Thread: Buffs are here!

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  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by Pur1tas View Post
    You are crying about resto shamans? you obviously are a really bad healer. We do great heals on 6/7 fights in HM as the groups are stacked up at least 80% of the fights. If you are not you are just not playing it in a way to benefit your healers.
    Since I'm constantly ranked on heroic (now mythic) fights during progression since BC, most of the time with several healer classes, I can tell you one thing: restoration is not in a bad place in terms of "you and your friends won't complete the raid until the next patch". Sure, you can get stuff done.
    But almost any other class can do it better. Restoration got no forte at the moment, and in an environment where the first thing you do to progress is to cut one or two healers because you need the DPS, a class which got no forte is just useless.

    We can't spam AoE and the singletargetheals are lackluster. The "strong point" of restoration atm is addcontrol - and this is a niche which imposes a problem. Because you can't buff heals without breaking PvP. This is the reason shamans are the sole healing class without a tank-CD. And no, SLT, doesn't make it. On the obvious side, if you got enough time to move into range, your tank isn't in dire need of it. On the other side, adding more people to the cluttered melee-area is most of the time detrimental. And no, the bugged projection won't help at all.
    Guess what, the speedbuff with UL (and echo) might be the very reason shamans are now so much better at pillarhugging, Blizzard monitors very carefully which kind of buffs they can hand out. They buffed resto by ~4%? Just to calm the masses. They need data from PvP and this is just starting to flow in. My sole hope is, that atm, a lot of combos demand a priest and paladin, which hopefully let's some room for further improvement.

    P.S.: As you might hear a lot in this forums: your anecdotal evidence might be wrong and won#t help any of us. Just because you managed to beat a few other players doesn't tell you anything about class balance. It might be, if you play in an environment which per se selects only the best players, keeping individual skill differences within a very very small error margin.

    But, to cite one of the many statistics available, which are based on a far broader data set than your experience:

    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...gregate=amount

    We might get a number buff, but I would rather see "mechanics" like HST get scrapped and in exchange to get some fun healing mechanics. It's due time.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Cameltotem View Post
    nope.

    Warrior bloodthirst tooltip says 30% still and does the same shitty damage as before.

    Its not live.
    Tooltips are clientside. Without a clientpatch, tooltips stay the same. But actions are performed on the server, your client only send "does bloodthirst", therefore they're live. And logs proof this assumption. No way in hell fury jumps in damage that much without those buffs went live.

    Quote Originally Posted by miffy23 View Post
    In the example you gave, the obvious choice would be 1 rogue, since they bring less utility compared to 1 enhancer and hardly perform better.

    It sounds like your guild is dead set on running a competitive setup despite not really having a stab at a relevant placement. In this scenario, some people will always be unhappy, because it's never perfectly balanced. This time it's Enh. Other specs are similarly shafted, it's not just Enh.

    If you can't deal with that you either need to be flexible and reroll or simply play at a slightly more relaxed level. In my opinion, there is no need for such stringent and harsh measures when you don't really have any chance to place even Top50. But that's just me.
    You're funny. You just tell him "stop complaining and choose to be bad or reroll". If he would be contempt with either one of these possibilities, he would've done so. But he chose to stick to his shaman because he likes him, and his demand for a fair choice is justified. Balance is what can be expected of Blizzard.

    And no, shaman utility will usually do nothing for progress. Rogues can cheese stuff with smokebomb, cloak and cheat death - shamans got nothing the like. Rogues are more mobile if using their talents the right way - and rogues do way higher singletargetdamage. And that's what he had asked for.

  2. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by TenDance View Post
    Since I'm constantly ranked on heroic (now mythic) fights during progression since BC, most of the time with several healer classes, I can tell you one thing: restoration is not in a bad place in terms of "you and your friends won't complete the raid until the next patch". Sure, you can get stuff done.
    But almost any other class can do it better. Restoration got no forte at the moment, and in an environment where the first thing you do to progress is to cut one or two healers because you need the DPS, a class which got no forte is just useless.

    We can't spam AoE and the singletargetheals are lackluster. The "strong point" of restoration atm is addcontrol - and this is a niche which imposes a problem. Because you can't buff heals without breaking PvP. This is the reason shamans are the sole healing class without a tank-CD. And no, SLT, doesn't make it. On the obvious side, if you got enough time to move into range, your tank isn't in dire need of it. On the other side, adding more people to the cluttered melee-area is most of the time detrimental. And no, the bugged projection won't help at all.
    Guess what, the speedbuff with UL (and echo) might be the very reason shamans are now so much better at pillarhugging, Blizzard monitors very carefully which kind of buffs they can hand out. They buffed resto by ~4%? Just to calm the masses. They need data from PvP and this is just starting to flow in. My sole hope is, that atm, a lot of combos demand a priest and paladin, which hopefully let's some room for further improvement.

    P.S.: As you might hear a lot in this forums: your anecdotal evidence might be wrong and won#t help any of us. Just because you managed to beat a few other players doesn't tell you anything about class balance. It might be, if you play in an environment which per se selects only the best players, keeping individual skill differences within a very very small error margin.

    But, to cite one of the many statistics available, which are based on a far broader data set than your experience:

    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...gregate=amount

    We might get a number buff, but I would rather see "mechanics" like HST get scrapped and in exchange to get some fun healing mechanics. It's due time.
    Again I do not think we are in the best spot and I do no think we need to. And I do not even think we are in a horrible spot. The information you provided gives nothing to be honest. Its an overview on AVERAGE Hps. Who really cares about average hps? Any guild that has any clue on what to do will not choose their heal setup based on average hps as it is just depending on so many different things that the healers themselves have no influence on.

    As I mentioned in several different posts the changes to healing itself have shown how different healers are usefull in different situations and while I think that druids might be a little to strong at the moment as I saw a lot of mythic guilds stacking druid heals for some bosses. Shamans do have their usage as they can get people at low hp back to full much faster and more efficent than a druid, paladin or priest (monks are a thing there but I think its okay to have 2 clases for the same job).

    I just do not think that Restos are in such a bad spot as the statistic you provided shows as we are shining in high dmg phases that require movement. We have 2 raid wide cds we can use while moving, that heal for a lot. There is no point anymore to look at an average hps as it just does not display when and what a healer acutally does. Especially on Butcher there is no way a shaman is going to get a lot of hps going during the first 30% of the fight but in the end he will get his numbers going way above the other healers.

    I understand people are still looking at numbers and to be honest I love looking at numbers. But if we are honest it was never a display of how well a healer does if you look at their hps.

    This said I think we might be a little undertuned while druids and possibly monks might be a bit to strong but overall I think that a shaman does what he is designed for very well and similar to MoP.
    If they wanted to change anything for resto shamans I would suggest getting chainheal back to smart heal, but this might result in us being a little over the top.

  3. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by FuriousGeorge View Post
    What exactly do you want them to "fix"? The damage, at least as elemental, is fine on almost every fight, and we are easily viable in both normal and heroic (haven't tried mythic yet). Mechanics are quite similar to what they have been for a long time now, so you cant really say you didn't know what awaited you, when you decided to level a shaman. There are small things, there always will be, but please enlighten me on why we need a general fix?
    http://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comments...eted_in_bc_an/

    "Shamans are not a buff class anymore, and more than ever it’s becoming apparent that we need to unbind ourselves from what was always intended as a buff mechanic and instead focus on what makes shaman iconic thematically, instead of mechanically."

    We lost so much during class homogenization.
    This was devastating for a class meant to enhance, buff and provide utility for the rest. Others equally got what's taken from us, Mages got Bloodlust which was eventually removed from Arenas later. Windfury gone, Cleansing gone. Shaman has been pruned to death and lost their identity of buffing others.

    Since then, we haven't received anywhere near to compensate our loss.

    Other than buffing, we had gained a few temporary titles and identities: Turret, burster, THUNDERSTORMED!
    How lovely.

    We are lost since the homogenization and most of the time, even Blizzard doesn't even know what to do with us. However I do know that they keep telling us any major changes would require expensions. How many expensions can you count since the homogenization?

    Blizzard still wanted to give us a few options, because back in the day the spec you know as Elemental had only one button: Lightning Bolt. Raiding would mean spamming the same button for many hours. And it literally looked like a sperm in the air. Imagine the joy.

    Enter Lava Burst, Blizzard introduced it since Elemental players were hanging themselves out of boredom; had the potential to fulfill what Elemental lacked: A massive strike! Lava Lash was implemented for Enhancement with different timing but the same story. Particularly Elemental Shaman had an above average taste for RNG, thanks to mastery, spells could be duplicated. A spell which was impletemented to be the massive strike of Shaman could be very OP when stars aligned, so they had to keep it under control to a level that it wouldn't worth to count it as a massive strike compared to others.

    ---

    Resto Shamans wanted Spirit Link Totem for ages. That brought doom to all of us. Forums were swarming with angry PvP'ers and they were angry at this small 5 hp totem. "Unsubbed" spam began to take over the PvP forum, so Blizzard choose to release its wrath on all the totems.

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/5848168189

    Instead of tunning Spirit Link, Blizzard chose to overkill the class for many reasons: Spirit Link was already an adopted child, it took so long to develop and it was probably a very hard process that day. It was a complicated spell mechanic and could lead more complexities, so Blizzard just uprooted the problem. This shook many Shamans' confidence in Blizzard that they knew what they were doing.

    ---

    Elemental Shamans wanted a PBAoE since they were the only single class who didn't have one and were terrible at AoE. EQ was implemented when we used to spend about 40-60 points to different talent trees, EQ used to be the final talent of Elemental. Till WoD, nobody used it and even today shamans are hesitant to use it.

    ---

    I can go on with billions of examples; Shaman is outdated. Paladins would be in our spot too if they didn't already receive many revamps. Blizzard needs to change their perspective on shaman. I want no more band-aid solutions, no more bullshit, no more new Stormstrike icons, no more Shamanism buffs.

    Enough.

  4. #144
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Mithgroth View Post
    http://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comments...eted_in_bc_an/

    "Shamans are not a buff class anymore, and more than ever it’s becoming apparent that we need to unbind ourselves from what was always intended as a buff mechanic and instead focus on what makes shaman iconic thematically, instead of mechanically."

    We lost so much during class homogenization.
    This was devastating for a class meant to enhance, buff and provide utility for the rest. Others equally got what's taken from us, Mages got Bloodlust which was eventually removed from Arenas later. Windfury gone, Cleansing gone. Shaman has been pruned to death and lost their identity of buffing others.

    Since then, we haven't received anywhere near to compensate our loss.

    Other than buffing, we had gained a few temporary titles and identities: Turret, burster, THUNDERSTORMED!
    How lovely.

    We are lost since the homogenization and most of the time, even Blizzard doesn't even know what to do with us. However I do know that they keep telling us any major changes would require expensions. How many expensions can you count since the homogenization?

    Blizzard still wanted to give us a few options, because back in the day the spec you know as Elemental had only one button: Lightning Bolt. Raiding would mean spamming the same button for many hours. And it literally looked like a sperm in the air. Imagine the joy.

    Enter Lava Burst, Blizzard introduced it since Elemental players were hanging themselves out of boredom; had the potential to fulfill what Elemental lacked: A massive strike! Lava Lash was implemented for Enhancement with different timing but the same story. Particularly Elemental Shaman had an above average taste for RNG, thanks to mastery, spells could be duplicated. A spell which was impletemented to be the massive strike of Shaman could be very OP when stars aligned, so they had to keep it under control to a level that it wouldn't worth to count it as a massive strike compared to others.

    ---

    Resto Shamans wanted Spirit Link Totem for ages. That brought doom to all of us. Forums were swarming with angry PvP'ers and they were angry at this small 5 hp totem. "Unsubbed" spam began to take over the PvP forum, so Blizzard choose to release its wrath on all the totems.

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/5848168189

    Instead of tunning Spirit Link, Blizzard chose to overkill the class for many reasons: Spirit Link was already an adopted child, it took so long to develop and it was probably a very hard process that day. It was a complicated spell mechanic and could lead more complexities, so Blizzard just uprooted the problem. This shook many Shamans' confidence in Blizzard that they knew what they were doing.

    ---

    Elemental Shamans wanted a PBAoE since they were the only single class who didn't have one and were terrible at AoE. EQ was implemented when we used to spend about 40-60 points to different talent trees, EQ used to be the final talent of Elemental. Till WoD, nobody used it and even today shamans are hesitant to use it.

    ---

    I can go on with billions of examples; Shaman is outdated. Paladins would be in our spot too if they didn't already receive many revamps. Blizzard needs to change their perspective on shaman. I want no more band-aid solutions, no more bullshit, no more new Stormstrike icons, no more Shamanism buffs.

    Enough.
    This... Can't even counter that with a proper argument of how shaman is "fine".

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