Wrath's Flying Model = Perfect

[whynotchris]

In Wrath of the Lich King, one of your characters had to reach max level to acquire flight. After doing so, a BOA book was purchasable from the flight trainer to learn flight on your alts at level 77 (3 levels below Max at the time, and 9 levels after the minimum requirement for access to Northrend).

**I do NOT remember if this was instilled at launch or if a patch instigated this**

** EDIT added thanks to poster. Flight was available from a trainer on your first max level character as of level 77 - Point of post remains valid despite error**

+It provided a gold sink.

+It made players experience the content from the ground as intended by designers.

+It provided an advantage to Altaholics while not detracting anything from players who do not play alts.

+It would give Blizzard ample time to reasonably have flight available in WoD.

Why is this model seemingly being ignored? It it is a great compromise between several point-of-views regarding flight in WoW.

[iamthedevil]

Actually, you got it at 77. The book wasn't added until a later patch. Stormpeaks required a flying mount.

[whynotchris]

Ah! Yes, I remember now.
I think my point remains valid - at least the notion of it.

[Renedric]

Nothing's being ignored, they're testing alternatives (aka. no flying).

[jsz]

+It made players experience the content from the ground as intended by designers.

For about two days.

[Mormolyce]

I think the idea of making flying a big gold sink didn't make much sense before and even less now. It's a barrier for more casual players and no barrier at all for the rich - it's asymmetric and kind of arbitrary.

I actually like the idea of WoD's model, where you have to do a quest chain and it doesn't unlock for a patch.

Actually, you got it at 77. The book wasn't added until a later patch. Stormpeaks required a flying mount.

There was a loaner mount though, IIRC, so you technically didn't need it.

[mickybrighteyes]

wow has never had a perfect model of flying, unless you count the perfect model of how to NOT do flying.

[Calamari]

They should introduce permits for the legal use of the word perfect. And never. And always. Or better yet throw them into the fires of Mordor.

On-topic: I kind of dig what MoP did, make us see everything up close before taking off to the air.

[whynotchris]

For about two days.

What's wrong with that? As long as it's experienced in a ground-based, predictable way what does it matter the time spent?

I understand several reasons why Blizzard would want the content experienced from the ground. Personally, I don't care if the entirety of WoD remains grounded. But it seems a silly, small, and easily compromised aspect of an expansion.

[Lothaeryn]

Ever fought a mob elite and halfway through the fight some guy swoops down and ganks you out of nowhere, then proceeds to camp your corpse from the safety of the air?

Yea, while Wrath was a really good model in terms of unlocking flying, it still had issues, I'd rather have the chance to gank back or hunt down a ganker than have him fly high and mighty in the sky safe from repercussion. One thing kiss from vanilla is tracking down a guy who ganked me and making his day miserable.

Of course, this is from a PvP perspective, flying is nice, but I don't think it is absolutely necessary to be available in the current expansion, it quickens logistics far too quickly for gameplay and ground based.threats to be meaningful.

[jsz]

What's wrong with that? As long as it's experienced in a ground-based, predictable way what does it matter the time spent?

I understand several reasons why Blizzard would want the content experienced from the ground. Personally, I don't care if the entirety of WoD remains grounded. But it seems a silly, small, and easily compromised aspect of an expansion.

Because applying Wrath's flying model to Warlords would undermine all the work they've done out in the world. You'll level without a mount, sure, and see some of the content once, but once you hit 100 you'll be zipping around the skies, completely missing all the little events and things to see and collect that they've tucked into the smallest caves and crevices.

[whynotchris]

Ever fought a mob elite and halfway through the fight some guy swoops down and ganks you out of nowhere, then proceeds to camp your corpse from the safety of the air?

Sir/Ma'am,

I have always thought PVP servers should not have flight beyond FP's. But, it won't happen, it's as foolhardy as my belief PVP and PVE talents should be separated.

Of course, this is from a PvP perspective, flying is nice, but I don't think it is absolutely necessary to be available in the current expansion, it quickens logistics far too quickly for gameplay and ground based.threats to be meaningful.

- - - Updated - - -

Because applying Wrath's flying model to Warlords would undermine all the work they've done out in the world. You'll level without a mount, sure, and see some of the content once, but once you hit 100 you'll be zipping around the skies, completely missing all the little events and things to see and collect that they've tucked into the smallest caves and crevices.

Players who value that will experience it. For example, my SO enjoys reading ALL quest text and getting everything out of a zone while I am impatient and just mow through, while going back later to experience it when I'm bored in game.

But there are players who never care if they experience it. You don't /need/ to know lore and story to play and people who chose to eliminate that aspect of the game (even though they're cheapening their own game-play!) should have the right to do so.

[Theendgamelv3]

Because applying Wrath's flying model to Warlords would undermine all the work they've done out in the world. You'll level without a mount, sure, and see some of the content once, but once you hit 100 you'll be zipping around the skies, completely missing all the little events and things to see and collect that they've tucked into the smallest caves and crevices.

That's for the player to decide if they want to explore that or not. I know I don't want to explore the ground after I hit 100 cause there is no point for me and the people who do care about those small caves and stuff wouldn't fly anyways.

[Seramore]

Ever fought a mob elite and halfway through the fight some guy swoops down and ganks you out of nowhere, then proceeds to camp your corpse from the safety of the air?

Flying doesn't have much to do with that, because stuff like that has happened since the game came out.

[whynotchris]

They should introduce permits for the legal use of the word perfect. And never. And always. Or better yet throw them into the fires of Mordor.

On-topic: I kind of dig what MoP did, make us see everything up close before taking off to the air.

Firstly, I used perfect because it would get peoples' attention and it TOTALLY did. (mwahahahah)

I liked MoP's design for my first 90, not my next three. I read everything, I experienced all that I wanted to (wow gives what you put into it and lore is interesting to me) but my following 90 alts - not having flight was just a nuisance. I hit "accept" and "complete" as quickly as I could. Not giving them flight simply prolonged the experience.

In hindsight from my OP, I'd like Wrath and MoP combined. You get flight accessible through purchase when you reach max.

[kargar]

That's for the player to decide if they want to explore that or not. I know I don't want to explore the ground after I hit 100 cause there is no point for me and the people who do care about those small caves and stuff wouldn't fly anyways.

The problem with that is most people will skip the content then bitch that there is nothing to do bliz have spent time and money on making more content in the open world and now want people to try it instead of being like a spoiled child and saying i don't want it and then being hungry half a hour later.

[whynotchris]

The problem with that is most people will skip the content then bitch that there is nothing to do bliz have spent time and money on making more content in the open world and now want people to try it instead of being like a spoiled child and saying i don't want it and then being hungry half a hour later.

Really, there is nothing Blizzard or any of us can do about this. The idea of valuing WoW for its lore or anything aside from end content and not just spamming for purples is a far-gone notion. Today, WoW has a broader market than Vanilla's hardcore devotes who would sink tens of hours into it for perfection. There's nothing we can do about that and we shouldn't want to. More interest = more subs = more money for Blizz to sink into the game and improve it. You can't force lore onto players. They'll just click Accept and Complete as fast as they would had it been any other button and breeze through.

The difference is the more often they have to do that, the more frustrated they'll become with the experience and the less likely they'll be to repeat or complete it.

[kargar]

Really, there is nothing Blizzard or any of us can do about this. The idea of valuing WoW for its lore or anything aside from end content and not just spamming for purples is a far-gone notion. Today, WoW has a broader market than Vanilla's hardcore devotes who would sink tens of hours into it for perfection. There's nothing we can do about that and we shouldn't want to. More interest = more subs = more money for Blizz to sink into the game and improve it. You can't force lore onto players. They'll just click Accept and Complete as fast as they would had it been any other button and breeze through.

The difference is the more often they have to do that, the more frustrated they'll become with the experience and the less likely they'll be to repeat or complete it.

Better that then them finishing it in 10 hours and sitting there till 6.1 saying blizz are dumb and cheep. they cant win either way but at least they can show people the content and who knows maby some will enjoy it and relise there is more to the game then rushing level 100 and sitting in org/sw speaking shit about the game they PAY $15 a month to play.

[Orangetai420]

I think the WoD model is a great design.

IMO they should do the opposite of what they do now; there should be a select few zones that are designed for flying (think zones like Netherstorm with lots of floating islands).

Everything else (going forward) should be for ground mounts; let people fly in the old content zones because the damage is already done. Flying around is so boring, you don't see any of the beautiful landscapes, you just check your map and turn on autorun. It takes away from the immersion. We should be excited when we get a flying zone, it shouldn't be a given.

This probably isn't the popular opinion but as a veteran player I personally think it would be a good change.

TL DR: Immersion > Convenience.

[whynotchris]

I think the WoD model is a great design.

IMO they should do the opposite of what they do now; there should be a select few zones that are designed for flying (think zones like Netherstorm with lots of floating islands).

This is a GREAT idea. Again, I'd like to stress to people who are actually following and reading the thread that I am in favor of grounding WoW. But there seems to be so much dissidence over flight that I don't see why a compromise of some form shouldn't be made.