Help me be a better holy priest.

[Saphyron]

Haven't been playing holy priest for the last 2 years due to disc being slightly OP.

Played holy back in wrath and cata so I am a bit rusty.

is there any pointers you can give me to be better. (armory in signatur)

Kargath Bladefist HC kill: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports.../#type=healing

Ko'ragh N: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports.../#type=healing

Twin Ogron N: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...0&type=healing

Tectus N: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...7&type=healing

Brackenspore N: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...3&type=healing

The Butcher N: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...8&type=healing

Any help is appreciated.

[Overdispersion]

Spec Solace, PI/ToF depending on the fight, Glyph CoH, use Sanctuary Chakra with renew blanketing to reduce CoH cd, stop using PW:S, cast more PoM.

91 renews over 7:39 is pretty low. You should aim for about 150, so throw around more renews before/during raid damage.

[Saphyron]

Spec Solace, PI/ToF depending on the fight, Glyph CoH, use Sanctuary Chakra with renew blanketing to reduce CoH cd, stop using PW:S, cast more PoM.

91 renews over 7:39 is pretty low. You should aim for about 150, so throw around more renews before/during raid damage.

I am not gonna spec solace, yes I know it will give me more mana over time but only if I use it on CD, id rather have some free flash heals for spot heals sometimes.

Thanks for hints about renew and prayer of mending. Need to be better at that.

Just one question did you look at 1 log and decided on that one or did you look at all?

[Interrogate]

I am not gonna spec solace, yes I know it will give me more mana over time but only if I use it on CD, id rather have some free flash heals for spot heals sometimes.

Thanks for hints about renew and prayer of mending. Need to be better at that.

Just one question did you look at 1 log and decided on that one or did you look at all?

unless you have everburning candle you will never sustain a non stop, use every GCD, spam glyphed CoH on CD style of play without solace. Its pretty much impossible. So u can use Surge of light but dont expect to be top ranking or even topping meters without some other godly mana return.

EDIT: Sorry my post is based off of Mythic difficulty. Normal/heroic u can use surge of light without many problems.

[Deleted]

I am not gonna spec solace, yes I know it will give me more mana over time but only if I use it on CD, id rather have some free flash heals for spot heals sometimes.

Thanks for hints about renew and prayer of mending. Need to be better at that.

Just one question did you look at 1 log and decided on that one or did you look at all?

What is the point of asking for help yet refusing to change out of a wrong talent? It would likely be a waste of time to check the logs...

[Saphyron]

What is the point of asking for help yet refusing to change out of a wrong talent? It would likely be a waste of time to check the logs...

Ill gladly accept help, but solace I hate with such a passion and unless you use it on cd every 8 sec its worse than the other 2 and I know I won't use it on cd every 8 sec so there is no reason whatsoever for me to change to it.

And considering this is howtopriest, breakdown of these talents. You are not penalized heavily by not using this spell.

Level 45: Tier 3 -Mana Restoration/Efficiency
Surge of Light - Formerly FDCL, SoL is arguably the hardest talent to quantify the amount of mana we ‘regen’, since it mostly is a mana savings ability that relies on some amount of RNG In 5.4 FDCL has been buffed to include nearly all of our healing spells that can proc the free FH. Going into WoD, the PPM has been reduced. Remember that your SoL FH's will still trigger stacks of Serendipity. This spell provides the most synergy for Holy.

Mindbender - The first thing to keep in mind is that this replaces Shadowfiend. If you do not spec into this, you will still have access to baseline Shadowfiend. The latest incarnation has it have a 60 second cooldown, and restore 0.75% (down from 1.75% in 5.4) mana per swing. It also provides more damage than Solace.

Power Word: Solace - This replaces Holy Fire (dealing the same amount of damage) and removes the mana cost completely. It restores 2% of your total mana, applies/refreshes your evangelism stacks and heals for 100% of the damage it deals (it's under a separate spell ID than Atonement for Discipline.) As a Holy Priest, you likely are not casting this spell in regular rotation, and you no longer have access to Evangelism as Holy. Disc has much greater synergy with this spell given it's interaction with Evangelism. Simply put, it's a mana positive smart heal which amounts to a highly situational spell choice.

Basicly all the talent choices I've been mentioned has not been confirmed to be better at howtopriest.
What I would love to know is where I can improve and where I am doing something wrong in regards to fights.

[Madcap]

What is the point of asking for help yet refusing to change out of a wrong talent? It would likely be a waste of time to check the logs...

Makes me wonder about the point of offering to help if you're going get offended should it not be accepted.

Also, lol at "wrong talent."

[PosPosPos]

Basicly all the talent choices I've been mentioned has not been confirmed to be better at howtopriest.
What I would love to know is where I can improve and where I am doing something wrong in regards to fights.

If you come here with questions, then expect regurgitated information already stated in howtopriest, what's the point? Just go back there already.

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Makes me wonder about the point of offering to help if you're going get offended should it not be accepted.

Also, lol at "wrong talent."

Telling someone he isn't sincere about wanting help isn't taking offense, as much as you would like it to be.

[Saphyron]

If you come here with questions, then expect regurgitated information already stated in howtopriest, what's the point? Just go back there already.

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Telling someone he isn't sincere about wanting help isn't taking offense, as much as you would like it to be.

Well when he says something that isn't that much helpful.

Talent choices I know all about read up on it many times to be certain what I want to be helped at is seeing where I can improve, he pointed out I was slacking on renews and prayer of mending which is super helpful.

[Avada Kedavra]

but thats the point of a "help me" thread. changing the talent around is what is better. Now knowing that and choosing something else will negate the point of the thread entirely.

there are many things that you can use in game that will track it for you and let you know when to use it. i would suggest finding a way to use the superior talent so that it is easier to use for you with addons WA, tellmewhen etc.

[Necessarily]

And considering this is howtopriest, breakdown of these talents. You are not penalized heavily by not using this spell.

I actually respect your decision not to use Solace, but please don't look at howtopriest or even Icy-Veins for Holy information. All of their information is outdated at best, and blatantly wrong at worst. The best you can do is hang around forums like these and try to gradually absorb information from smart people arguing about things. There is not (at the moment) any easy 1-stop guide to healing.

Back to mindbender usage...if you're trying to pad meters and rank, like a lot of the theory crafters around here are, then you simply cannot justify it. If you're trying to down bosses, but also have fun and not hate yourself, then there's nothing wrong with mindbender. Bottom line is, as long as the raid isn't wiping because heals aren't going out fast enough (or the healers are running out of mana), there's no need for you to spec Solace. If it's actually going to make the difference for you and you're having horrible mana problems, then yeah, you should consider learning to use it.

[Saphyron]

but thats the point of a "help me" thread. changing the talent around is what is better. Now knowing that and choosing something else will negate the point of the thread entirely.

there are many things that you can use in game that will track it for you and let you know when to use it. i would suggest finding a way to use the superior talent so that it is easier to use for you with addons WA, tellmewhen etc.

That is helpful, is it possible you know how to track it, have WA but is kinda an idiot at using it.
Also is it possible for me to cast solace on the enemy without having it targeted? Cause id rather not target the boss every 8 sec to dmg him and then return back to targeting people for heals.

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I actually respect your decision not to use Solace, but please don't look at howtopriest or even Icy-Veins for Holy information. All of their information is outdated at best, and blatantly wrong at worst. The best you can do is hang around forums like these and try to gradually absorb information from smart people arguing about things. There is not (at the moment) any easy 1-stop guide to healing.

Back to mindbender usage...if you're trying to pad meters and rank, like a lot of the theory crafters around here are, then you simply cannot justify it. If you're trying to down bosses, but also have fun and not hate yourself, then there's nothing wrong with mindbender. Bottom line is, as long as the raid isn't wiping because heals aren't going out fast enough (or the healers are running out of mana), there's no need for you to spec Solace. If it's actually going to make the difference for you and you're having horrible mana problems, then yeah, you should consider learning to use it.

Don't care about padding meters, just want to defeat bosses. I am using surge of light btw, not mindbender.

I only have mana problems going towards the end cause people usually goes herp a derp and stop focusing on surviving and more focusing on killing. But rest of the fight I am comfortable 50% and above.

As can be seen here. 2/3 of the fight I am above 50% mana then I start going down heavily https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...alse%240%24100

Actually its closer to 4/5 of the fight where I am around 50% then going down fast.

[PosPosPos]

Well when he says something that isn't that much helpful.

Talent choices I know all about read up on it many times to be certain what I want to be helped at is seeing where I can improve, he pointed out I was slacking on renews and prayer of mending which is super helpful.

If you don't want to be helped, then nothing anyone says is going to be helpful.

The actual reason why you are behind on renews and PoM casts is because you simply don't have the mana pool to support it, and it's going to be even more obvious as you do harder bosses than H Kargath.

Surge of Light is reserved when you have up-to-date spirit items in all possible slots/good mana trinkets as well as specific fights with specific strategy. Solace however is a universal talent that is fantastic on every fight(save maybe Brackenspore).

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Don't care about padding meters, just want to defeat bosses. I am using surge of light btw, not mindbender.

I only have mana problems going towards the end cause people usually goes herp a derp and stop focusing on surviving and more focusing on killing. But rest of the fight I am comfortable 50% and above.

As can be seen here. 2/3 of the fight I am above 50% mana then I start going down heavily https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...alse%240%24100

While other holy priests are able to cope with players standing in fire, you can't. Until you accept that your inability to adapt is stopping you from improving, there's no point in going further than this.

[Avada Kedavra]

Try here http://howtopriest.com/viewtopic.php?t=4308

import the string, get it set up and try it out.

You can create a focus macro and have the ability cast on the focus without changing target.

#showtooltip Power Word: Solace
/cast [target=focus,exists] Power word: Solace; Power Word: Solace

put that on your bars and that should take care of that. Just have the boss on your focus.

[Saphyron]

Try here http://howtopriest.com/viewtopic.php?t=4308

import the string, get it set up and try it out.

You can create a focus macro and have the ability cast on the focus without changing target.

#showtooltip Power Word: Solace
/cast [target=focus,exists] Power word: Solace; Power Word: Solace

put that on your bars and that should take care of that. Just have the boss on your focus.

Thank you this is really helpful.

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If you don't want to be helped, then nothing anyone says is going to be helpful.

The actual reason why you are behind on renews and PoM casts is because you simply don't have the mana pool to support it, and it's going to be even more obvious as you do harder bosses than H Kargath.

Surge of Light is reserved when you have up-to-date spirit items in all possible slots/good mana trinkets as well as specific fights with specific strategy. Solace however is a universal talent that is fantastic on every fight(save maybe Brackenspore).

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While other holy priests are able to cope with players standing in fire, you can't. Until you accept that your inability to adapt is stopping you from improving, there's no point in going further than this.

I can cope with people standing in fire but you as well as me should know that people should not be standing in fire, if they do well what can we do? its out of our hands now.

I want help, but saying a talent choice is going to make or break the game, is like exaggeration to prove a point.
What has also been pointed out earlier but someone else.

What I want to do is be better at playing my class, so we might cut away 1 healer for more dps in future.

And also if you look at what is happening the reason im going oom is because im spamming flash heal, of cause I should not be doing that but else people would die simple as that, and no amount of mana regen is gonna be able to counter mass spamming of flash heal. at least not in this tier.

[Necessarily]

I only have mana problems going towards the end cause people usually goes herp a derp and stop focusing on surviving and more focusing on killing. But rest of the fight I am comfortable 50% and above.

As can be seen here. 2/3 of the fight I am above 50% mana then I start going down heavily https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...alse%240%24100

Actually its closer to 4/5 of the fight where I am around 50% then going down fast.

Here's what you should have linked : https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...100&graph=true
Your logs don't really bear out that assertion - you realize that the raid will naturally take more damage towards the end of the fight because the adds in the stands keep increasing and throwing more bombs...right? It's a soft enrage mechanic.

You didn't use a mana potion, but it looks like you ran out of mana just as the fight ended (I tend to hit mine earlier so I don't ever have to worry about getting an "OOM" message).

Frankly most fights are designed to get more hectic / damaging as they go on (Kargath, Butcher, Tectus, and Mar'Gok solidly fall in this category), so the assertion than you stay above 50% mana for the beginning parts of the fight is completely beside the point.

[Saphyron]

Here's what you should have linked : https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...100&graph=true
Your logs don't really bear out that assertion - you realize that the raid will naturally take more damage towards the end of the fight because the adds in the stands keep increasing and throwing more bombs...right? It's a soft enrage mechanic.

You didn't use a mana potion, but it looks like you ran out of mana just as the fight ended (I tend to hit mine earlier so I don't ever have to worry about getting an "OOM" message).

Frankly most fights are designed to get more hectic / damaging as they go on (Kargath, Butcher, Tectus, and Mar'Gok solidly fall in this category), so the assertion than you stay above 50% mana for the beginning parts of the fight is completely beside the point.

Fair enough, you seem to be reasoned with and not directly try to go nuts when I say something they don't agree with, what do you think I should have done better?

And yes I normally use a Mana potion but until the end there was no real need for it when I was looking at my mana bar and then suddenly fight is about to end and I have the OOM message.

[Deleted]

solace really doesn't grant that much more mana than mindbender anyway. Especially if you're gearing for haste and use it during timewarp. It doesn't take many lost casts of solace for mindbender to come out ahead. (as holy. if you're disc and would be casting holy fire anyway then it's a different story). I also don't like the hps loss of losing that GCD to be cast on such a low throughput spell.

In any case SoL offers comparable, if not better, mana returns by means of free flash heals (just count the procs and consider each one replaced a renew cast and it'll probably already beat out mana gains of solace). It also gives serendipity which results in extremely efficient healing from prayer of healing, much harder to math out from logs but SoL really isn't bad at all, especially on fights where you can't really optimize cascade so you take star anyway.
I mentioned elsewhere on these forums my issues with SoL. Namely, it's RNG. In theory you could go a 10min fight without a single proc. And that I don't like losing cascade on fights where it's useful (most of the mana intensive fights in highmaul except butcher)

as for your logs. Looking at the butcher log it just looks like you used a lot of prayer of healing. Spamming renew on the debuffed people for more CoHs should be the more efficient method. Overall on your logs though it just looks like too many healers. The hps from everyone is just super low, if nobody is dying then it's not really a case of needing to improve your healing rather than wanting to improve your sniping. :/
Regarding Koragh (your progress boss?) it doesn't look like a healing issue. People are dying to mechanics rather than raid damage. Lots of people blown up by not spreading with the fire debuff. The rest almost exclusively killed by unsoaked orbs reaching the ground (overflowing energy). A few people dying to suppression fields so that's just a case of watching their feet (or avoiding the trample, not sure if that's a separate damage ability)

[xhisors]

While other holy priests are able to cope with players standing in fire, you can't. Until you accept that your inability to adapt is stopping you from improving, there's no point in going further than this.

Why do you come to threads just to bash/talk trash instead of being helpful? Why not trying contributing your experience.. mind blowing concept.

OP: What I could suggest even though I haven't done PvE in a while but I do have heroic progression experience from wrath and cata. Is to work on keeping your overhealz as low as possible. Be efficient with CoH and PoM(anticipate damage for PoM don't react to it), don't just use them on CD because you can. If nobody is taking damage just throw some healz on the tank and use normal heal. Anticipate when damage is coming in, and watch people and where they are moving instead of tunneling the raid frame. If you see someone standing in fire for longer than a second, grip them out.

High HPS come with efficiency. Healing has a billion play styles, maybe you could try utilizing mindbender to help late game with mana? If you use it on CD the mana return is pretty good overall.

[Saphyron]

Why do you come to threads just to bash/talk trash instead of being helpful? Why not trying contributing your experience.. mind blowing concept.

OP: What I could suggest even though I haven't done PvE in a while but I do have heroic progression experience from wrath and cata. Is to work on keeping your overhealz as low as possible. Be efficient with CoH and PoM(anticipate damage for PoM don't react to it), don't just use them on CD because you can. If nobody is taking damage just throw some healz on the tank and use normal heal. Anticipate when damage is coming in, and watch people and where they are moving instead of tunneling the raid frame. If you see someone standing in fire for longer than a second, grip them out.

High HPS come with efficiency. Healing has a billion play styles, maybe you could try utilizing mindbender to help late game with mana? If you use it on CD the mana return is pretty good overall.

So basicly what the last 2 people is pointing out is that mindbender has really good mana income, and as long I don't use it at full mana its good to have.

Pretty bad at utilizing prayer of mending that I have to improve on. A LOT! and thanks for pointing out.

Personally I prefer surge of light on fights where people is spread out and take random damages cause I can save it and then spot heal them to full health.

But I can see the gain of mindbender considering it gives a bit lower than 1% mana every hit. every 60 sec.
PI Is awesome if it still reduces mana cost, can't remember if it does, but it seems pretty wasted otherwise if its random damage going out all the time Could see it better utilized on ko'ragh with the expel magic shadow.

Hard choices tbh. Ill keep in mind solace but as of now with my personal skill I know I will fuck it up and it will be worse of for me than using the others.

Anything else you can point out.