Single target log results

[Deleted]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/rankings/6#boss=1706

DK: 21,804.1 - 25,710.2
Warlock: 21,995.2 - 25,819.0
Rogue: 22,043.9 - 26,442.4
Warrior: 22,032.2 - 28,361.1
Priest: 22,578.1 - 28,402.2
Mage: 22,664.7 - 28,530.3
Shaman: 21,214.9 - 28,962.9
Paladin: 23,742.3 - 29,314.4
Monk: 24,684.8 - 29,732.9
Druid: 23,698.3 - 29,820.8
Hunter: 24,299.7 - 30,756.9

How did blizz respond to these differences in the hotfix from a warlock POV(Warlock forums so...):

""

[sasofrass]

they think locks are for the most part in an ok state, number wise

[Deleted]

And that's being pure DPS class with no mobility that's behind almost any other class by 3 to 4 k DPS. Cool.

[Gravityx]

Look at how Destro (along with the aff/demo) does on multitarget...or any cleave situation. We are in a fine place, balanced with a lot of other classes. The problem is that WW Monks, Hunters, Ret, and Feral are ranking high on EVERY FIGHT. I hope the Hunter & WW Monk change will help with that a bit, but I am amazed more at the fact that Ret & Feral were untouched.

[Deleted]

Yes but they made a statement saying:
"When a spec is top on both movement and stationary fights, they usually need to take a look at the spec.
Everyone should be fairly equal in single target, although may still have niches (stationary vs movement). Once you get beyond single target, some might be good at cleave (2-3), some mass AoE, some burst AoE, etc."
So they f'd up. Classes are NOT equal on single target at all. DKs, Warlocks and rogues need a buff and that's final.

[kamuii]

Look at how Destro (along with the aff/demo) does on multitarget...or any cleave situation. We are in a fine place, balanced with a lot of other classes. The problem is that WW Monks, Hunters, Ret, and Feral are ranking high on EVERY FIGHT. I hope the Hunter & WW Monk change will help with that a bit, but I am amazed more at the fact that Ret & Feral were untouched.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/rankings/6

warcraft logs disagree.

[Gaidax]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/6#boss=1706

Kay...

If you for some reason want bleeding edge top 10%, then https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1706

Again, kay.


Warlocks are fine. Not amazing, but not bottom.

[FurtyIRL]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/rankings/6

warcraft logs disagree.

Understand that literally no good players/guilds are logging right now.

Also, point of fact, WW monk is #1 on everything by far.

[Arrogant Bastard]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/6#boss=1706

Kay...

If you for some reason want bleeding edge top 10%, then https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1706

Again, kay.


Warlocks are fine. Not amazing, but not bottom.

Odd how they just buffed mages who are right where Warlocks are on that fight, amazing kay.

[Deleted]

I don't care about the scrubs who don't know how to play. I care about the top 200 people. And in there I find this:
DK: 21,804.1 - 25,710.2
Warlock: 21,995.2 - 25,819.0
Rogue: 22,043.9 - 26,442.4
Warrior: 22,032.2 - 28,361.1
Priest: 22,578.1 - 28,402.2
Mage: 22,664.7 - 28,530.3
Shaman: 21,214.9 - 28,962.9
Paladin: 23,742.3 - 29,314.4
Monk: 24,684.8 - 29,732.9
Druid: 23,698.3 - 29,820.8
Hunter: 24,299.7 - 30,756.9

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Understand that literally no good players/guilds are logging right now.

You CAN'T be a bad player on a stationary single target encounter. You. Just. Can't.

[Gravityx]

I don't care about the scrubs who don't know how to play. I care about the top 200 people. And in there I find this:
DK: 21,804.1 - 25,710.2
Warlock: 21,995.2 - 25,819.0
Rogue: 22,043.9 - 26,442.4
Warrior: 22,032.2 - 28,361.1
Priest: 22,578.1 - 28,402.2
Mage: 22,664.7 - 28,530.3
Shaman: 21,214.9 - 28,962.9
Paladin: 23,742.3 - 29,314.4
Monk: 24,684.8 - 29,732.9
Druid: 23,698.3 - 29,820.8
Hunter: 24,299.7 - 30,756.9

What do you not understand about the fact that Blizz balances classes with ALL fights in mind?

[kamuii]

Understand that literally no good players/guilds are logging right now.

Also, point of fact, WW monk is #1 on everything by far.

LOL. WoW. I can't believe you just made that claim.

"No good players are logging right now"

Ok. Let me make random claims I can't prove.

All warlocks that play this game are best players in the world with 230 IQ and lightning reflexes with perfect micromanagement. Every other player is tetraplegic and literally play with their face rolling across the keyboard and is on par/beats warlocks on dps. This is a fact. Trust me.

[Hekkipekki]

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You CAN'T be a bad player on a stationary single target encounter. You. Just. Can't.

Dumbest statement i've seen so far.

[Arrogant Bastard]

What do you not understand about the fact that Blizz balances classes with ALL fights in mind?

Tell me more about how Ret, Feral, WW, and Unholy are balanced.

[kamuii]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/6#boss=1706

Kay...

If you for some reason want bleeding edge top 10%, then https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1706

Again, kay.


Warlocks are fine. Not amazing, but not bottom.

Fine = middle of the ground

11/2=5.5
5th to 6th place = middle of the ground.

being 9th of 11 classes =fine?
Last time I check that's third to last.

50th percentile consists of people without the IQ and reflexes to beat silver proving ground. No wonder the dps is a lot closer!

[FurtyIRL]

LOL. WoW. I can't believe you just made that claim.

"No good players are logging right now"

Ok. Let me make random claims I can't prove.

All warlocks that play this game are best players in the world with 230 IQ and lightning reflexes with perfect micromanagement. Every other player is tetraplegic and literally play with their face rolling across the keyboard and is on par/beats warlocks on dps. This is a fact. Trust me.

What makes you think I'm wrong? Obviously there's some diamonds in the rough out there in their more casual guilds but 99% of all competitive players/guilds have their logs private for progression. The reason is two-fold; to stop any unique strategies being visible through logs and to discourage any sort of padding. I know this because I've raided every tier since the game has existed and because I've been in competitive guilds for all of that time. How do you expect me to irrefutably prove that? Fair enough, I can't. But any player in my position is going to tell you the exact same thing.

[Neevs]

Look at how Destro (along with the aff/demo) does on multitarget...or any cleave situation. We are in a fine place, balanced with a lot of other classes. The problem is that WW Monks, Hunters, Ret, and Feral are ranking high on EVERY FIGHT. I hope the Hunter & WW Monk change will help with that a bit, but I am amazed more at the fact that Ret & Feral were untouched.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/rankings/6

warcraft logs disagree.

thats the top phrases and doesn't really show it imo..
You should look at the fights and class balance within those fights imo..
If we look at each individual fight:

Kargath: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1721 we're roughly in the middle.. and here should be taken into account that alot of melee are on the stands and there for lower than what they actually are.
But even without that, aff is abit above the middle and destro is roughly in the middle.. and demo is not looking good here..

The Butcher https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1706 Affliction is better spot than destro, but still not near the top speccs. Detro ain't looking good, and with the recent buffs to ele and enhance we'll probally be looking even worse. Demo is looking worse than destro and ele which just got buffed.

Tectushttps://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1722 Demo is roughly in the middle of the pack, with aff looking bad, and destro even more so.

Brackenspore https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1720 A cleave fight, and destro and aff is roughly in the middle. Demo once again ain't looking good.

Twin Ogron https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1719 affliction is looking better, getting closer to the top but still a far bit behind the top 6. Destro and demo ain't looking good.

Ko'ragh https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1723 on this we're roughy in the middle, but don't know if the DPS while shield is up is taken into account. Also demo is looing worse than the other 2 speccs, being a fair bit from the middle pack.

Imperator Mar'gok https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1705 Destro getting closer to the top, still a fair bit behind the top 8 (by quite abit) and demo and aff not looking good, demo especially.


Total overview: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...gregate=amount Aff is pretty much in the middle of the pack, with destro just below.. with demo looking really bad..Also taken into acount that 2 of the speccs below us getting buffed and the rest got other DPS alternatives (doubt many hunters will play something besides MM) We're not looking good.

while we don't have the top guilds logs, this is true for the other classes aswell. And we do not have much else data to go from (yes you can look at WoL's but that probally do not show a diff picture and i don't know how to look at the same thing on that)

[Deleted]

What do you not understand about the fact that Blizz balances classes with ALL fights in mind?

What do you not understand about the fact that Blizz made this statement: "Everyone should be fairly equal in single target"
All classes hang arround 28-30k except for 24k locks and DKs and 26k rogues.

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a lot of irrelevant information

I said SINGLE. F'N. TARGET.

[kamuii]

What makes you think I'm wrong? Obviously there's some diamonds in the rough out there in their more casual guilds but 99% of all competitive players/guilds have their logs private for progression. The reason is two-fold; to stop any unique strategies being visible through logs and to discourage any sort of padding. I know this because I've raided every tier since the game has existed and because I've been in competitive guilds for all of that time. How do you expect me to irrefutably prove that? Fair enough, I can't. But any player in my position is going to tell you the exact same thing.

What makes you think you are right? What information did you make the inference no good player is logging from?
How about I put out some facts for you?
Fact 1:Not all good players are in good guilds
Fact 2:Not all players in good guilds are good players.
Fact 3:I just have to find 1 good player that logged to prove your claim is wrong.

I don't claim to know howmany good players are logging.
However if you want to make a claim that either
a)no good players are logging,
b)the majority of good players are not logging

You better back it up.

If you say you made the inference that some competitive guilds are not logging therefore not many good players are logging then you better prove that majority of good players are in good guilds.

Which means you have to prove out of 10 million players, majority of the good players are in the couple hundred guilds that are good guilds. Your claims are basically impossible to substantiate.

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thats the top phrases and doesn't really show it imo..
You should look at the fights and class balance within those fights imo..
If we look at each individual fight:

Kargath: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1721 we're roughly in the middle.. and here should be taken into account that alot of melee are on the stands and there for lower than what they actually are.. and demo is not looking good here..

The Butcher https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1706 Affliction is better spot than destro, but still not near the top speccs. Detro ain't looking good, and with the recent buffs to ele and enhance we'll probally be looking even worse. Demo is looking worse than destro and ele which just got buffed.

Tectushttps://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1722 Demo is roughly in the middle of the pack, with aff looking bad, and destro even more so.

Brackenspore https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1720 A cleave fight, and destro and aff is roughly in the middle. Demo once again ain't looking good.

Twin Ogron https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1719 affliction is looking better, getting closer to the top but still a far bit behind the top 6. Destro and demo ain't looking good.

Ko'ragh https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1723 on this we're roughy in the middle, but don't know if the DPS while shield is up is taken into account. Also demo is looing worse than the other 2 speccs, being a fair bit from the middle pack.

Imperator Mar'gok https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=90&boss=1705 Destro getting closer to the top, still a fair bit behind the top 8 (by quite abit) and demo and aff not looking good, demo especially.


Total overview: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...gregate=amount Aff is pretty much in the middle of the pack, with destro just below.. with demo looking really bad..

while we don't have the top guilds logs, this is true for the other classes aswell. And we do not have much else data to go from (yes you can look at WoL's but that probally do not show a diff picture and i don't know how to look at the same thing on that)

From what you linked
Kargath
9th/11 classes. Third to last
Butcher
9th/11 classes. Third to last
Tectus
11th/11 classes. Last
Brakenspore
8th/11 classes. 4th to last
Twin
8th/11 classes. 4th to last
Ko'ragh
10th/11 classes. 2rd to last
Imperator
9th/11 classes. 3rd to last

Overview
10th/11 classes. 2nd to last

Being the middle is 5-6th
Apparently being second to last is somehow middle ground and = fine. Lol

[Deleted]

What makes you think I'm wrong? Obviously there's some diamonds in the rough out there in their more casual guilds but 99% of all competitive players/guilds have their logs private for progression. The reason is two-fold; to stop any unique strategies being visible through logs and to discourage any sort of padding. I know this because I've raided every tier since the game has existed and because I've been in competitive guilds for all of that time. How do you expect me to irrefutably prove that? Fair enough, I can't. But any player in my position is going to tell you the exact same thing.

And even IF you are correct, which you aren't, those "diamonds in the rough" would BE the ones in the top 200. And like I said, you don't have to be a rocket scientist to perform a stationary single target rotation to perfection. A 5 year old could do it.

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From what you linked
Kargath
9th/11 classes. Third to last
Butcher
9th/11 classes. Third to last
Tectus
11th/11 classes. Last
Brakenspore
8th/11 classes. 4th to last
Twin
8th/11 classes. 4th to last
Ko'ragh
10th/11 classes. 2rd to last
Imperator
9th/11 classes. 3rd to last

Overview
10th/11 classes. 2nd to last

Being the middle is 5-6th
Apparently being second to last is somehow middle ground and = fine. Lol

Not to mention, we're a PURE DPS class. Hybrids should never under any circumstances be above us.