I feel like I should be dealing more damage

[AdrianCC100]

On single target fights, I'm usually top 3 in DPS for my guild. When it comes to AoE fights, I'm usually in the bottom of the pack. I just finished normal Garrosh and I finished the fight with 180,000 DPS. I did have to do the engineer, but I'm 557 item level now and I feel like I'm not pulling my weight on that fight. Even when doing belts for Siege, I'm normally doing 270,000ish DPS. I don't know.. Do Hunters just not do very well in AoE fights? (I've only been playing Hunter since they allowed the free 90 boost)

My armory for those interested http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/llane/Oude/simple Just from judging my gear alone, what average DPS should I be dealing on Garrosh if I have to do Engineer. If I'm below it, then it must be my rotation and I'm doing something wrong.

[Cyrops]

Majority of our AOE dps comes from our cloak, so don't worry about it until you get it.
Make sure you are using explosive traps as well.
Also, Garrosh fight is not an aoe fight :P

[Nnug]

Majority of our AOE dps comes from our cloak

That's just untrue, most of it is from serpent spread/beastcleave

[Surfd]

Majority of our AOE dps comes from our cloak, so don't worry about it until you get it.
Make sure you are using explosive traps as well.
Also, Garrosh fight is not an aoe fight :P

One of these days I am going to learn to code LUA simply so I can design a Filter System for Recount that will filter out meter-padding baddies. Oh, you did 7000k dps on Garrosh? That's awesome, too bad that 99% of it was junk meter padding on adds....

[Jeremypwnz]

Skada has a "Damage to Enemies" > "Garrosh" so you can look at only the single target part.

[Charo]

Man you're telling me, this is my hunter: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...uffet/advanced

I used to think I did good DPS until I recently joined a new guild and my world has been shattered. I can pull around 400k DPS if I am lucky, most of the time it is around 320-350 DPS and I have no idea what I am doing wrong, I have some left over pieces to upgrade to 4/4 but I've been inactive in the last couple of months so I'm behind on VP, so I could gain a little bit there, but I don't think it is a gearing thing. :/

edit: got a new ring on Thurs. and haven't reforged yet.

[Deleted]

Especially these last few gear levels increase your dps significantly (its more from 570 to 580 than it is from 560 to 570 - numberwise. dont know about the percentages )

But, if you think you make major mistakes take a look at the fix-my-dps-thread (http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...PS-quot-Thread!)

[Nemesiz]

Skada has a "Damage to Enemies" > "Garrosh" so you can look at only the single target part.

Yeah, that way you can check how wrecked you got by the locks/warriors/rogues, good times were had. That's why I pad on adds, gonna get up on that meter yo'!

[Deleted]

Whenever some DPS shouts there ego on how great they did i often find myself quite quickly replying with damage that actually matters, we had major issues when we first got to garrosh hc in the first phase as we had some dps going all out on the 2 sets of adds and took us many wipes to finnaly convince ppl that you dont need to hit the 2nd set at all i was often mid to bottom on progression in p1 till the garrosh / weapon damage was being linked turns out our super dps that were moaning were often 60% plus on padding.

Your see it from most guilds more so in 25 man i have found that if you wanna keep up on the meters you just have to make the choice to pad or not some can do it better then others but its just the nature of the game atm to most padding = top dps hoping wod will be different

To OP 557 ilvl without the cloak your dps is fine i wouldnt stress yourself out over it gl

[AdrianCC100]

Man you're telling me, this is my hunter: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...uffet/advanced

I used to think I did good DPS until I recently joined a new guild and my world has been shattered. I can pull around 400k DPS if I am lucky, most of the time it is around 320-350 DPS and I have no idea what I am doing wrong, I have some left over pieces to upgrade to 4/4 but I've been inactive in the last couple of months so I'm behind on VP, so I could gain a little bit there, but I don't think it is a gearing thing. :/

edit: got a new ring on Thurs. and haven't reforged yet.

On single target fights, for example Malk or the boss right before Shamans (Can't think of the name off top my head) I can sustain 320,000 for a few minutes before it drops down to 290,000 to 300,000. Which is why I'm so confused why I suck so bad at multi targeting fights.

[Trictagon]

The only way we can give you any kind of helpful answer is if you have logs or specific questions, obtain logs next week if possible. Other than that, any posts would either be general suggestions that are known to be common mistakes, or just guessing what you could be doing wrong. Other than that all I can suggest from your armory is that you put on a belt tinker, and maybe use rocket boosts to get back in range of the boss faster after the engineer, as well as a glider on your cloak (not particularly useful on this fight, but it is elsewhere). Your gear is optimized well for survival, you just need to wait for your runestones. I recommend going BM when you get Ticking Ebon Detonator and cloak, or perhaps even now, to "practice" for later. I don't have much experience with engineers, nor do I know if blink strikes will work properly for bm on them; however, bm is better on most (if not all) fights this tier at higher gear levels. SV aoe is very lackluster compared to BM, even more so on burst aoe (there's a lot of that this tier).

The cloak is a significant increase across the board, but the numbers you suggest you're doing seem quite low even with that factored in. Some very generic suggestions I have for survival: make sure you are hitting explosive shot perfectly on cd, if LnL procs you spam ES (the ticks add to eachother, they do not overwrite like cata) unless both your black arrow has fallen off AND LnL is off icd (if you don't feel like tracking this, just spam ES infinitely over all else). If ES is on cd, make sure black arrow is up 100% of the time (you can refresh with 2sec remaining to carry over the last tick), make sure serpent sting is 100% uptime, gt on cd, attempt to be low enough focus for fervor to be used on cd if using it, and make sure you have enough focus ready for major abilities the instant they come off cooldown. Lastly, and more importantly, make sure you have 100% damage time and optimal gcd usage, you should ALWAYS be casting something.

About the aoe padding discussion going on, my view is the following: the difference between good players who do whatever gives them a higher chance to rank, and the bad dps who just pad mindlessly given the opportunity, is simply that good players mentally calculate the risk of wiping or causing a bad situation before doing risky things like that. If the risk is small enough to accept (or zero) there is no reason to hold back, but doing something like that when it can actually really hurt the raid (0.1% wipes on progression anyone?) is just dumb. Both DPS and damage done to the boss are irrelevant if you know the boss will die. For garrosh specifically, my guild (and I'm sure many others) is down to one phase 1 iron star, and one transition per kill (without lusting phase 2), and we've even considered the possibility of doing phase 4 with no iron star. Keeping beast cleave up for the phase 1 adds is only about a 40k~ dps loss on garrosh for a few seconds, and any extra dps on garrosh (phase 1 especially) is entirely irrelevant unless you reach a mechanic breakpoint (skipping an iron star, whirl, or transition).

[anjan011]

As a BM hunter, padding is not an issue. As BM, we can effortlessly keep up our AoE while still performing single target rotations. That's the beauty of beast cleave. all other classes has to sacrifice their single target damage more or less, but to keep up beast cleave its not an issue. like Trictagon said, pad all u want, while not hurting ur DPS on main focus + not causing any wipes for the team.

[Nemesiz]

As a BM hunter, padding is not an issue. As BM, we can effortlessly keep up our AoE while still performing single target rotations. That's the beauty of beast cleave. all other classes has to sacrifice their single target damage more or less, but to keep up beast cleave its not an issue. like Trictagon said, pad all u want, while not hurting ur DPS on main focus + not causing any wipes for the team.

Well, technically, singletarget dmg of multishot is lower than arcane shot. Ofc if the adds have to die anyway go ahead.

[anjan011]

Well, technically, singletarget dmg of multishot is lower than arcane shot. Ofc if the adds have to die anyway go ahead.

Well u cast MS once in 4 secs, not much of a bigger issue.

[AdrianCC100]

The only way we can give you any kind of helpful answer is if you have logs or specific questions, obtain logs next week if possible. Other than that, any posts would either be general suggestions that are known to be common mistakes, or just guessing what you could be doing wrong. Other than that all I can suggest from your armory is that you put on a belt tinker, and maybe use rocket boosts to get back in range of the boss faster after the engineer, as well as a glider on your cloak (not particularly useful on this fight, but it is elsewhere). Your gear is optimized well for survival, you just need to wait for your runestones. I recommend going BM when you get Ticking Ebon Detonator and cloak, or perhaps even now, to "practice" for later. I don't have much experience with engineers, nor do I know if blink strikes will work properly for bm on them; however, bm is better on most (if not all) fights this tier at higher gear levels. SV aoe is very lackluster compared to BM, even more so on burst aoe (there's a lot of that this tier).

The cloak is a significant increase across the board, but the numbers you suggest you're doing seem quite low even with that factored in. Some very generic suggestions I have for survival: make sure you are hitting explosive shot perfectly on cd, if LnL procs you spam ES (the ticks add to eachother, they do not overwrite like cata) unless both your black arrow has fallen off AND LnL is off icd (if you don't feel like tracking this, just spam ES infinitely over all else). If ES is on cd, make sure black arrow is up 100% of the time (you can refresh with 2sec remaining to carry over the last tick), make sure serpent sting is 100% uptime, gt on cd, attempt to be low enough focus for fervor to be used on cd if using it, and make sure you have enough focus ready for major abilities the instant they come off cooldown. Lastly, and more importantly, make sure you have 100% damage time and optimal gcd usage, you should ALWAYS be casting something.

About the aoe padding discussion going on, my view is the following: the difference between good players who do whatever gives them a higher chance to rank, and the bad dps who just pad mindlessly given the opportunity, is simply that good players mentally calculate the risk of wiping or causing a bad situation before doing risky things like that. If the risk is small enough to accept (or zero) there is no reason to hold back, but doing something like that when it can actually really hurt the raid (0.1% wipes on progression anyone?) is just dumb. Both DPS and damage done to the boss are irrelevant if you know the boss will die. For garrosh specifically, my guild (and I'm sure many others) is down to one phase 1 iron star, and one transition per kill (without lusting phase 2), and we've even considered the possibility of doing phase 4 with no iron star. Keeping beast cleave up for the phase 1 adds is only about a 40k~ dps loss on garrosh for a few seconds, and any extra dps on garrosh (phase 1 especially) is entirely irrelevant unless you reach a mechanic breakpoint (skipping an iron star, whirl, or transition).

I have been meaning to put tinkers on my items, I just keep forgetting about it. lol

[Nemesiz]

Well u cast MS once in 4 secs, not much of a bigger issue.

I'm just saying. Some likes to pad on Amber Parasites on Klaxxi i.e. =]

[anjan011]

I'm just saying. Some likes to pad on Amber Parasites on Klaxxi i.e. =]

ah yes, true that

[AdrianCC100]

I reforged, even though I don't have the optimal trinkets for Beast Master. I don't notice a big difference. Maybe I just need the trinket to see the difference. I guess the only difference I can see is that with Beast Master, I'm bursting to 800,000 damage at the beginning of fights. Where as Survival, the highest I got was around 690,000. However, over time BM and Survival sit around the same sustained damage. I've been messing around in LFR/Flex/Normal and depending on my RNG, either Survival does more or BM does more. I personally fail to see a clear winner in DPS.

[anjan011]

I reforged, even though I don't have the optimal trinkets for Beast Master. I don't notice a big difference. Maybe I just need the trinket to see the difference. I guess the only difference I can see is that with Beast Master, I'm bursting to 800,000 damage at the beginning of fights. Where as Survival, the highest I got was around 690,000. However, over time BM and Survival sit around the same sustained damage. I've been messing around in LFR/Flex/Normal and depending on my RNG, either Survival does more or BM does more. I personally fail to see a clear winner in DPS.

Only time u will notice difference is where there r multiple targets close together and can be cleaved. in such cases, due to beast cleave's OPness, BM will have better numbers than sv.

[Coradox]

Survival is better at low itemlevel, and more reliable on dmg, because of your pet, i mean if you don't have excellent knowlage of the fights and how do they work to adapt with your pet as BM, they stick with playing survival. When you get some gear and when you're comfy with fights then play whatever you want .