Mythic Butcher : Is tanking him in the water considered an exploit?

[Gihelle]

This seems like as much of an exploit as triforce was on heroic Ragnaros.

(reference in case you didn't do bleeding edge progression then: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/3657436442)

[Brytallica]

This is no different than standing in the doorway when fighting heroic Twin Valkyries to avoid having most of the raid dodge/soak the black and white orbs. They never fixed this or punished anyone for using this boss positioning.

[wowaccounttom]

unless you go bragging about how you "exploited" the fight.... no one is going to care... the race is over.

[xiic]

It'll become an exploit if Overture kills the boss this way.

[Well]

Since when using the adds and the position of the boss to your advantage constitutes any form of exploiting? The people that found out about this tactic were simply smart, and if blizzard takes any action against them, it will simply be terrible of them. With that said, I do not think that Blizzard would even consider doing anything about it. I don't remember a time when devs announced that "defeating an encounter with a tactic we didn't think of when we made said encounter is exploiting".

Lol woot.

[alucardtnuoc]

Moving butcher so adds come from one direction isn't an exploit.
Pulling twin ogrons out of the room and resetting them making it so they don't use their Mythic abilities, that is an exploit.

[DakonBlackblade]

It looks like it treads on the fine line of "not what the encounter was designed for" and "clever use of game mechanics". I wouldn't expect a ban, but more likely a fix on Blizzard's part.

Pretty much this, its like the Brackenspore situation with the macro that lets you burn moss gaining almost no heat on your weapon. Blizz fixed that one probably will fix this one if it is fixable, but I believe it wont be and the way the room is designed will go down as an oversight by Blizz and theyll learn a lesson for this encounter and not design rooms like this anymore in encounter where you have to soak something that converges on the boss.

[Dasani]

Honestly I despise the fact that people want a line to exist between what is an exploit and what is clever use of game mechanics in the first place. I believe just about anything in the game should be fair game. If you find a boss in another zone/raid and get ported into the raid to make a fight easier, that is clever use of game mechanics. If blizzard doesn't like it, they should make it impossible to do, but not punish the people who did it. Makes no sense.

Only thing i'd say is actually exploiting would be some kind of bug like taking off and putting on your gear very quickly causing your stats to keep going up or something silly like that. That is an exploit. But use any abilities and powers and positioning and items that exist in game in any kind of combination should NEVER be considered an exploit. My opinion at least. They can always fix and prevent what they don't like, but punishing people for using mechanics that exist in game is retarded.

[Simulacrum]

I assume the people calling this an exploit would've suffered an aneurism if they had seen fights like vanilla razorgore and the circus that was the merry-go-round of add handling for that fight.

Pathetic.

[CausalXXLinkXx]

Pretty sure this is going to be fixed. Not sure why after so many kills.

[Deleted]

Its definitely an exploit. Massively embarrassing for the guilds who had to use this to kill it week 1.

[jjbarea]

so my question is, what if paragon used this during their kill(they did.) would it be legit ?

[thsoern]

That is cleary not an exploit guys lol.

[Matt0193]

You sound like you almost believe it yourself.

Why would you not believe it? Rogues, at least, had Saronite Bombs in their rotation. I would assume any proficient DPS would have it with a spare GCD, I personally didn't as a FDK because I didn't have a spare GCD, at least FF proc'ed more than twice over 20s. Should they have stopped using the Bombs? Probably, but in that same vein Blizzard should've tested the fight as a proper DPS and used things that Players had been using the entire expansion. I thought banning them was harsh, especially when most of the blame is on Blizzard for not thoroughly testing a fight that was never made public, at least I don't remember it ever being on the ptr.

[Deleted]

They should just give Butcher a buff if they reach him. And no the fight isn't "just as hard" this way.

That's like saying if you could position Brackenspore so Spore Shooters and Fungal Flesh-Eaters weren't part of the fight it would be just as hard.

[Deleted]

Some of you really need to look up what classifies as an exploit, when you take out a significant part of the encounter that the gamedesigners intended to be there, by taking advantage of something the gamedesigner didn't think of it then is an exploit. It does not matter wether that person was punished or not that really only talks about the severity of the exploit.

Here's another "exploit" that per some of you guys definition would have been totally okay "use of mechnics"...

[Deleted]

It makes the fight slightly easier, but doesnt really change what the fight is about: dps check.

Is it intended? Probably not. Is it a bug? Nope. It could've very easily been hotfixed by just making the boss not leave the circle, or simply going back to the center every time he charges.

They probably don't care since it doesn't really change too much about the fight, and it makes the fight more viable for groups without enough ranged.

[Deleted]

unless you go bragging about how you "exploited" the fight.... no one is going to care... the race is over.

I´d guess that about 99% of the WoW population don´t care about "the race" so this is still relevant.

[Novaflare]

More like tanking Twin Val'kyr in the door in ToC and no one got banned for that.

Yeah, this. I don't see how this is any different than the door strat or the "bitch" strat on Iron Juggernaught hc.

[Raiju]

When I used to raid in BC. My guild never tanked a boss in the same spot 80% of the time. Mother Sharaz was tanked at the door going to Counsel. Illidan was bounced back and forth across his area. Counsel was tanked all over the place. Rogue bottom left, paladin bottom right. Mage top left and Priest top right. Bloodboil Orc was tanked south of his pull spot into the right water. Gorefiend was on the stairs from his pull. My point is, if there's room to move a boss. People will do it, it's better for positioning.

Also to note, there's not a rule by Blizzard that we must "Tank On Spot" Please show me where this information is. I'd love to read it.

Did I say they did? No.

What I said was pretty much everyone on beta and most on live were tanking on spot, because there was no reason to move it so it likely wasn't thought of.