Female Draenei Model: Old vs. New

[Neclord]

[Odile]

I disagree. Eyes are generally rounder on the outside than the inside; it's eyelashes and makeup that make them look pointier at the end. The 6.1 eyes are ridiculously round at the bottom in the inner corner, which looks very unnatural. Eyes are typically rounder at the top near the inner corner, and at the bottom on the outside, like so:



The 6.1 eyes are backwards.

I know the eyes are round at the bottom but that's how they were to begin with.
I guess I meant 'wide' instead of 'round' and your example is the perfect example to prove my point:



These eyes are not 'rounder' or wider on the outside. I would actually love them to have this shape, but they don't.

Sadly the Draenei female 6.0 eyes look like this:



And that's what I find so extremely annoying about them.

[3vyan]

They should really add an option to enable 6.0 models as these 6.1 are absolutely terrible.

Especially since they ruined them for sake of appeasing the "muh old models" crowd, who could just go and enable the old models.

I cannot see how this is supposed to be an improvement, just look at the damn eyes, the 6.0 ones are pretty and round, the 6.1 ones have weird shape and you can actually see the edges and the face looks flat without any delicate detail like the 6.0 one has.

As said before, this is what I want too.

Has anyone asked to add the 6.0. faces as an option?
Either make a checkbox or add them to the barber shop.

A lot of people will be pleased with the changes, but a lot of them will complain because they liked what was LIVE.

I would make a thread myself but EU doesn't get much attention

[Granyala]

Has anyone asked to add the 6.0. faces as an option?
[...] add them to the barber shop.

While I think more options are always good, I doubt Blizzard will consider adding the 6.0 faces (most esp the checkbox option), because they simply were placeholder / WIP faces.

Even now, looking at Neclords image (thanks for posting BTW!), some faces are really close (counted from the top: 1,2,4,5,6,7), others still need lots of work (3,8,10) to capture the "essence" or "personality" of the old face.
Obv. eye glow is still bugged on both models and there seem to be shading issues around the eyes on some faces.

People getting attached to the WIP faces is understandable, esp for new players that created the character that way and one reason why I don't think it was a particularly good idea to rush out all these half finished models.

[Deleted]

I think these still look better than any new draenei model:

[Nami]

I know the eyes are round at the bottom but that's how they were to begin with.

Not true at all. Put the 6.1 eyes on top of the old eyes and you'll see that the shape is completely different. The old eyes didn't have a Spider-Man shape. I would do it but I'm not at home.

Sadly the Draenei female 6.0 eyes look like this:



And that's what I find so extremely annoying about them.

A gross exaggeration. The 6.0 eyes are nowhere near that round on the outside. The only thing "wrong" with them is that they are slightly too open at the top near the outside, but they do come to a point. They still look 10x more natural than the 6.1 eyes.

- - - Updated - - -

You mixed up some of the faces in the middle. 4/5 and 7/8 should be swapped.

[Odile]

Not true at all. Put the 6.1 eyes on top of the old eyes and you'll see that the shape is completely different. The old eyes didn't have a Spider-Man shape. I would do it but I'm not at home.

I removed all color to make sure the difference was not about the wrong eyeball-color and did not edit a thing other then that. Left is the 6.1 version, middle is pre-6.0 and right is 6.0 one. Especially on this particular face the eye DOES have that shape. The 6.1 version might be slightly more extreme when it comes to the shape but it is definitely more close to the old one. There's no denying that.

- - - Updated - - -

A gross exaggeration. The 6.0 eyes are nowhere near that round on the outside. The only thing "wrong" with them is that they are slightly too open at the top near the outside, but they do come to a point. They still look 10x more natural than the 6.1 eyes.

I see I've exaggerated it a bit. The lower eyelid does go up quite a bit. But still

[Nami]

I removed all color to make sure the difference was not about the wrong eyeball-color and did not edit a thing other then that. Left is the 6.1 version, middle is pre-6.0 and right is 6.0 one. Especially on this particular face the eye DOES have that shape. The 6.1 version might be slightly more extreme when it comes to the shape but it is definitely more close to the old one. There's no denying that.

I never said that the 6.0 eyes were coser to the original than the 6.1 eyes. All I'm saying is that the 6.1 eyes are way too rounded at the bottom and too flat at the top, which makes them look like Spider-Man eyes. Draw a line from one corner to the other and you'll see what I mean:



The 6.1 eyes are way too uneven compared to the original and 6.0 eyes.

[Calith-]

Something like this would just shut down a lot of the arguments over what shape looks how. Give people more choices. The same set of animations obviously works on very different faceshapes so why not have both?

I really wish Blizzard would start working on a real variety faces when the Bloodelves are done so people can stop fighting over what single face is better for an entire race.

[Awbee]

Something like this would just shut down a lot of the arguments over what shape looks how. Give people more choices. The same set of animations obviously works on very different faceshapes so why not have both?

I really wish Blizzard would start working on a real variety faces when the Bloodelves are done so people can stop fighting over what single face is better for an entire race.

+1

Both of those look good, in different ways. They look distinctly different from one another and display different personalities. There is nothing to lose in offering both.

[3vyan]

+1

Both of those look good, in different ways. They look distinctly different from one another and display different personalities. There is nothing to lose in offering both.

Indeed.
While I prefer the first face, I would love to have the option between the two.

Can anyone create a thread on the official forum suggesting this?

[Phyrexias]

Seriously I'd love that sort of choice Calith.

The 6.0 and 6.1 faces are honestly so different from each other in terms of texture quality and facial proportions\shape that they can believably exist as separate face options.

Some people like the 6.0 faces better, some like the 6.1 better. The results of this threads poll may be skewed as there are likely people voting who didn't play female Draenei previously, but quite a lot of people liked the 6.0 faces before even if they still needed some minor adjustments.

I'm not saying they should revert what's on the PTR because obviously some people like that better, but at least give us the option to keep the current faces(and fix the damn eye glow for both the new and old models). Even if they do the model still has really weird eyes. I preferred the 6.0 'bug eyes' to the 6.1 'spiderman eyes'.

I just hate how low the quality is for the textures on the PTR models face compared to live. PTR is PTR and obviously can be subject to change, but somehow I doubt the textures are going to be fixed to match the level of quality of the live models unless the PTR goes on for several months and they actually read peoples feedback.

I still just cannot fathom why blizzard insists on every face having the exact same eye shape. Every time I see a side by side comparison of the old model, the 6.0 model, and the 6.1 model it makes me cringe. How is it possible that both of the new HD faces(live and PTR) have LESS facial variety and emotions than the decrepit 8 year old models. It simply boggles my mind.

But seriously, give us the option to keep the 6.0 faces.

[Granyala]

Something like this would just shut down a lot of the arguments over what shape looks how. Give people more choices. The same set of animations obviously works on very different faceshapes so why not have both?

Depends: if the change is in the texture it would be no problem to add them. Hell you can even easily mod your game client back to the 6.0 version.
If these changes are actual MODEL changes, then it gets more complicated, because they would have to redo the whole character selection thing.
Right now the game has 1 model file with different textures.

[3vyan]

Depends: if the change is in the texture it would be no problem to add them. Hell you can even easily mod your game client back to the 6.0 version.
If these changes are actual MODEL changes, then it gets more complicated, because they would have to redo the whole character selection thing.
Right now the game has 1 model file with different textures.

Would it be hard to make the 6.1. faces standard (character selection) and add the 6.0. faces to barbershop?

Also, I feel the 6.1. female draenei faces would make good eredar faces.
Just use these faces for eredar and give me my youthfull, HD face back please :-D

[Granyala]

Would it be hard to make the 6.1. faces standard (character selection) and add the 6.0. faces to barbershop?

If I understand correctly: Currently the game has no way of choosing a character MODEL. It does so for textures, but there is only one .m2 model file in the archive (2 one for HD, one for SD, but don't expect Blizzard to make more checkboxes).

As such an entirely new function needs to be programmed that links user choice to a certain model version, and they need to add a database variable for that.
Suffice it to say that it doesn't look like a trivial change to me, given the age of WoWs code and how much of it "is held together by duct tape". (Quoting GC here^^)

Maybe for an addon. Doubtful for a patch.

[3vyan]

Well for better or for worse, I made two threads: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...47515?page=1#0 & http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...6245?page=2#27.

Would really appreciate it if my american friends made similar threads.

There's nothing wrong with choice.

Yes the 6.1. faces resemble the old models more. However, I don't like seeing technical limitations of a 2006 model translated to a 2015 model.
I found the new draenei faces a major improvement. The faces look alive, youthful, soft and very expressive.

The 6.0. faces in my eyes are a downgrade and look less updated. The youthful, playful spirit of my main is totally gone on PTR.

To please everyone, all they got to do is give us the option of chosing between the two faces.

[Calith-]

Depends: if the change is in the texture it would be no problem to add them. Hell you can even easily mod your game client back to the 6.0 version.
If these changes are actual MODEL changes, then it gets more complicated, because they would have to redo the whole character selection thing.
Right now the game has 1 model file with different textures.

Been looking over both and the basic model seems pretty much the same, same amount of edges used to make the eye. The only immediately visible model change is that there are only 2 eyelashes by the edge instead of 3, if the third isn't just pushed under the skin. The rest seems to be done with the rig and texture.

And even if they rarely used it, they are capable of making big differences with the rig only. I really wish they would utilize it more.

Well for better or for worse, I made two threads:

Sweet!

[Nami]

Been looking over both and the basic model seems pretty much the same, same amount of edges used to make the eye. The only immediately visible model change is that there are only 2 eyelashes by the edge instead of 3, if the third isn't just pushed under the skin. The rest seems to be done with the rig and texture.

That bump at the bottom makes me want to pull on that vertex so bad. Actually, I want to move all those vertices. Why are three of them bunched up in the outer corner? Makes me mad.

[mammu2u]

Well done complainers! You took a well made expressive updated model and you bitched and moaned at it until they ruined it to shut you up. *clap... clap... clap* Really what would we do without you? What? Turning the happy excited Gnome female into a grumpy emo wasn't enough for you? DO us all a favour and just shut up and trust the experts... Your diagrams and retouched images are ridiculous and so are you. I thought Blizzard were done listening to you people after the worgen female disaster... God I wish they had...

[Every Pwny]

Well done complainers! You took a well made expressive updated model and you bitched and moaned at it until they ruined it to shut you up. *clap... clap... clap* Really what would we do without you? What? Turning the happy excited Gnome female into a grumpy emo wasn't enough for you? DO us all a favour and just shut up and trust the experts... Your diagrams and retouched images are ridiculous and so are you. I thought Blizzard were done listening to you people after the worgen female disaster... God I wish they had...

You do realize that the experts are the ones making the models, not the fans. If you don't like the models blame the people who made them probably.