.

    It must be especially disheartening when it's the last raid of the expansion, so you'll be queuing, shopping, banking and farming raid loot in the same place for more than a year. Add to that the fact that the next expansion is MOAR ORCS, and cap it all off with the fact that (at least for Horde players,) building another orc settlement up around yourself is that expansion's fancy new gameplay feature (which is solidly rooted in the quest content,) and it could get a little claustrophobic in your spiky little kodohide cubicle there. You'll be leaving behind fighting orcs in Orgrimmar to go fight orcs in Draenor while you build yourself another Orgrimmar to be trapped in. How awesome is that?

    . . . And let's be honest: how important can it possibly be to those developers that the game world supports the storytelling? Before you answer, stroll through Dalaran or Ashenvale forest. The fact that you can still even do that as a Hordie sort of dictates the answer.
    Last edited by Kaganfindel; 2014-06-18 at 02:23 PM.

  19. #79
    Isn't this a rehash of another Jaylock thread?
    You're not allowed to discuss conspiracy theories on mmo-champion, which makes me wonder what they're trying to hide.

  20. #80
    Stood in the Fire Twin Blades's Avatar
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    Jul 2013
    South Wales
    The only thing that's fucking rehashed is this topic.
    “In truth it was I who was betrayed. Still I am hunted. Still I am hated”
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