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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Futon View Post
    I just don't find PVP enjoyable anymore.

    1) Ashran is terrible. This is what they envision pvp to be like and I just don't get it. There's no skill involved you just hang out and attack NPCS and occasionally players.

    2) Gladiators Coliseum is ridiculous. 25 players in a free for all in a tiny room. How was that ever a good idea? And then it rewards a piece of gear if you win, but only the most OP classes ever win.

    3) Class balance is worse than ever. Rets, ferals and dks on every single team. Hybrid classes have way too much utility and still do the same damage as the damage classes...how is that balanced?

    4) Racials still deciding games is just ridiculous.

    5) It's harder than ever to cap out points and gear every week. You used to do arenas + 1 world boss and you were done for the week. Now you have to do arenas + ashran (3 hour queue if you're lucky) + 3 rbg WINS + win the gladiator coliseum every week. So time consuming for a chance at RNG gear, but if you aren't lucky you don't get the gear and you fall behind.

    Just no logic to PVP right now, I don't get it.
    Just no logic to PVP right now, I don't get it.

    If its fun to kill players (pvp) then pvp. Seems your gripe is more playing "get gear game" then that other goal.

  2. #22
    I'm not sure, I'm having a lot of fun PvPing. People for years have been asked for more to do as a PvPer, now there's more to do and people complain about it, doesn't make a lot of sense. I don't bother with RBGs or the coliseum, or ashran for that matter, I'll still be full geared in a couple of months and then it doesn't make a difference anymore.

    Class balance isn't that bad, the only real problems are Ret Paladin utility (2x Sac/Freedom/BoP mixed with absurd damage needs to be changed), and Rogues having a 12 second Kidney Shot, no idea why anyone thought that was a good idea, but 3 sec Garrote into 8 second Kidney into 4 second Kidney is basically impossible to live through in the majority of situations.

  3. #23
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Malgru View Post
    there will always be fotm.

    always.

    there is no escape.
    true, but I'd like the classes that actually require a little skill to play to be fotm

    not ret paladins.

  4. #24
    Mechagnome Bombino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zula95 View Post
    I'm not going to go as far as saying ret is overpowered, but its probably the strongest melee dps spec right now. The burst is incredible and its very hard to keep them CC'ed. Bubble when you get them lower plus unless you constantly purge/lock them down they can outheal nearly any dps so they must be focus target.
    ret is OP because of the utility, not the damage. 30s forbearance, sac'ing cc off, strong offheals, etc etc. the burst is good but there is better.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Belisarius565 View Post
    Just no logic to PVP right now, I don't get it.

    If its fun to kill players (pvp) then pvp. Seems your gripe is more playing "get gear game" then that other goal.
    This would make sense if PVP wasn't gear based, and I wish it wasn't.

    There isn't more to do, there is just more we're forced to do. I'd rather just stick to Arenas and not have to go and do RBGs, Coliseum, Ashran in hopes for RNG gear that I most likely won't get.

    Rets are on 70% of the top teams because of the utility they offer. They are just too strong right now. Oh but they need their time to shine.. no they don't. PVP should be balanced, there shouldn't be FOTM. You shouldn't have one class that can do top damage with top utility.
    Orc/Human Hunter - Futon @ Nathrezim and Kel'Thuzad

  6. #26
    Blademaster Buichi's Avatar
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    Horde trAshcan is broken atm and only allows a third of the players alliance trAshcan is allowing. Blizzard told me to deal with it.

  7. #27
    The Lightbringer Aqua's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Futon View Post
    Or hear me out here.... they balance the fucking game.
    They. Will. Never. Balance. The. Game.
    and that is it, that's the twist ending to this story. If you're surprised then you haven't been with us long.
    I have eaten all the popcorn, I left none for anyone else.

  8. #28
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by RaZDaZ View Post
    No. Class balance is not worse than ever, did you even play MoP at the start or Wrath? Your other points are valid though.
    The more expansions you go back the worse class balance is. Vanilla was beyond any doubt the worst for class balance, with tbc as a close 2nd.

    Wrath changed much and more, but dk's where horribly tuned.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Futon View Post
    Or hear me out here.... they balance the fucking game.
    Maybe the game is balanced and it is only unbalanced in your mind...

    OoooooOoOOo /xfiles music

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Futon View Post
    This would make sense if PVP wasn't gear based, and I wish it wasn't.

    There isn't more to do, there is just more we're forced to do. I'd rather just stick to Arenas and not have to go and do RBGs, Coliseum, Ashran in hopes for RNG gear that I most likely won't get.

    Rets are on 70% of the top teams because of the utility they offer. They are just too strong right now. Oh but they need their time to shine.. no they don't. PVP should be balanced, there shouldn't be FOTM. You shouldn't have one class that can do top damage with top utility.
    You are not forced to do anything. If you actually like pvping in WoW (which has always been geared based) then pvp the way you want. Having a lot of ways to "gear up" is not a bad thing. Play what is fun don't play what is not.

  11. #31
    Gladiator's Colliseum and Ashran are by far the biggest disappointments. Class balance is always in a war with PvE balance, but Ashran and the Colliseum are pure PvP endeavors and they are just HORRIBLY implemented. Really, those two things define most of Holinka's job, and they were a complete fail.

    If they can't even get something like that right, then how the hell will they manage anything else that requires a little more finesse?

  12. #32
    Ashran is what it is, sure it needs tweaking but overall the biggest problem with is the queue time.

    Gladiator's Colliseum is currenly completely broken. All I face in there are 3-4 teams of 3-4 people and then a few soloers. The 25 people thing is just too overwhelming. It should be far less people, making the grouping less likely to happen.

    Balance - this is probably the most balanced first season in any expansion. Never before have the classes and specs been so even. There is still imbalance, but it's far less than it usually is.
    Last edited by shortleif; 2014-12-15 at 09:19 AM.
    Hästäpple - Level 100 Human Hunter, Outland EU

  13. #33
    Epic! Uoyredrum's Avatar
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    I agree with your points except class balance. It's probably the best it's ever been atm other than S2 and S7. Cata and MoP were atrocious in terms of balance, this blows them out of the water in that regard. There's OP specs/classes right now, but it's a far cry from the travesty that was the last two expansions.

    But I do agree Ashran is terrible and shouldn't have conquest linked to it.

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soloable View Post
    People keep calling rets op. I'm just not getting it. Our survivability is decent after the nerf and our damage is fine yet people still complain, can you actually explain what is wrong with the current classes instead of just calling them hybrids? Please.
    My problem with ret and disc is that it forces teams to have an offensive dispel or there is almost no chance of winning.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Futon View Post
    Or hear me out here.... they balance the fucking game.
    Sure, let me get my genie lamp out and wish the game to be balanced.

    Easier said than done.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Buichi View Post
    Horde trAshcan is broken atm and only allows a third of the players alliance trAshcan is allowing. Blizzard told me to deal with it.
    With the way you're responding, I have a better idea in mind.

    The door is there.
    Whoever loves let him flourish. / Let him perish who knows not love. / Let him perish twice who forbids love. - Pompeii

  16. #36
    Nobody sad for mages?
    Never seen a mage win Gladiators colliseum, maybe if you have a couple of sick teammembers and at least 2 healers just pumping heals into you...
    As for arenas, I feel like mage sucks hard, as a casual pvper I feel like you get punished way to hard for making mistakes or not playing amazingly skillful. Missed your cc-chance because your df-poly get stopped by an aware opponent? Usually means game over. Got kicked/silenced on frost while healer is in short cc? Usually means game over. Out of iceblocks? Game over. Facing a hunter team? Game over.
    Not saying mage is impossible to play, some ex-gladiators are still up there doing good, but there is no middle-ground where you can play mage any more. You either are skilled and play with a hyper-coordinated team, then you rock, or else you fail. There is no "doing-okish" any more like I can do with all my other classes around 2k, where you have some margin of error without instantly losing the game.

    Ashran is meh, I agree, all the NPC shit is disturbing.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Futon View Post
    I just don't find PVP enjoyable anymore.

    1) Ashran is terrible. This is what they envision pvp to be like and I just don't get it. There's no skill involved you just hang out and attack NPCS and occasionally players.
    Yes.

    2) Gladiators Coliseum is ridiculous. 25 players in a free for all in a tiny room. How was that ever a good idea? And then it rewards a piece of gear if you win, but only the most OP classes ever win.
    Don't do it then.

    3) Class balance is worse than ever. Rets, ferals and dks on every single team. Hybrid classes have way too much utility and still do the same damage as the damage classes...how is that balanced?
    Class balance is not worse than ever. The difference is that this time around getting a new level 100 will only take you two days, and only a couple of more to gear up. FOTM has always existed, but now that you can get any class to level 90 instantly, and both leveling and gearing is short, rerolling is fast and easy.

    4) Racials still deciding games is just ridiculous.
    They don't. They help. They don't decide.

    5) It's harder than ever to cap out points and gear every week. You used to do arenas + 1 world boss and you were done for the week. Now you have to do arenas + ashran (3 hour queue if you're lucky) + 3 rbg WINS + win the gladiator coliseum every week. So time consuming for a chance at RNG gear, but if you aren't lucky you don't get the gear and you fall behind.
    By your logic you used to have to do RBGs as well as they gave you a stupidly high cap. You don't have to do anything other than arena any more now than you would have in MoP or Cata.

    Just no logic to PVP right now, I don't get it.
    If you don't like it, stop playing. I know it's an old song, but it's oh so true. It's a computer game. Enjoy it. If you don't enjoy it fill your life with something else that brings you joy.

  18. #38
    Immortal Frozen Death Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zula95 View Post
    I'm not going to go as far as saying ret is overpowered, but its probably the strongest melee dps spec right now. The burst is incredible and its very hard to keep them CC'ed. Bubble when you get them lower plus unless you constantly purge/lock them down they can outheal nearly any dps so they must be focus target.
    Yeah... No. Ret is certainly in a good position right now, but the strongest? Definitely not. Ferals are way, way worse. DKs are basically on par if not better than Ret. Warriors have been rocking as well, although it's debatable if it is as strong as Ret.

    The only ones I would say are in a worse position than Ret amongst the melee classes, it would be Rogue and Enhancement Shaman. Still, Rogues have such a big toolkit that it makes their damage output still reasonable with the amount of CC and utility they possess. I still see Rogues around despite not being the top melee class at the moment. Shamans, however, are just in a bad position overall. None of its specs are at the top in PvP right now, and Resto is like the only viable spec despite it not being picked very much in a competitive setting.
    Last edited by Frozen Death Knight; 2014-12-15 at 01:29 PM.

  19. #39
    Herald of the Titans Darksoldierr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shortleif View Post
    Ashran is what it is, sure it needs tweaking but overall the biggest problem with is the queue time.

    Gladiator's Colliseum is currenly completely broken. All I face in there are 3-4 teams of 3-4 people and then a few soloers. The 25 people thing is just too overwhelming. It should be far less people, making the grouping less likely to happen.

    Balance - this is probably the most balanced first season in any expansion. Never before have the classes and specs been so even. There is still imbalance, but it's far less than it usually is.
    Gladiator's colloseum is fine, the number is just good enough for chaos to ensure but not too big to turn into AOE spam, i won 2 out of 3 as enhance playing solo, it is perfectly doable. However, i agree that you shouldn't be allowed to queue up in party

    Ashran should promote the bonus missions lot more, like zone wide buffs or so. And it should be easier to push into the enemy's base, i yet to see Ashran end on Eu-Twisting Nether (on either side)
    Time is on our side
    Brutal Gladiator Enhancement Shaman *rawr*

  20. #40
    I would like to point out that Ashran was intended to be old school Alterac Valley with some updates to bring it up to the current game quality and that is exactly what we got. People complaining about it probably never experienced old school AV and thus didn't actually realize what they were getting. Ashran is an objective based pvp area not an arena. Arena's are designed to be based only on pvp combat with no interference. Ashran is designed to be an epic battle between the two factions that swings back and forth and spans over multiple days before a match is won.

    On the point of op classes this happens all the time and the people who arn't playing the op class will always claim that balance is the worst it has ever been. Balance is the best it has been in a long time. The fact that you had to mention multiple op classes instead of 1 just proves that balance is actually a lot closer than it has been in the past.

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