Why is the Alliance fanbase so upset with Blizzard?

[Daralii]

New NPC they added to Stormshield makes it seem like they don't see the issue with the faction being ruled and centered around humans and humans exclusively. GG

[Fayolynn]

New NPC they added to Stormshield makes it seem like they don't see the issue with the faction being ruled and centered around humans and humans exclusively. GG

waaaaa? o.O That must be placeholder text

- - - Updated - - -

Me....trolling......
Well, yea, that sounds about right ^_^

But, i was being serious when i say "A vocal minority of the alliance fan base like to play as the victim". I'm kind of reminded of the "boy that cried wolf", expect it's the "boy who cried victim" and when he does everyone else rolls their eyes saying "oh, what's wrong with you now?".
Although my biggest issues with playing the victim card that often is it reflects on the Alliance community as a whole and the Alliance are anything but victims.

I don't see how pointing out Blizzards short comings, some of which they have admitted to, is playing the victim card.

Back to twilight highlands intro.

The Horde has one, the Alliance doesn't. Blizzard has admitted that hey ran out of time to give the Alliance an intro, said fuck it and released the game with the Horde having an intro and the Alliance not. They also said it wasn't worth their time to add one. Complaining about that isn't playing the victim card, that is a company showing a form of preferential treatment.

Playing the victim card would be if they gave both factions an intro of relatively equal quality, but you do like the one your faction got so you complain that the company hates your faction.

[Hellrime]

I play horde. BUT
i would pref to raid SW and destroy their shit and their leaders instead of ours.
It feels kinda stupid going into org after you cleared SoO and be like "hmm, garrosh is there... so is the shamans, nazgrim is still being a jerk... oh well".
Tho i do like slapping garrosh in the butt week after week.

But the whole horde bias thing. Isnt that discussion abit overrater now?
People keep saying blizz loves horde and hates alliance, but how do they came up with it? only cause of a raid + a chopper challenge where VOTING was involved?

I would really want to know what horde has that alliance doesnt or have never had.
oh and fyi, the bitching about teh choppers etc is no longer needed since you got your wasp mount, grats ^^

This is a great example of why I don't play Horde. "Yea the Horde are so QT, and evil, and punk rawk! Bleh! /Miley Cyrus tongue out face". Nothing of what you said added to the conversation. Not to mention, for the billionth time, WHAT THE HELL DID THE ALLIANCE DESTROY IN ORGRIMMAR? It still looks the exact same. Also, WHICH LEADER DID WE KILL? We didn't kill him, he went on a time traveling adventure. In retrospect Horde and Alliance killed Arthas and if anyone should have been redeemed it was him. Not that pile of garbage and bad writing Garrosh.

[Abajaba]

As in..this? -guypostsurlhere-

Seems Horde lost an awful lit. Then again..wasn't there a thread recently how ppl never let get facts in the way of what they perceive to be true?

My favorite part from the link:
Additionally – and of far greater importance – Gilneas not only adds a new core zone to the ranks of the Alliance, it opens up a second front one of the few regions of the world where the Forsaken were making real, substantial gains for the Horde.

[Talen]

Making mountains out of mole-hills and acting like toddlers every time everything doesn't go their way (Every time I hear the term "Choppergate", I die a little inside).

Because Robot cat was such a great sign of Blizzards attention to the Alliance...yes?

Alliance players have essentially gone for four years...more even....with little or no growth or development in their faction. And what has been attempted has more often than not backfired, spectacularly.

Blizzard too often played cards such as "Lets have the 7th Legion as targets to make the Horde feel good and epic" or Lets have the Alliance been seen as comedic incompetents to explain their defeat" or "Lets have the Alliance victory end with a retreat"

As pointed out...the problem here is Blizzards active neglect of the faction. The Alliance has plenty of potential for stories.

They just aren't used. Worse...many of them are effectively closed down without being used.

Part of the reason for that neglect is due to the story Blizzard decided to tell. A story based on a Horde invasion, a story based on a Horde civil war - by necessity, those stories ARE going to focus on Horde growth, Horde actions, Horde development.

Part of the reason is due to time; Blizzard arguably bit off more than it could chew with the way it handled Cataclysm. With not enough resources to do the job they wanted before release, something had to be cut. And because the story necessitated a Horde focus, that meant that not only was Horde content finished first, but Alliance content was also less important while also needing most work to finish. If something needed to be cut, Alliance content was a prime candidate...and it was cut in droves.

But Blizzard itself needs to bear much of the responsibility. It didn't need to create that story. That story had obvious downsides that were pointed out time and time again...and Blizzard still went ahead.

Blizzard didn't need to put so much focus on the Horde storyline; it could have developed the Alliance story as well. There is no reason 5.3 couldn't have been told from the Alliances points of view, with the story revolving around the Alliances landing in Durotar to find Vol'jins rebellion in trouble and then supporting it for their own ends. The excuse that the Alliance didn't need a story because they already had reason to fight Garrosh - utterly wrong, as they have reason to fight the entire Horde, including VJs little rebellion - isn't really acceptable.

Sure - Blizzard would have needed to update the zone for that storyline. But that update needed be only a few NPCs. They were willing to change the Barrens to reflect the Horde storyline - but not willing to do the same for an Alliance story.

You do NOT give one faction in WOW all the attention and retain the right to act surprised that the other is upset that they too didn't get voiced cutscenes, battles, epic moments, interaction with their faction leaders and heroes, faction growth and development or story progression - only the feeling that they were simply shoehorned into the other factions story out of sheer laziness.

Blizzard could have paid more attention to HOW the story played out for both sides. The Purge could have, indeed should have, been an Alliance focussed patch, to counter balance the attention the Horde was getting. Whatever Blizzards intentions, it ended on a hugely negative note with Alliance players being told off.

And all this leads to the perception, right or wrong, of bias. Alliance victories are downplayed. Alliance content often has little stings in the tail that do nothing but negate their pride and joy in the story, or the Alliance content doesn't exist at all. The Alliance stories aren't reflected in the gameworld, while their defeats are. The Alliance all too often are treated as adjuncts of the Horde....the feeling that they exist merely to act as something for Horde stories and players to hook into is very real. Alliance content is cut, the Horde content isn't. The Alliance is shoehorned into Horde stories blurring all distinction between the two. And so on.

There is no sign of balance here. Regardless of the reasons, there is no Horde content that is being seen as cut. The Goblins were given full access to their story and launched with viabale models. The Horde got their intro the the Twilight Highlands used. The Horde kept their intro into the Red Dragon storyline instead of being shoehorned into the Alliance story. They Horde armies were not made to look like fools while the Alliance even lost to NPCs.

And so on.

Ultimately (and simplistically) - the Horde changes the world through its own action, but the Alliance has its world changed by the actions of others. Horde players get to play through stories where what they do has an impact, where what they do matters while Alliance players all too often get to play through stories where what they do doesn't matter, where their contribution to the story feels meaningless. The Horde has an impact on the story, but the Alliance feels more like an irrelevance - the difference between planning and taking part in an actual war, and planning and taking part in a wedding.

I am not saying us Alliance do not have grounds to be upset but the most vocal are doing it the wrong way and over the wrong things.

The problem here is simple - many Alliance players are getting fed up with Blizzards inept handling of the Alliance story, their apparent bias, their presumed favoritism. They do not appreciate being in game merely to provide the Horde something to do.

The biggest problem is that while Alliance players know they aren't getting what they want, many simply can't really articulate it. Likewise, Blizzard knows its mishandled the Alliance story...but it doesn't appear to have a clue how to fix it. And the way the story in WOD is developing for the Alliance...that isn't going to change.

And while the story may not be as immediately important as gameplay, story is about all WoW has that other MMOs - MMOs with similar gameplay, new twists and vastly better graphics - that other MMOs does not have. The impact of a bad storyline isn't felt immediately...there is time to correct it...but it is felt. And it is taking less and less to spur Alliance players into action.

Your "mountains out of molehills" comment is accurate to a degree....but it is the result of several years of near total neglect for the faction, and the Alliance is at the point where it doesn't take much to set them off. What would have passed without comment two years ago is now enough to set off a mini backlash.

Now, that isn't the only issues involved...we all know that players are also getting fed up with the continued focus on humans. On the terrible depiction of Anduin...who is coming across more as a faction traitor than the moral light Blizzard no doubt wants him to be. On having Thrall be shoehorned into near everything at the expense of other characters, even when he doesn't fit the story. And so on.

And we can't ignore that the Horde has issues as well. Garrosh should not have been deposed and...being honest...if the storyline had to follow the same path, Orgirmmar should have been the last place the raid was set. Garrosh should have built himself a new capital, one the Alliance COULD occupy and one the Horde wouldn't have minded raiding.

And these are issues Blizzard should have seen and should have addressed years ago. Everyone else did.

As it is, we can hope things will change in WoD, that the Alliance will get the focus and story it deserves. So far, that doesn't look like it is the case. But we can hope.

EJL

[Dura]

Great post Talen. Really great post.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

Great post Talen. Really great post.

I agree. I think its very hard to argue with his post.

[Fayolynn]

Well said Talen

[JudgePayne]

I swear to god watch blizzcon, I feel like printing this out and asking questions during the Q&A.

If people make an accurate list of questions I will ask them during the game development Q&A or the lore/story Q&A.

[Deleted]

I swear to god watch blizzcon, I feel like printing this out and asking questions during the Q&A.

If people make an accurate list of questions I will ask them during the game development Q&A or the lore/story Q&A.

1) Why does the horde story always take precedence over the alliance story? I.E Twilight Highlands, Robot Cat, High King of the Alliance?

2) Why is it that so many Horde victories are shown in game, yet Alliance needs to read the books?

3) Do you feel like you handled Thrall's supposed neutrality badly?

4) If there were any racial leaders who needed to be killed off, who would be your first choice for the chopping block?

5) Will we ever see a focus on Night Elves or Gilnean's as alliance hero's?

6) You say it is to much effort to put alliance victories in game, yet you don't shy away from their losses because it's "to much effort", such as Westfall and Theramore. Why?

7) What was the so called "Fist-bump" moment?

[Highlord Hanibuhl]

Great post Talen!

Now let's hope Blizzard listens to this and not fuck up yet again.

Inb4 Hordies crying over Talen's post

[JudgePayne]

1) Why does the horde story always take precedence over the alliance story? I.E Twilight Highlands, Robot Cat, High King of the Alliance?

2) Why is it that so many Horde victories are shown in game, yet Alliance needs to read the books?

3) Do you feel like you handled Thrall's supposed neutrality badly?

4) If there were any racial leaders who needed to be killed off, who would be your first choice for the chopping block?

5) Will we ever see a focus on Night Elves or Gilnean's as alliance hero's?

6) You say it is to much effort to put alliance victories in game, yet you don't shy away from their losses because it's "to much effort", such as Westfall and Theramore. Why?

7) What was the so called "Fist-bump" moment?

As you are pretty much allowed max two questions I would ask question questions 1+2 but combine them into one question about the overall alliance protrail quests and victories.

second I would ask question three but give them an example.

So How do you think you have handled Thrall's neutrality vs Khadgars Neutrality. i.e. Thrall even when neutral is very involved in the horde storyline and takes an advisor role to the horde where as Khadgar is a truely neutral character even though he was plugged as being the alliance go to guy.

[Orrin]

There could be 5.3 series of quests for Alliance for epic taking back of Ashenvale and building staging ground for siege of Orgrimmar, there could be military defense of some zones from Horde in Cata, there could be Twighlight Highlands intro and outro (there's no logical ending for the zone, we spend all time gather dwarven clans and then there's wedding, after that we go to help SI7 head to do things at Twightlight Hammer base like dwarves didn't matter at all; it's not an outro).

[JudgePayne]

There could be 5.3 series of quests for Alliance for epic taking back of Ashenvale and building staging ground for siege of Orgrimmar, there could be military defense of some zones from Horde in Cata, there could be Twighlight Highlands intro and outro (there's no logical ending for the zone, we spend all time gather dwarven clans and then there's wedding, after that we go to help SI7 head to do things at Twightlight Hammer base like dwarves didn't matter at all; it's not an outro).

They already said the twlight highlands zone was rushed for the alliance.
Ashenvale has always been an area of contention. especially now that malfurion is back and should be minding these sacred lands but .......

[Wyrt]

New NPC they added to Stormshield makes it seem like they don't see the issue with the faction being ruled and centered around humans and humans exclusively. GG

It's pretty obvious they don't give a crap when they put all the guards in Stormshield in Stormwind footman armor, they don't have to go making jokes about it.

[Talen]

1) Why does the horde story always take precedence over the alliance story?

Because Blizzard wanted to put the war back into Warcraft. It **SHOULD** have had the Alliance start the war. After the events in Wrathgate and what Sylvanas was doing, they had more than enough excuse. Instead, they decided to have the Horde start it, taking advantage of the Cataclysm whilst the Alliance was supposedly dealing with the aftermath and focussing on Deathwing.

Nothing inherently wrong with that - but Blizzard cut a LOT of Alliance content due to time and resource issues. We lost the Worgen Forsaken war. The Worgen models were glitched and incomplete. The Twilight Highlands intro was cut. The Alliance intro to the Redoubt was replaced by simply shoving them into the Horde intro. Various quests and storylines were not completed or left with rushed endings. And so on.

I.E Twilight Highlands, Robot Cat, High King of the Alliance?

TH - time. RC - haven't got a clue why they did it that way. HK - they weren't happy with the reaction to the Dwarf and NElf storylines. The reactions was understandable - instead of building Varian up, they tore the other leaders down.

2) Why is it that so many Horde victories are shown in game, yet Alliance needs to read the books?

Because in a Horde dominated story, the Horde systems get done first.

3) Do you feel like you handled Thrall's supposed neutrality badly?

Actually? I don't think they did.....in that he never came across as neutral. Thralls big problems is the way he is shoved into stories that don't concern him, where he gets spotlighted without cause. For example, there isn't any way you can excuse the focus he had in the Firelands patch. That ***SHOULD** have been the NElfs and Malfurion storyline. Even the Dark Irons had a better claim to be involved, given their enslavement for 200 years.

4) If there were any racial leaders who needed to be killed off, who would be your first choice for the chopping block?

Malfurion - race traitor that he is. Tyrande needs to kick him and his druids out and reassert control over "neutral" NElfs lands such as Moonglade.
Velen - not necessarily killed, but removed. The Draenei need a revolution to replace him with someone more active.

The rest simply need to be used, and used properly.

On the Horde side? Sylvanas. Her story is done, and shes holding back that of the Horde and Forsaken.
Thrall....there is too much focus on him and he's used far too often.

5) Will we ever see a focus on Night Elves or Gilnean's as alliance hero's?

Hopefully.

7) What was the so called "Fist-bump" moment?

Dalaran. Pity the Alliance players ended up getting told off by the King while the Horde got to run through an epic jail break /rescue story.

EJL

[Aktavite]

As in..this? http://www.google.de/imgres?imgurl=h...9QEwAQ&dur=480

Seems Horde lost an awful lit. Then again..wasn't there a thread recently how ppl never let get facts in the way of what they perceive to be true?

That post does take certain liberties...

[Heldamon]

So Alliance is fucked again in this regard. Great

Actually that sounds like anyone who isn't Orc is fucked up!

[Mormolyce]

Actually? I don't think they did.....in that he never came across as neutral. Thralls big problems is the way he is shoved into stories that don't concern him, where he gets spotlighted without cause. For example, there isn't any way you can excuse the focus he had in the Firelands patch. That ***SHOULD** have been the NElfs and Malfurion storyline. Even the Dark Irons had a better claim to be involved, given their enslavement for 200 years.

What are you talking about? He's leader of the Earthen Ring and one of the most powerful Shaman in the world. Of course it concerned him.

You might as well say the Lich King didn't concern Tirion Fordring.

[Highlord Hanibuhl]

What are you talking about? He's leader of the Earthen Ring and one of the most powerful Shaman in the world. Of course it concerned him.

You might as well say the Lich King didn't concern Tirion Fordring.

Because Blizzard made him green Jesus... He's turning into Me'dan