1. #5361
    So you're saying that he should be left below 60% consistently to ensure that its proc rate is increased? again from a progression standpoint that seems ludicrous.

  2. #5362
    Quote Originally Posted by Sepelio View Post
    So you're saying that he should be left below 60% consistently to ensure that its proc rate is increased? again from a progression standpoint that seems ludicrous.
    If you're using it efficiently, yes.

  3. #5363
    Its the simcraft notion of X proccing under ideal situations will achieve X, whereas if you're not tanking the trinket is literally an empty slot, and optimising it requires being for lack of a better way of saying it, less than optimal, making yourself take more damage by prolonged uptime, when nearly every other class would do this aspect better, and then sitting below the threshold, once you have a mythic one and the threshold is 80% i think its alot better across the board, because even a sotr mitigated swing will proc it, but until then its just eh.

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    Efficiently from what perspective, pure proc uptime? for the raid as a whole it would be entirely inefficient to do that, you'd require more healing than another class doing the same job, and in a riskier scenario.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Unfortunately it is completely another one of those perfect scenario trinkets, which just like sims, are never remotely realistic to expect.

  4. #5364
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    i was testing it the other day and i actually could not get it to proc again unless i went back over the trinket's specified threshold of HP. for example, when i was at the training dummy, i tryed to keep myself at 40% and see if it would proc off damage after 12 seconds, waited a minute but nothing but insight and SS was keeping me up. so you actually have to get back up to have it do a heal or damage.


    BTW the damage also seems to scale with resolve but im not too sure on that one.

  5. #5365
    Damage doesn't scale with resolve.

  6. #5366
    Quote Originally Posted by Lazel View Post
    meanwhile no 1 plays prot pala
    Been gone for over a year. Curious what the problems are right now with prot, since I heard this reflected elsewhere as well.

  7. #5367
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sepelio View Post
    Damage doesn't scale with resolve.
    coulda fooled me, but considering i can unequip my other trinket and force a no proc scenario but it goes up to 300k crits when the baseline is 90k for normal, im gona keep assuming it IS scaling with resolve.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rewyn View Post
    Been gone for over a year. Curious what the problems are right now with prot, since I heard this reflected elsewhere as well.
    low EHP, active mitigation cannot be used all the time thus that low EHP means getting a direct hit will nearly kill you on mythic. our survivability is based on being able to keep SotR up as much as possible ( rng aka unreliable) blocking ( pure rng here and unreliable) and be healing for a bunch of small amounts over time ( which wont work if you die in the next swing)

    basically, we can only sort of control our own survival which is bad for progression and on top of this for a side kick, we do the lowest dps as well.

  8. #5368
    Quote Originally Posted by Sepelio View Post
    Efficiently from what perspective, pure proc uptime? for the raid as a whole it would be entirely inefficient to do that, you'd require more healing than another class doing the same job, and in a riskier scenario.
    Can you please explain to me, how taking same amount of damage, and doing more healing, results in requiring more healing ?
    I'm genuinely interested.

    Quote Originally Posted by Reghame View Post
    coulda fooled me, but considering i can unequip my other trinket and force a no proc scenario but it goes up to 300k crits when the baseline is 90k for normal, im gona keep assuming it IS scaling with resolve.
    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...01&view=events
    + http://puu.sh/iKluN/8f23fcf782.png

    Looks like it scales with AP but not resolve.

  9. #5369
    All you haters complaining about Prot Paladins and Treckie hardly notices.

    Some selfless, righteous individuals have been plaintively pointing out since the PTR that the 2p/Trink actually specifically target Prot Paladins' apparent deficiencies (Low EHP, low damage output). But most of the feedback in this thread has been petulant whining about the 4p and pointing to obvious bugs (eg the trink not appearing in logs).

    When GMs and raid leaders of mid-tier guilds have only the prevailing sentiment to go by (i.e. you haters), we get told to reroll. So congrats on poisoning the well. I sure would like to try out Savior's Boon on live, I guess I'll have to wait for alt clears in a few months.
    Last edited by Fusoya; 2015-07-02 at 06:15 AM.

  10. #5370
    Why quote me then ignore half of the quote celina? The only way to maximise the trinket is to remain below the threshold every time the proc becomes available, meaning on most encounters you'd have to make your offtank a taunt bot for debuffs, meaning you'd be tanking the vast majority, where we as prot paladins are far from the best class to do as such. I specified more healing than another class, not more healing. Compare yourself tanking 85% of the time to a guardian or a DK, especially when you're now required to sit below 69% hp constantly to ensure it procs. How viable is it on progression to be like "Let me constantly sit at 70% hp so my trinket can proc"

    The point of it is, Prot paladins aren't great main tanks currently, we serve pretty amazingly as offtanks, but we definitely do not shine on prolonged tanking scenarios compared to the stronger classes, and to maximise this trinket you require your healers effectively letting you sit at 70% hp constantly, which with bosses hitting for 300-350k on mythic, seems like a rather dangerous place to remain for the entirety of an encounter. As i said, the trinket has its place, its just not first, rarely second.

  11. #5371
    Ah...well then I think I'll stick to the game I'm in. It's a shame that after so long, Blizzard can't balance things. In fact reading this reminded me of how bad they are about certain specs being godly and others being trash patch to patch..

  12. #5372
    Quote Originally Posted by Fusoya View Post
    All you haters complaining about Prot Paladins and Treckie hardly notices.

    Some selfless, righteous individuals have been plaintively pointing out since the PTR that the 2p/Trink actually specifically target Prot Paladins' apparent deficiencies (Low EHP, low damage output). But most of the feedback in this thread has been petulant whining about the 4p and pointing to obvious bugs (eg the trink not appearing in logs).

    When GMs and raid leaders of mid-tier guilds have only the prevailing sentiment to go by (i.e. you haters), we get told to reroll. So congrats on poisoning the well. I sure would like to try out Savior's Boon on live, I guess I'll have to wait for alt clears in a few months.
    It's funny that you think good Heroic logs mean Prot Paladins aren't underpowered.

    Looking forwards to your feedback when you'll get instagibbed in Mythic as we did during BRF because none of the issues of Prot Paladins are fixed. The 4pc IS shit, and adding 10% HPS to our self-healing won't fix anything (2pc).
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  13. #5373
    I feel a little dirty for saying this but I kinda enjoy not being insta gibbed while playing my new bear tank...

  14. #5374
    I played my warrior yesterday and got the WUE. I felt invicible when I dropped to 30% and stay there for 10sec without dieing on Enraged Fel lord Zakuun.
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  15. #5375
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Ausr View Post
    I feel a little dirty for saying this but I kinda enjoy not being insta gibbed while playing my new bear tank...
    Playing a Bear on Council/Kilrogg feels like cheating.
    In a really positive way.

    ( Also Paragon running 2x Guardian tanks for the lulz. )

  16. #5376
    Deleted
    Early days, but Bares are being more popular than paladins in heroic HFC according to warcraftlogs. Mayhaps the buffs from bears and complaints from paladins (which don't really apply to heroic to be fair) are taking hold?

  17. #5377
    Can safely say WUE is a pretty solid trinket choice.

    Was sceptical at first, but thought i'd try it out. Was my top source of healing/absorb for every fight basically.

    Unsure about class trinket pre-heroic though, as the HP threshold just seems a bit too low to be valueable?

  18. #5378
    Deleted
    WUE seems good now but surely when tanks get their rings they won't need it that much longer? It kinda serves the purpose of being a nice thing that saves your life personally, and the tank ring will also do that. Surely kormok or veltari trinket is better alongside maybe class trinket or anzu?

  19. #5379
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Kortiah View Post
    It's funny that you think good Heroic logs mean Prot Paladins aren't underpowered.

    Looking forwards to your feedback when you'll get instagibbed in Mythic as we did during BRF because none of the issues of Prot Paladins are fixed. The 4pc IS shit, and adding 10% HPS to our self-healing won't fix anything (2pc).
    I'd just ignore him, honestly. The post is nothing but self-righteous flamebait.

    We get it, Fusoya. You're a genius and prot paladin is fine just like you've been saying all along. There's definitely no issue with HC Archimonde swinging for more than 2/3rds of our max HP when we take an unmitigated hit (320k melee hits, yup) and that's definitely not going to be a recurring problem in Mythic at all.

    Maybe if you had listened instead of whinging self-righteously you'd have seen what we've actually been saying ever since PTR testing of bosses - we're still not in a great place, our tier bonuses are meh, but Holy Shield makes us significantly stronger than we were in BRF where we were an outright liability, and because there are more fights than in BRF where Holy Shield shines, we have more fights in HFC where we don't suck. The fact that we're now playable without the entire raid having to compensate for our deficiencies doesn't change the fact that we're still bottomfeeding together with the other plate tanks.

  20. #5380
    Quote Originally Posted by cetraben View Post
    Can safely say WUE is a pretty solid trinket choice.

    Was sceptical at first, but thought i'd try it out. Was my top source of healing/absorb for every fight basically.
    I got it on my warrior yesterday and got very surprised too. I wasn't sure about it since Haste is very subpar for warriors, but I felt so much stronger with WUE+TTT than BFD+TTT, I'm not sure why.

    Looking at the logs, it did about 1M absorb every fight (Gorefiend, Iskar, Zakuun, NM Archimonde), for about 4-5K HPS, but I FELT a lot stronger... Does anyone know if the trinket is reported correctly in the logs? It might have something to do with the reduction getting stronger the lower you get, hence giving a different feeling, but although the numbers definitely don't seem impressive, the results clearly surprised me.
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