1. #2121
    Just a thing re the beastmen, heardstones and AI passivity.

    It clearly has no idea what to do with the ruination mechanic, it will just sit armies in a ruined blood ground waiting for the 'timer' they added to stop endless ruin inhabitation that will never come because of ruination but also just not attack the heardstone.
    In my malagor run Eshin has 3-4 shit stacks just running around in ruined blood grounds doing nothing.
    Tonight for me is a special day. I want to go outside of the house of the girl I like with a gasoline barrel and write her name on the road and set it on fire and tell her to get out too see it (is this illegal)?

  2. #2122
    Quote Originally Posted by RadasNoir View Post
    Again, it feels like the AI refuses to fight at all unless the odds are overwhelmingly in its favor. Like, not even when it has a slight advantage or if things would be evenly matched. Only if it is a 200% guaranteed win for the AI.

    I agree that I don't want the opposite either, where the AI stupidly rushes into fights where it's horribly over-matched, but I can't help feeling like there can be a middle ground between being stupid and overly-cautious.

    I guess I could also give the harder difficulties a try at some point, just to see what you guys mean when you say the AI is more aggressive in those.
    That's really not the case, so I don't know what to say other than that.

  3. #2123
    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    Beastmen in general are just busted now, no two ways about it. They have crazy fast recruitment, grow much faster than any other horde, the AI is always hesitant to attack Herdstones, lose a unit? who cares, you can recruit them again in 1 turn right after, 3\4 of their LLs are OP as fuck (Malagor being even more overpowered than Taurox at high levels), Taurox's mechanics just add more to the faction's inherent OPness. It's my big issue with the rework, they basically removed all their weaknesses and amplified their strengths. Khazrak is the only somewhat balanced Beastmen start now, and even then he's still very, very strong.

    The Dwarf rework does a much better job of updating the faction and giving them new toys without dialing their power level up the stratosphere.


    As for the AI, it used to be very passive, I feel that it's just fine now. Their obsession with trashing minor settlements then running away is annoying but a valid strategy in the hands of the player as well so can't complain about that. 3K did have the best AI however.
    turns out no recruitment cost and no upkeep breaks the game.
    Who could have guessed?
    It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death

  4. #2124
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerraw View Post
    With it being the newest entry, hopefully that's a good sign for WH3's AI though.
    Depends on how many of AI devs are shared between the games, I guess. We know TW games have different teams working on them, but I guess core systems such as AI may have mostly the same team. So yeah, we can hope.

    Quote Originally Posted by RadasNoir View Post
    So it does actually vary from game-to-game? I have to admit, I've only played Warhammer 2 to any significant degree, although I have very briefly touched both Shogun 2 and 3 Kingdoms.

    And I feel like I'm phrasing it wrong when I put the AI's behavior as either "offensive" or "defensive". Like Saltysquidoon said, it's more that it's "cowardly". The AI (again, at least in Warhammer) tends to absolutely refuse to fight unless it majorly has the upper hand. It has no problem ransacking defenseless settlements or going after solitary lords (one of the ways you can trick it into an ambush), but it will just hole up in a walled city, building up it's forces, if there's any army nearby that could even remotely challenge it on even ground. The idea might be to make the AI seem "smarter" or more "challenging", but it just ends up being tedious. Again, it feels like I spend more time trying to figure how to get the AI fight me, than actually fighting the AI. At least in the early stages of the game; maybe it stops mattering later on in the game when you're strong enough to just roll over the AI no matter where they try to hide. While I've played Warhammer the most, I have yet to actually make it to the "late game", partially because I get frustrated with playing cat-and-mouse with the AI at the start.
    It definitely does vary. It doesn't even depend on the age of the game, Shogun 2 has way better AI than Rome 2, for example. No arguing about the bunkering, the thing is that AI obviously depends on auto-resolve results when initiating battles. If auto-resolve shows it will win, it will attack outside of a settlement, otherwise it will hole up. That's why it's more aggressive on higher difficulties, it's because AI handicaps will very often show a victory for it despite having much worse armies. Which creates a whole new problem, especially late game, that is having to play a ton of battles manually because AI will keep spamming trash armies that will still be calculated by AI as stronger due to handicaps, but when played manually, you destroy 90% of them while losing 10 soldiers without even cheesing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Maxos View Post
    When you play the game of MMOs, you win or you go f2p.

  5. #2125
    Thought I would start a Clan Angrund campaign to see the Dwarf changes.
    I'm in the middle of the Badlands occupying Eight Peaks, and all I see around me is green.

    Thorgrim got deleted by around turn 30. Barak Varr by about turn 10.
    Didn't remember the Greenskin AI being this dominant, but haven't played a Dawi campaign for a while.

  6. #2126
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerraw View Post
    Well, I went to grab the gold mines IN THE MOUNTAINS. Does that count?
    I am getting the Book...
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadoowpunk View Post
    Take that haters.
    IF IM STUPID, so is Donald Trump.

  7. #2127
    Quote Originally Posted by Easo View Post
    I am getting the Book...
    Too late. Greenskins and Skaven got every single Dwarf faction by turn 50.

  8. #2128
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorsameth View Post
    turns out no recruitment cost and no upkeep breaks the game.
    Who could have guessed?
    Only if you have decent units. Skelly boys are fine

  9. #2129
    Legendary! Flurryfang's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobby B View Post
    Thought I would start a Clan Angrund campaign to see the Dwarf changes.
    I'm in the middle of the Badlands occupying Eight Peaks, and all I see around me is green.

    Thorgrim got deleted by around turn 30. Barak Varr by about turn 10.
    Didn't remember the Greenskin AI being this dominant, but haven't played a Dawi campaign for a while.
    Ohh the greenskins get so much power from their first Waagh, that they just kill the dwarfs outright in the first 20 turns or so. No matter what, you always end up with a problem from grimgor if you play something that does not directly deal with them.
    May the lore be great and the stories interesting. A game without a story, is a game without a soul. Value the lore and it will reward you with fun!

    Don't let yourself be satisfied with what you expect and what you seem as obvious. Ask for something good, surprising and better. Your own standards ends up being other peoples standard.

  10. #2130
    Quote Originally Posted by Flurryfang View Post
    Ohh the greenskins get so much power from their first Waagh, that they just kill the dwarfs outright in the first 20 turns or so. No matter what, you always end up with a problem from grimgor if you play something that does not directly deal with them.
    Its nice when gameplay is lore accurate :P

  11. #2131
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorsameth View Post
    turns out no recruitment cost and no upkeep breaks the game.
    Who could have guessed?
    Yeah, IMO Beastmen units should still have had a recruitment cost, just not an upkeep one, so there's at least something stopping you from instantly re-recruiting any casualty at full strength. That and I feel high-tier units should only have been available from Herdstones, or cost Dread to recruit away from said Herdstones.

    I'm actually playing Mazdamundi instead of the new LLs, his campaign has always been fun and it's even better with the new units and aggressive knife-ears. Coatls are fairly niche and their animation look silly on the ground but they're fun to use and the RoR version looks spectacular. Trogolodons are basically Ancient Sally 2.0, which is not a bad thing but sadly Sally herself seemingly had to be nerfed to worthlessness to make way for them. And the Stalkers have grown on me, their melee damage is really high and their darts quite effective, they make full Skink armies ever more viable.

    Once that's done I'll do a Thorek Mortal Empires run. I tried him in Vortex a bit but I'll be tired of Lustria soon enough, and sending grandpa to teach the rats and mummies some proper grudgin' will be fun.
    It is all that is left unsaid upon which tragedies are built -Kreia

  12. #2132
    Legendary! Flurryfang's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aliven View Post
    Its nice when gameplay is lore accurate :P
    Hehe that is true, but its a situation where i really miss TW2 having like random AI modifiers, that changes how the AI battles goes

    Because i would really love to see empire and dwarfs join up again, but atm it never happens. When you can rely on the orcs destroying the south, you do become a little bored of seeing so much green Especially since dwarfs are my favorite AI opponent
    May the lore be great and the stories interesting. A game without a story, is a game without a soul. Value the lore and it will reward you with fun!

    Don't let yourself be satisfied with what you expect and what you seem as obvious. Ask for something good, surprising and better. Your own standards ends up being other peoples standard.

  13. #2133
    There's something wrong with Grimgor since the greenskin rework. I don't know if it's confed changes or (I suspect) either black orcs being massively overvalued in AR or something to do with how Da Immortalz banner works in AR. But he completely obliterates the dwarfs/southern realms and rats every single campaign I'm not present for.

    The troglodon will 100% be nerfed because of the oracle (and MP). It does obscene damage, the spittle is anti-large but it still chunks footlords and the caster has sustain, chaff clearing spells and it's good enough in melee you can't catch it out. Probably the best non lord caster in the game.
    Tonight for me is a special day. I want to go outside of the house of the girl I like with a gasoline barrel and write her name on the road and set it on fire and tell her to get out too see it (is this illegal)?

  14. #2134
    The trog better not be nerfed - the ancient sally was neutered to appease the MP crowd already. Of all the things that need nerfing in the dlc, the trog should not be at the top of the list.

    I actually had my first setback in my legendary run - I had an army wiped out. For most campaigns that would be painful. For this I barely noticed it. I had a level 2 melee lord with a bunch of chaff units - mostly gor, with a few ungor and chaos warhounds - sitting in ambush. Then Tretch came up and of course ambushed me. He had a supporting army as well. So Two lords, 3 heroes, a doom wheel, a bunch of gold chevron night and gutter runners, some storm vermin and plenty of clan rats and slaves. Did some serious damage, including almost killing Tretch and the doom wheel, before my army broke.

    Then they attacked the remnants again only for Tretch to die and his army break, loosing a number of units, including the doom wheel. But no respite was given as a third army then came and wiped out the tattered remnants of my army.

    The skaven had taken such heavy losses that they couldn't press on to the herdstone. So I just raised a new lord (who was higher level than the one I had lost) and two turns later the army was back again, before the skaven had even recovered from their losses.

  15. #2135
    The new dwarven lord is kinda insane and fun to play with too.
    200armor
    insane melee/atk
    good DMG

    and Quarrelers have like ~90 range power and decent AP.

    The early game is pretty intense with lots of wars and fights that are worth fighting due to how different the armies are all around you.
    Skaven, HE, Lizardmen, Dark Elves for the vortex campaign. (Itza, Sotek, Pestilence, Skryre, Blessed Dread, Tomb-girl, Order)

    Lizardmen, orcs, skaven, tombkings, woodelves for the mortal empires campaign. (Red-skaven clan, tomb-girl, fat gobbo-orc, Confederation with Azul will make you fight Grimgor, etc. etc.)

    lots of legendary lords all around you as well, most of them just hate you with the exception of tomb-girl, which means they are far more aggressive and powerful than what most other legendary lords face in the first 30 turns.

    Empire for example only has to fight Carstein, the rest are all minor factions and most of the time, very friendly towards you. (Brettonia for example)
    Last edited by KrayZ33; 2021-07-19 at 12:40 PM.

  16. #2136
    Quote Originally Posted by KrayZ33 View Post
    The new dwarven lord is kinda insane and fun to play with too.
    200armor
    insane melee/atk
    good DMG

    and Quarrelers have like ~90 range power and decent AP.

    The early game is pretty intense with lots of wars and fights that are worth fighting due to how different the armies are all around you.
    Skaven, HE, Lizardmen, Dark Elves for the vortex campaign. (Itza, Sotek, Pestilence, Skryre, Blessed Dread, Tomb-girl, Order)

    Lizardmen, orcs, skaven, tombkings, woodelves for the mortal empires campaign. (Red-skaven clan, tomb-girl, fat gobbo-orc, Confederation with Azul will make you fight Grimgor, etc. etc.)

    lots of legendary lords all around you as well, most of them just hate you with the exception of tomb-girl, which means they are far more aggressive and powerful than what most other legendary lords face in the first 30 turns.

    Empire for example only has to fight Carstein, the rest are all minor factions and most of the time, very friendly towards you. (Brettonia for example)
    Can easily cheese sieges with wrath of ruin or whetever its called seeing as you can use it unlimited amount of times if you turn of timer.

    Nice starting area too just rush clan moors and kroqgar and you have a very safe position.

    Love the new Runes too some very nice ones for your lords and banners for the units specially that unbreakable carnossaur is very handy.
    Do you hear the voices too?

  17. #2137
    Quote Originally Posted by Flurryfang View Post
    Hehe that is true, but its a situation where i really miss TW2 having like random AI modifiers, that changes how the AI battles goes

    Because i would really love to see empire and dwarfs join up again, but atm it never happens. When you can rely on the orcs destroying the south, you do become a little bored of seeing so much green Especially since dwarfs are my favorite AI opponent
    Wasnt the chad order tide vs virgin chaos ai vs ai when left alone? Like, nuke Bretonia and Empire or they conquer everything? Just asking, did not played for a couple of months.

  18. #2138
    https://www.totalwar.com/blog/total-...eptember-news/

    Dont expect any news in the coming month, but at least they confirm that next reveal will be Cathay, siege battles, pre-order bonus faction and they teased some Daemon units.

    Lastly, they say that they have "some surprise that no one is expecting" in store for us.

  19. #2139
    I miss being able to replenish with Dwarves after battles :/

    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    https://www.totalwar.com/blog/total-...eptember-news/

    Dont expect any news in the coming month, but at least they confirm that next reveal will be Cathay, siege battles, pre-order bonus faction and they teased some Daemon units.

    Lastly, they say that they have "some surprise that no one is expecting" in store for us.
    Glad they are, the past month+ of drip feed advertising has been tedious as fuck, its a bad strategy, I get building hype but release info in big meaty chunks, not a trail of crumbs.

  20. #2140
    So no news until September and then a lot coming. If they are still aiming for a 2021 then they are fast running out of time, given how much is left to reveal.

    People think that the Ogre Kingdoms are pretty much confirmed as the pre-order bonus, given that the article spoke of 'fulfilling your hunger' about it. OK seems an odd choice given they and the chaos dwarves would seem the logical choice for the campaign packs. If they use the OK for pre-order and not a campaign pack what does that leave? The talk about how WH3 is a massive game (have mercy on my poor computer) and the talk of major surprises they doubt people have seen coming is interesting. Hints at maybe Ind and/or Nippon?

    Oh, and a diplomacy upgrade. If it is just the one from 3K I'd be happy. Diplomacy in wh2 is horrible. Free money from a trade agreement? Nah, can't be having that. You are a skaven and I'm a high elf? Sure, I'll join forces with you to fight an enemy that has done nothing to me.

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