Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
It's not the 2000s anymore, wikipedia has cited all the info on what I linked.
It looks about on par to me, except Sw/Sh also has awards won. /shrug
not sure where you're getting "Much more negative".
As I said, I'm not a fan of going by user scores in general. Review bombing is the extreme example, but the phrase "everyone's a critic" comes to mind, in a more sarcastic way.
Welcome to my point finally.
Or did you miss Val giving a huge list of "removed" features which was why I pointed out specifically R/S was the first to remove a ton of features? Either that, or you're genuinely missing my overarching point.
If you disagree with it being the worst, fine. You're entitled to feel that way. But the fact is that it did pretty lackluster even at the time, considering all it had to be compared to. And yet years later we have people calling it the "golden age".
I didn't handwave anything by saying "nostalgia". You said this at the time-
"I think you're missing some very critical context here. Ruby and Sapphire are over 15 years old. There was far less precedent for what a Pokemon game was and Sword and Shield weren't preceded by games that people found disappointing in X and Y and Sun and Moon. Additionally, Pokemon Sword and Shield were going to be the first Pokemon games on a home console and that obviously comes with higher expectations."
What you did highlight there was saying that "people have been disappointed in the last few generations", which to me mostly comes off from people having nostalgia for the first few gens.
I would say this can be shown by critic review of X/Y being one of the highest for Pokemon, and even now past the games release after it was criticized, now people are up in arms about how good features in X/Y were. But people enjoy dismissing critics reviews while acting as if the user ones are better so not sure what good that would do.
At the very least, there's notable reason why R/S could be considered one of the weakest, just as people make the same argument for Sw/Sh. That's all I'm trying to draw attention to, that from what I see that R/S are the weakest entries objectively. Whether or not you agree in the end, the point still stands I feel that the argument at least could be made. And ultimately that's all I care for, that people can at least reflect on it while trying to minimize their bias for older generations.
Last edited by Jester Joe; 2021-10-01 at 06:57 PM.
"El Psy Kongroo!" Hearthstone Moderator
Last edited by Darththeo; 2021-10-01 at 07:44 PM.
Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
–The Sith Code
Yeah, somehow people think that gen 1 and 2 were hard. They were inconvenient at most with possible situations like rival fight after a cave or something, but that's hardly "difficult", as walking back there means you'll either just use a repel or use potions before the re-fight and then steamroll the rival anyways. Somehow people pretend that going through a cave in gen 1 and 2 is like surviving a war or something, that you barely escape the thing alive with maybe an arm and leg only to get shot afterwards.
"El Psy Kongroo!" Hearthstone Moderator
i have no idea what is going on here.
Anemo: traveler, Sucrose
Pyro: Yanfei, Amber, diluc, xiangling, thoma, Xinyan, Bennett
Geo: Noelle, Ningguang, Yun Jin, Gorou
Hydro: Barbara, Zingqiu, Ayato
Cyro: Shenhe, Kaeya, Chongyun, Diona, Ayaka, Rosaria
Electro: Fischl, Lisa, Miko, Kujou, Raiden, Razor
As a little kid I didn't need hand holding in video games like so many these days have. I swear video games too often try and treat the players like they are stupid. Not all of us are game journalist levels of stupid and inept at beating games as adults and as children we were far more capable of beating very difficult games and didn't whine about it.
A lot of people have a tendency to vastly underestimate what kids are capable of if you just stick a controller in their hands and leave them to explore a game, especially in games as linear and at a surface level as mechanically simple as Pokemon have always been.
The whole "it's for kids!" argument in favour of pokemon rivals being as they have been of late and not more like how they used to be, vastly underestimates those same kids.
Yeah, and games can have a challenge level that might be easy for adults but challenging enough for kids. I know some young adults who only play the modded Pokemon games with the randomizers or having fixed Pokemon for an entire playthrough, because those are things that kids might not be interested in but can still make a relatively easy game more challenging for adults.
For what it's worth, you were also more than likely playing games with only a d pad for movement and with only like, 2-6 buttons at most. While also having barebone features.
I don't think anyone can deny that Pokemon's become far more complex than it was at the start at least. Although it's also not the best game for an example like this, probably would be better to compare something like Super Mario 64 even to Super Mario Galaxy in terms of movement/controls. Granted, N64 controller was a bit more than D Pad and a few buttons, the controller overall was still more bare than current controllers.
"El Psy Kongroo!" Hearthstone Moderator
Anemo: traveler, Sucrose
Pyro: Yanfei, Amber, diluc, xiangling, thoma, Xinyan, Bennett
Geo: Noelle, Ningguang, Yun Jin, Gorou
Hydro: Barbara, Zingqiu, Ayato
Cyro: Shenhe, Kaeya, Chongyun, Diona, Ayaka, Rosaria
Electro: Fischl, Lisa, Miko, Kujou, Raiden, Razor
I will get my Switch OLED hopefully next Friday. This is my first entry into nintendo eco system, anything I need to know?
pokemon has always had flaws. nothing new there.
what is good or bad will always be personal opinions.
i enjoyed sun, moon, ultra sun, and ultra moon but i consider it one of the bottom tier for me.
also as much i find the exp all from X, Y, and beyond, i feel like it has ruined me if i go back to play older games.
i still havent played Soul silver, heart gold, white 2, or black 2. i would like to at some point but i dont know how i will feel about going back to the old school grind.
anyway play what you enjoy not what you hate.
Anemo: traveler, Sucrose
Pyro: Yanfei, Amber, diluc, xiangling, thoma, Xinyan, Bennett
Geo: Noelle, Ningguang, Yun Jin, Gorou
Hydro: Barbara, Zingqiu, Ayato
Cyro: Shenhe, Kaeya, Chongyun, Diona, Ayaka, Rosaria
Electro: Fischl, Lisa, Miko, Kujou, Raiden, Razor