1. #5541
    Ultima 4 and I think the original Ultima Online box came with a cloth map. Ultima 4 even came with a little metal ankh thingie. But yeah, that was in the box for a released game, not as a pre-pre-alpha reward for donors. I think they knew they couldn´t actually make the game, so they did all of the PR and marketing stuff to the extreme. That was just a crap-ton of IRC chats and a huge waste of time talking about detailed stuff for a game so early.

    We have already changed our map in fairly major ways 3 or 4 different times. It is impossible to draw it on paper or even 3d model it and think you are done. Until you are running around on it as a life-sized player, there are things you never would think would be a problem that just pop up. Most players don´t realize how constrained game development is by performance. If you see an early alpha map of a game, more than likely the real map will have more drastic height differences just to block vision and increase FPS.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fornax- View Post
    The actual fabric was quite good. Good color, too. I just didn't like the layout, nor the design of the world. Just seemed like a big square with a lake and then a swamp and then a desert.
    seriously.. put it on ebay. When this is all said and done.. this thread alone would probably help you get some of your money back. I mean at this point, I would buy it for $20 and take a selfie next to it just to make a forum sig here.

  2. #5542
    Quote Originally Posted by Marweinicus View Post
    I see no issues with selling physical merchandise. My issue was all the virtual crap.
    I have issues with FC selling physical merchandise that it used fundraising monies intended for game development to purchase.

  3. #5543
    Quote Originally Posted by Gattsu125 View Post
    To be fair for Fornax's comment that the events from the second KS may be the worst out of everything...

    They did actually have a 'game' in the form of their tech demo (regardless of the quality or condition of the demo). The blunder is is that they did not show anything gameplay related, or from the demo at all, to anyone (that didn't pay $500 for demo access or whatever), especially when promoting toa to outside sources and the public and through KS (and of course timing of the KS and all that stuff too). I mean, they had something, but didn't (want to?) reveal or promote or showcase it...? That Fornax's, and others, funds were utilized to create that demo, yet the demo itself, or any footage, was never utilized for toa and its promotion for the KS. That the one thing they have for obvious proof of concept and an actual playable 'game' world, yet do not provide it when it is most needed.

    I mean, it is one thing if Brax (and others) lies to their fans and other people. But how exactly can they explain this situation, when there is actual proof of content being created?
    So what was the demo intended for?

  4. #5544
    Quote Originally Posted by dextersmith View Post
    So what was the demo intended for?
    At this point, it would seem to fulfill legal obligations. Look how many times Brax has stated they 'did what they set out to do'. Of course the Kool-Aid drinkers will all claim it's proof ToA is a really reals game that's totally gonna come out, which is what the Three Stooges want them to claim cos it gives them a herd of sheep to keep trying to fleece in the coming months/years they hold onto this 'game'.

  5. #5545
    Quote Originally Posted by Azrile View Post
    And that is why the fans that still support them are insane. Let us just make some absurd assumptions. Let´s assume that it is possible for 3 CEOs with no skills to make a MMORPG. Let´s make the assumption that they raise enough money to actually hire some decent workers.

    What in the past of these three idiots would lead anyone to believe that they could manage the project? They have literally screwed up everything since this all started. The fans gave them almost double the amount the said they need to make a demo video.. and they produced absolute garbage. They spent $67,000 to fundraise $28,000 and even though Teddy did some decent work, the three stoogies completely destroyed their own KS. They have twice now had a mass exodus of people who work with them. Xanword was pretty obvious with his lashing out at Brax´s abilities, and Teddy probably was a little more restrained, but you have to believe his comment about turning on the server was made for our amusement. They bought all kinda crap they didn´t need, or that didn´t work. If you can´t manage money, and you can´t manage people.... why does anyone think these three nobodies could actually make a game if given the proper money or workers. You would just end up with a larger version of their KS#2, where they have everything they need, yet still manage to screw it all up.
    So money guy can't manage money, art guy - wtf was he capable of??? Head guy can't manage the game or peons, yet few fans saw red flags. 3 CEOs, not CFO, COO.... just 3 idiots shitting in 1 seat yet there were no red flags.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lawow74 View Post
    At this point, it would seem to fulfill legal obligations. Look how many times Brax has stated they 'did what they set out to do'. Of course the Kool-Aid drinkers will all claim it's proof ToA is a really reals game that's totally gonna come out, which is what the Three Stooges want them to claim cos it gives them a herd of sheep to keep trying to fleece in the coming months/years they hold onto this 'game'.
    They haven't fulfilled it yet. They needed $40k for a demo so they asked for $40k, but delivered a $30k demo cause they only accounted for $30k (and that's without receipts too). You wouldn't be able to do that with government money; pocketing any money would be embezzlement. We were told Teddy was the only paid staff member so no FC staff or CEO can pocket it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fornax- View Post
    I had to correct Varl's descriptions of tributaries and waterways, because (at least based on how things were described in the "lore") he didn't understand that water flowed downhill, and the tributaries join rivers for the most part, not the reverse. They also had a major mistake in their zone descriptions that I was able to help them fix in the lore, but all of this was AFTER they had the freaking CLOTH MAP made!
    This is gold!

  6. #5546
    Deleted
    Since we've chatted before about one man in Unity, anybody see this student-made HD remake of the first level from Mario 64 - apparently re-created to show off his custom character controller he developed or something?

    https://roystanross.wordpress.com/super-mario-64-hd/

    It's pretty damn perfect, plays in the browser so no downloads necessary (apart from Unity Web Player if you don't have it). Obviously it's micro-scale compared to an MMO, but if this guy opened a kickstarter tomorrow to make a mario-like and used this as a proof of his skills I would totally give him money based on how well that demo controls.

  7. #5547
    Quote Originally Posted by Valarius View Post
    Since we've chatted before about one man in Unity, anybody see this student-made HD remake of the first level from Mario 64 - apparently re-created to show off his custom character controller he developed or something?

    https://roystanross.wordpress.com/super-mario-64-hd/

    It's pretty damn perfect, plays in the browser so no downloads necessary (apart from Unity Web Player if you don't have it). Obviously it's micro-scale compared to an MMO, but if this guy opened a kickstarter tomorrow to make a mario-like and used this as a proof of his skills I would totally give him money based on how well that demo controls.
    haha, that is freaking awesome. He absolutely nailed the controller and camera.

  8. #5548
    Deleted
    FC just needs to quit now. This is just getting ridiculous. They have comically botched this up so badly that its almost like watching someone attempt drill through a mountain with a single, cooked piece of spaghetti. Perhaps that's where the noodle beach came from.

    Either way, I'm just sick and tired of this now. I saw another forum member quit and someone else turn round and say "they won't be missed because when ToA is released they'll be back"....these people need a serious reality check. The devs are seemingly beyond measure...but at least if nobody believes in their game they won't still try to make it...right?

  9. #5549
    Quote Originally Posted by Valarius View Post
    Since we've chatted before about one man in Unity, anybody see this student-made HD remake of the first level from Mario 64 - apparently re-created to show off his custom character controller he developed or something?

    https://roystanross.wordpress.com/super-mario-64-hd/

    It's pretty damn perfect, plays in the browser so no downloads necessary (apart from Unity Web Player if you don't have it). Obviously it's micro-scale compared to an MMO, but if this guy opened a kickstarter tomorrow to make a mario-like and used this as a proof of his skills I would totally give him money based on how well that demo controls.
    How many decades or Kickstarters did it take for him to make this? It looks like they had to have at least...5 Teddys.

  10. #5550
    Quote Originally Posted by ElectricYouth View Post
    FC just needs to quit now. This is just getting ridiculous.
    Don´t lose faith brother, Brax has a plan that he is going to reveal shortly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sunaka View Post
    How many decades or Kickstarters did it take for him to make this? It looks like they had to have at least...5 Teddys.
    You know what the crazy part is.. I just really took time to look at his site.. the guy actually makes the entire source of the project downloadable. So you could open the game in Unity and tinker with it. ToA on the other hands, still has an NDA up for crap that was broken 10 years ago.

  11. #5551
    Quote Originally Posted by Azrile View Post
    Don´t lose faith brother, Brax has a plan that he is going to reveal shortly.

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    You know what the crazy part is.. I just really took time to look at his site.. the guy actually makes the entire source of the project downloadable. So you could open the game in Unity and tinker with it. ToA on the other hands, still has an NDA up for crap that was broken 10 years ago.
    Pfft look at you! Already hungering for their amazing code! Admit it! It was your master plan all along!
    I didn't become your alt account for this shit mate! >:3

  12. #5552
    Quote Originally Posted by Myobi View Post
    Pfft look at you! Already hungering for their amazing code! Admit it! It was your master plan all along!
    I didn't become your alt account for this shit mate! >:3
    I will never be able to convince their fans this. But the truth is that for anyone but Teddy, most of what is on that server is useless. It would take longer to backtrack and figure crap out then to just start over. There wasn´t enough done to bother trying to salvage it. And like that survivor island tutorial showed, nothing they did was difficult. Dealing with the MMO-kit they used is going to be a huge headache for anyone, with or without what is on the server now.

  13. #5553
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    Quote Originally Posted by ElectricYouth View Post
    FC just needs to quit now. This is just getting ridiculous. They have comically botched this up so badly that its almost like watching someone attempt drill through a mountain with a single, cooked piece of spaghetti. Perhaps that's where the noodle beach came from.

    Either way, I'm just sick and tired of this now. I saw another forum member quit and someone else turn round and say "they won't be missed because when ToA is released they'll be back"....these people need a serious reality check. The devs are seemingly beyond measure...but at least if nobody believes in their game they won't still try to make it...right?
    They have figured out a method for safely scamming idiots out of money, don't expect them to stop coming to that well anytime soon. They WILL try to profit from this scam or a similar scam again.

  14. #5554
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Taojnhy View Post
    I have issues with FC selling physical merchandise that it used fundraising monies intended for game development to purchase.
    I agree to some extent.

    If they were only selling physical stuff from day 1 in the shop (T-shirts and crap like the map and coin) I honestly see no problem. Virtual goods were also being sold. We all knew that crap would never make it into the real game. That is what ticks me off. And perhaps the 'shut up and give me all your money' banner :P

  15. #5555
    Quote Originally Posted by Marweinicus View Post
    I agree to some extent.

    If they were only selling physical stuff from day 1 in the shop (T-shirts and crap like the map and coin) I honestly see no problem. Virtual goods were also being sold. We all knew that crap would never make it into the real game. That is what ticks me off. And perhaps the 'shut up and give me all your money' banner :P
    Don't misunderstand me; I completely disagree as well with their virtual goods selling-for-a-non-existent-game. However, selling virtual goods does have one positive aspect: it didn't cost FC money to offer (at least I'm assuming it didn't).

    Physical goods though, did cost money, and I'm fairly confident in betting that it wasn't FC's own funds that were used (especially since Brax stated that part of the $67k went towards this). Maybe I'm an outlier in feeling this way, but if I'd donated $1000 to FC for their stated purpose of developing a game and they used that money to merchandise a game that doesn't even exist for profit...well, I'd be pissed.

    Had FC used their own, non-donated, money to merchandise physical goods then my objections, much like ToA, would be non-existent.

  16. #5556
    Quote Originally Posted by Taojnhy View Post
    Don't misunderstand me; I completely disagree as well with their virtual goods selling-for-a-non-existent-game. However, selling virtual goods does have one positive aspect: it didn't cost FC money to offer (at least I'm assuming it didn't).

    Physical goods though, did cost money, and I'm fairly confident in betting that it wasn't FC's own funds that were used (especially since Brax stated that part of the $67k went towards this). Maybe I'm an outlier in feeling this way, but if I'd donated $1000 to FC for their stated purpose of developing a game and they used that money to merchandise a game that doesn't even exist for profit...well, I'd be pissed.

    Had FC used their own, non-donated, money to merchandise physical goods then my objections, much like ToA, would be non-existent.
    Then that money should've been used for development.

  17. #5557
    Quote Originally Posted by dextersmith View Post
    Then that money should've been used for development.
    It was used for development. They probably spent many long hours in front of the TV in development meetings over take-out talking about all the awesome stuff they're totally gonna put in their game which will completely revolutionize the MMO industry. For reals. Hey, pass me another Buffalo Wing, there, willya?

  18. #5558
    Quote Originally Posted by lawow74 View Post
    It was used for development. They probably spent many long hours in front of the TV in development meetings over take-out talking about all the awesome stuff they're totally gonna put in their game which will completely revolutionize the MMO industry. For reals. Hey, pass me another Buffalo Wing, there, willya?
    So that justifies the beer, can hookers program?

  19. #5559
    Quote Originally Posted by dextersmith View Post
    So that justifies the beer, can hookers program?
    Now see, if they'd offered beer and hookers as Kickstarter rewards maybe it would've gotten somewhere.

  20. #5560
    I look forward to see what you'll post when the game is released.

    Talon-Thorn, Yesterday at 9:01 PM
    I'm sure he means "I look foward to see what your grandchildren will post when the game is released" =X

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