Page 1 of 2
1
2
LastLast
  1. #1
    Banned A dot Ham's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    America, you great unfinished symphony.
    Posts
    6,525

    New Champions too complicated? Riot losing sight?

    Its rough to lose friends when a game grows/develops.

    I think that is the beauty of some console games. You know what is really great about goldeneye 007 on N64? I can pop it in and its still the same as it was in 1997. That being said in some ways its great to see things change and develop, both visually, and mechanically.

    Personally I think riot is starting to lose sight of what makes LoL great, what makes dota games great. What is that? How deceptively simple they are.

    4 abilities 2 summoner spells

    now granted it becomes a little more complex with talents, runes, passives, itemization.

    But at its basic core its you vs someone else and your use of the 6 buttons/keys vs their use of those 6 buttons/keys and though seemingly incredibly simple you can a vast skill difference between players.

    Now in may cases items have made the game more complexed particularly in the last 2 years, we are seeing more and more active ability items. (which adds more keys/buttons to press)

    Now granted new champions don't necessarily have MORE abilities, but they have a lot more IF this, than THIS. To them, more situational utility and variables built in, that make them considerably more complex than the original lineup from 2009. Gnar, Ekko, Bard, Rek'Sai, Kalista, Jinx, Thresh, Zed, Jayce, Ezreal.

    Now I really don't want to turn this into a personal flavor thread (though each person is going to have their own tastes that will make a certain champion easier or more difficult to play/master)

    I think where this becomes an issue is in matchmaking, in the hands of pro player, even a simplistic champion is going to do work on a less skilled player, however give that pro player a champion with the utility of some of these champion, add in their ability to juggle these active ability items, and you have a foe that is essentially in god mode.

    I think by keeping it MORE simple, you detract from the possibility that this will occur, or the effect it will have on the psyche of a new player/less skilled player.

  2. #2
    So you want champions with the complexity of Ryze? Just look are pre-rework Ashe compared to her current form. She is so much more fun to play than she used to be, more complexity is a good thing,

  3. #3
    Titan Charge me Doctor's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Russia, Chelyabinsk (Tankograd)
    Posts
    13,849
    No, they are not "too" complicated. I personally know a person who thinks that they are too complicated, she is in gold 1 right now and she clicks flash and items because she can't handle more than 4 buttons. For these people - yes, they are too complicated, but for an average person - they are not. Complexity is what actually started saving LoL (for me), because i was so tired of playing Twitch (and all the fucking bugs with his ultimate), Garen, Taric, (pre-rework) Veigar and Rene (they are my best characters by far). Small rework on Veigar, small rework on Rene, fix of one of Twitches many ult bugs made me play the game again. Not for that long tho. Now they release Ekko and i play again because "pub meta" switched a little.
    Quote Originally Posted by Urban Dictionary
    Russians are a nation inhabiting territory of Russia an ex-USSR countries. Russians enjoy drinking vodka and listening to the bears playing button-accordions. Russians are open- and warm- hearted. They are ready to share their last prianik (russian sweet cookie) with guests, in case lasts encounter that somewhere. Though, it's almost unreal, 'cos russians usually hide their stuff well.

  4. #4
    Pit Lord Anium's Avatar
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Outside ORG sending your children down the mines.
    Posts
    2,424
    Complicated for some perhaps, but not all. There are plenty of "simple" point and click heros out there. More does not mean less and less does not mean more, if you catch my drift.
    If you're also talking about meta picks and what wins what, that's a different matter entirely.
    Personally, complexity is good, keeps it spicy.

    SideNote Doctor: You know someone in G1 who clicks flash, that's interesting...

  5. #5
    Titan Charge me Doctor's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Russia, Chelyabinsk (Tankograd)
    Posts
    13,849
    Quote Originally Posted by Anium View Post
    SideNote Doctor: You know someone in G1 who clicks flash, that's interesting...
    Just to clarify, by clicking i mean dragging mouse cursor down to flash icon, clicking it, dragging cursor up to place she wanted to flash and clicking LMB. I had my jaw dropped when i've seen that. Also some tidbits from out conversation on Ashe rework:
    "they made Volley too hard to land"
    "the Owl is useless now i don't even level it"
    "her new Q makes no sense"
    "enemy can just pick Yi and you lost the game"

    And somehow she have got into gold one. There is huge amount of people playing this game, off course there will be people who think that even simplest champions are quite complicated, it's not something that's unexpected or surprising
    Last edited by Charge me Doctor; 2015-06-09 at 09:37 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Urban Dictionary
    Russians are a nation inhabiting territory of Russia an ex-USSR countries. Russians enjoy drinking vodka and listening to the bears playing button-accordions. Russians are open- and warm- hearted. They are ready to share their last prianik (russian sweet cookie) with guests, in case lasts encounter that somewhere. Though, it's almost unreal, 'cos russians usually hide their stuff well.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    Just to clarify, by clicking i mean dragging mouse cursor down to flash icon, clicking it, dragging cursor up to place she wanted to flash and clicking LMB. I had my jaw dropped when i've seen that. Also some tidbits from out conversation on Ashe rework:
    "they made Volley too hard to land"
    "the Owl is useless now i don't even level it"
    "her new Q makes no sense"
    "enemy can just pick Yi and you lost the game"

    And somehow she have got into gold one. There is huge amount of people playing this game, off course there will be people who think that even simplest champions are quite complicated, it's not something that's unexpected or surprising
    Sorry to burst your bubble, but that is plainly impossible. As a Dia3 player, noone gets gold 1 playing as you are describing, and if you have played at all you know it too. Maybe it was a boost, maybe you were being trolled... I don't really know, but that did NOT happen

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    Just to clarify, by clicking i mean dragging mouse cursor down to flash icon, clicking it, dragging cursor up to place she wanted to flash and clicking LMB. I had my jaw dropped when i've seen that. Also some tidbits from out conversation on Ashe rework:
    I got to platinum playing like that (Summoners and items not bound), although i do have it bound now.

    As for the OP, I don't think any champion out now is too complicated to the point where it should be changed. I mean i would only list 2-3 on your list as even complicated. Ez, Jinx, and Thresh aren't any more difficult then other similar champions. Even the most technically difficult champions though are at max just a matter of playing them for more then 2-3 games and getting the hang of them. I still don't play Zed because I find my performance on him underwhelming, but if I played more I could easily learn some little tricks and get much better at him.

    Even the simplest champion in the hands of someone who hasn't played them a lot will be significantly worse then those who have. More complex champions just exacerbate this, but never to the point of it being too hard to master.

    Quote Originally Posted by Inthislzon View Post
    Sorry to burst your bubble, but that is plainly impossible. As a Dia3 player, noone gets gold 1 playing as you are describing, and if you have played at all you know it too. Maybe it was a boost, maybe you were being trolled... I don't really know, but that did NOT happen
    You are greatly overestimating how good players are at Gold/Platinum. I got to Plat without items/summs bound and for the most part that wasn't even the major thing holding me back.

  8. #8
    Personally i find it a good thing with more complexity. I haven't played the game for something like 3-4 years now. Got a bit tired of the simplicity of the classes you'dd played well.
    They have so many heroes that it's still a lot of work to jump into the game, since you need to know them all. Hence it's not really easy to jump into the game for a new player. Or a returning oldie for that matter.
    I remember Nidalee had more than most, which made her more interesting.
    Everyone has so much to say
    They talk talk talk their lives away

  9. #9
    Titan Charge me Doctor's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Russia, Chelyabinsk (Tankograd)
    Posts
    13,849
    Quote Originally Posted by Inthislzon View Post
    Sorry to burst your bubble, but that is plainly impossible. As a Dia3 player, noone gets gold 1 playing as you are describing, and if you have played at all you know it too. Maybe it was a boost, maybe you were being trolled... I don't really know, but that did NOT happen
    It is entirely possible. Basically, anyone can get gold X by simply spamming games. 50% winrate is enough to get there (you lose less LP than you get from wins), you just have to play enough games.
    If you have spammed enough of soloq games to get into diamond - you know what kind of players sit in gold league

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Faltemer View Post
    As for the OP, I don't think any champion out now is too complicated to the point where it should be changed. I mean i would only list 2-3 on your list as even complicated. Ez, Jinx, and Thresh aren't any more difficult then other similar champions. Even the most technically difficult champions though are at max just a matter of playing them for more then 2-3 games and getting the hang of them. I still don't play Zed because I find my performance on him underwhelming, but if I played more I could easily learn some little tricks and get much better at him.

    Even the simplest champion in the hands of someone who hasn't played them a lot will be significantly worse then those who have. More complex champions just exacerbate this, but never to the point of it being too hard to master.
    I would say that some of these character have means to help themselves. For example, Thresh - it's quite hard to land a max range hook - but it's easy to land point-blank one. You also have a CC ability that is almost impossible to miss and that buys you enough time to perfectly land a hook on CCed target that can't even get tenacity to stop you from doing that - all your target can do is not be in range of your CC ability.

    There is character like, say, Veigar, with ridiculously strong abilities (his W in this case) but extremely (almost impossible) to land by itself, you have to prepare your target (some sort of CC) and with his instant CC being removed - his own CC is now also hard (far from impossible) to land by itself (in no means it's like "hit or miss" ability, it still have a lot of planning to it and even if enemy manages to not get stunned you can drop W on his ass and make a tough decision - eat a stun (while you just spent 1 second laughing at Veigar that didn't managed to stun you) and dodge W (resulting in extra 2 seconds of being "CCed") or eat the damage and wait walls to expire). So when you bring, say a teammate with instant CC (Mao) it gets significantly easier to both land your W and chain CC to keep target in place. Overall, Veigar is far from complicated champion, but most of his damage comes from W that either requires enemy to play dumb, you to play extremely good or teamplay, and getting your damage cut in, well, basically half makes your in-game life much harder than, say, (trigger warning: exaggeration) Syndra, who just spam balls and finish enemy off with ult regardless of amount of missed Qs.

    On the other hand, you have characters like Vel'koz, he have means to secure his combo (via E) but it's slow, unreliable when enemy sees its coming (except point-blank range). But he has low mana costs and relatively short cooldowns to back this up, your power doesn't focused into perfectly landing your combo, it's scattered around spammable long-range poke, fast clean speed and "come closer and ur dead" combo. He is quite complicated character (tricky skillshot, one skill with "charges", relatively hard-to-land CC that also displaces enemy and ultimate that basically makes you a sitting duck) but he is far from "too complicated" simply because you don't have to execute everything properly, you can (doesn't mean you will or should) get by by simply poking enemy, getting AP to the point of enemy not being able to withstand poke or to the point of your allies being to dive in wounded enemy team and finish them off.
    Last edited by Charge me Doctor; 2015-06-09 at 10:03 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Urban Dictionary
    Russians are a nation inhabiting territory of Russia an ex-USSR countries. Russians enjoy drinking vodka and listening to the bears playing button-accordions. Russians are open- and warm- hearted. They are ready to share their last prianik (russian sweet cookie) with guests, in case lasts encounter that somewhere. Though, it's almost unreal, 'cos russians usually hide their stuff well.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    I would say that some of these character have means to help themselves. For example, Thresh - it's quite hard to land a max range hook - but it's easy to land point-blank one. You also have a CC ability that is almost impossible to miss and that buys you enough time to perfectly land a hook on CCed target that can't even get tenacity to stop you from doing that - all your target can do is not be in range of your CC ability.

    There is character like, say, Veigar...
    Thresh to me plays basically like Blitzcrank, so that's why I said there isn't much of a reason to consider Thresh significantly more difficult.

    Veigar's new version is definitely tougher then the old one, and that one was more difficult then most people gave credit for. But at the same time, I don't think the skill ceiling for Veigar is too high, the same goes for every champion out there.

  11. #11
    Titan Charge me Doctor's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Russia, Chelyabinsk (Tankograd)
    Posts
    13,849
    Quote Originally Posted by Faltemer View Post
    Thresh to me plays basically like Blitzcrank, so that's why I said there isn't much of a reason to consider Thresh significantly more difficult.

    Veigar's new version is definitely tougher then the old one, and that one was more difficult then most people gave credit for. But at the same time, I don't think the skill ceiling for Veigar is too high, the same goes for every champion out there.
    There is for sure some champions with very high skill ceiling (Lee for example), but i'm not sure what skill it is, careful planning what you are able to do, or twitch reactions to what happens. In case of Lee you have lots of tools to work with. Doesn't mean that you have to use them all and that's the point. Even when high skill ceiling champion is played on "sub-par" level, it doesn't makes you to perform worse compared to other, "easy" champions, there is no Meepo of dota in LoL, there is no character that will bite you in the ass for just deciding of picking him
    Quote Originally Posted by Urban Dictionary
    Russians are a nation inhabiting territory of Russia an ex-USSR countries. Russians enjoy drinking vodka and listening to the bears playing button-accordions. Russians are open- and warm- hearted. They are ready to share their last prianik (russian sweet cookie) with guests, in case lasts encounter that somewhere. Though, it's almost unreal, 'cos russians usually hide their stuff well.

  12. #12
    Banned A dot Ham's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    America, you great unfinished symphony.
    Posts
    6,525
    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    There is for sure some champions with very high skill ceiling (Lee for example), but i'm not sure what skill it is, careful planning what you are able to do, or twitch reactions to what happens. In case of Lee you have lots of tools to work with. Doesn't mean that you have to use them all and that's the point. Even when high skill ceiling champion is played on "sub-par" level, it doesn't makes you to perform worse compared to other, "easy" champions, there is no Meepo of dota in LoL, there is no character that will bite you in the ass for just deciding of picking him
    I think this is an awesome example actually. Personally I feel like they should break ward jumping. Granted to do it well it takes a lot of skill. But I think anyone with the ability to think objectively should view it as at least a little OP/abuse of mechanics, clever or not. I think that riot is reluctant to make such a drastic change, and I think there aren't enough people playing lee that way that are completely owning to make it a worthwhile battle with the community.

    Hypothetically a new/less skilled player vs a mediocre/average player is going to lose regardless of champion choice. However, should the better player possess an understanding of say one of these more "complicated" champions (and again I understand that it is mostly flavor) with the added situational utility. I feel like it gives that mediocre player an added boost that appears to the new/under skilled player as untouchable or godlike.

    In a perfect world we wouldn't have this skill disparity even in normals (though rank isn't always indicative of skill level). In a perfect world you would/should have a player on your team to match that skill level. In a perfect world 1 or more of your 4 other teammates would help you vs this champ/player. But we live in the real world and in this community no one is ever outplayed/outclassed they are feeders who should quit and go play against bots because normals are serious business. Though I've never seen a botted lee sin ward jump around a map and escape an entire team and/or get a kill in the process.

    I think this champions with added utility are made or geared more to higher skilled players, and to some degree I think that is fine. I think that added utility makes average players with an understanding of that utility appear to be better than they probably are, and play considerably better than they would on any other champion.

    I think that every champion should be designed around 1 concept "easy to learn; difficult to master"

  13. #13
    Titan Charge me Doctor's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Russia, Chelyabinsk (Tankograd)
    Posts
    13,849
    Quote Originally Posted by Bilbo Baggins View Post
    Hypothetically a new/less skilled player vs a mediocre/average player is going to lose regardless of champion choice. However, should the better player possess an understanding of say one of these more "complicated" champions (and again I understand that it is mostly flavor) with the added situational utility. I feel like it gives that mediocre player an added boost that appears to the new/under skilled player as untouchable or godlike.
    Personally i don't see ward jumping as something game breaking or overpowered. Sure, it gives a lot of leverage over your opponents, a lot of mobility, but you have to invest into it (it used to be lots of wards, now it's just yellow upgraded ward, which IMO is an issue. Ability to reliably ward jump whenever you like should cost more than sightstone, and an ability to semi-reliably ward jump should be more expensive than trinket upgrade)

    I don't think that it's the case of rock paper scissors, aka "new player < average player < pro player". New player is not going to auto lose to average player (granted that they are on same level of runes/masteries, so there is no disparity like average player have 30% IAS and new player have nothing), new player is going to do more mistakes and give his opponent more opportunities to capitalize on them, and his opponent (being an average player) is not going to see all these opportunities and/or capitalize on them. For argument sake, he (actually, they both) also can "fuck up" or "fuck up royally" when playing vs new player because of new players teammates and/or his own over-confidence and wrong read of situation.

    I don't think that this game is that binary that you can make such assumption that average player is going to win new player regardless of champion choice, because there is not only champion choice to have in consideration. I also don't think that average player appears as "godlike" to new players, every single player make mistakes during every single game. It's my opinion and i'm yet to see a game where no one made a single mistake, being it missed creep, missed gank opportunity, failsmited dragon, over confident dive or whatever.

    I don't agree here, there should be some disparity between players, without it games would be very dull and hard to learn from. But there is a problem, the one "top ELO" player can get his hands on snowballing-baby-seal-clubber-champion and rek whole enemy team if we are speaking about smurf-level games. On the other hand - second team should also have a player of the same skill level to balance it out.
    I agree that an argument of players "feeding" when in reality they just lose the lane due to various reasons is ridiculous and should be gone from community for sake of everyone sanity.

    It really depends on utility you are talking about. Say, Bard - champion that fully consist of utility is a very bad pick for a newbie in his level of play. Not because he can't carry with him, but because at his level of play utility of this sort doesn't matter. At all. But in case of Twisted Fate ult - even if you don't utilize it properly - you have a free teleport from base to save you 15 seconds of travel time. Yes, experienced player is going to find proper spots to TP gank, but new player can attempt to do the same - it doesn't take a rocket science degree to click ult and click behind enemy lines to cut their escape off.

    I don't like the idea of all champions being designed around 1 concept. At all. There should be healthy disparity between them. And currently there is much more "easy" champions who are in dire need of rework, because they suffer from being easy characters (Nunu, Poppy, Urgot, Garen) - they are easy to learn because of their limited kit, not because of them being designed as easy to learn character. In this case, new Ashe is perfect example of what you can expect from a character that was designed to be newbie-friendly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Urban Dictionary
    Russians are a nation inhabiting territory of Russia an ex-USSR countries. Russians enjoy drinking vodka and listening to the bears playing button-accordions. Russians are open- and warm- hearted. They are ready to share their last prianik (russian sweet cookie) with guests, in case lasts encounter that somewhere. Though, it's almost unreal, 'cos russians usually hide their stuff well.

  14. #14
    Yes, a new player playing a complicated hero will be at a disadvantage. However, that is why there are champions that are much simpler like Ryze, Yi, Ashe, ect, the noob-friendly champs. A new player shouldn't just hop into a game and try to be a master of Zed or Ekko.

  15. #15
    Banned docterfreeze's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Finding a stranger in the alps.
    Posts
    3,872
    If you honestly think league is complicated then I suggest you try other MOBAs and form a new opinion. Like WoW is the casual choice in the MMO world, League is the casual choice of MOBAs.

  16. #16
    Pandaren Monk Yosef1015's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    The Freljord
    Posts
    1,936
    I didnt have a problem with any champ until ekko came out. he just has everything jam packed into one kit. i dont think hes too op but he just has too much cc too much damage too much survivability and too much mobility. champs that have too much of everything in my eyes are a problem

  17. #17
    Titan Charge me Doctor's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Russia, Chelyabinsk (Tankograd)
    Posts
    13,849
    Quote Originally Posted by Yosef1015 View Post
    I didnt have a problem with any champ until ekko came out. he just has everything jam packed into one kit. i dont think hes too op but he just has too much cc too much damage too much survivability and too much mobility. champs that have too much of everything in my eyes are a problem
    He have barely any CC (unreliable stun and slow), his damage is quite high if he manages to get stacks up on you, and he is not that mobile (his dash on Graves level of mobility). All he has is his damage, he is squishy, melee assassin who have no means to farm safely when matched with stronger champion. Compare him to other mid assassins (Talon, Kata, Zed) Talon got his strong CC removed and now somewhere between bad tier and "ok" tier. Kata have no mana, spammable AoE abilities for fast clear and decent range damaging teleport (that also can be used to wardjump), she also has huge power spike at level 6 (as any other assassin). Zed have a passive that allows him to not miss any last hits, he has energy as his resource and spammable AoE abilities for pushing and fast clear, he is also very mobile thanks to his shadows and his ult leaves not that much for you to do with it.

    My point is - Ekko have no reliable poke. His Q deals laughable damage without him popping stacks. For him to pop up stacks he have to go in melee (which is not hard to do for him, but hard to get out), so in case of you being, say, Zed vs Ekko - you are in favorable position because you are outright stronger in punch-fight, have more and more reliable poke and stronger pushing capabilities. The only upside of Ekko in this situation is his ultimate being basically get-out-of-jail card.

    Ekko in no means have too much of everything, he is extremely narrow champion - a squishy assassin with lots of damage
    Quote Originally Posted by Urban Dictionary
    Russians are a nation inhabiting territory of Russia an ex-USSR countries. Russians enjoy drinking vodka and listening to the bears playing button-accordions. Russians are open- and warm- hearted. They are ready to share their last prianik (russian sweet cookie) with guests, in case lasts encounter that somewhere. Though, it's almost unreal, 'cos russians usually hide their stuff well.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by docterfreeze View Post
    If you honestly think league is complicated then I suggest you try other MOBAs and form a new opinion. Like WoW is the casual choice in the MMO world, League is the casual choice of MOBAs.
    Heroes of the storm says hello

  19. #19
    Banned A dot Ham's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    America, you great unfinished symphony.
    Posts
    6,525
    Quote Originally Posted by docterfreeze View Post
    If you honestly think league is complicated then I suggest you try other MOBAs and form a new opinion. Like WoW is the casual choice in the MMO world, League is the casual choice of MOBAs.
    You are actually only proving my point.

    In their efforts to have the same type of game, but do it (differently) those games are imo more complexed. DOTA 2, HoN

    They lose sight of what makes them great. On the surface seemingly uncomplicated. Yet you can have a vast difference in skill when those 2 competing players use those 4-6/abilities differently and at different times.

  20. #20
    Fluffy Kitten Yvaelle's Avatar
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Darnassus
    Posts
    11,331
    HotS is definitely the casual MOBA. Blizzard specializes in Casual / Mass Appeal.

    I think it's perfectly fine to have champions which are high complexity / high skill cap, and others which are low complexity / low skill cap - and any combination inbetween.

    They could do a better job of labeling which are which maybe - making it obvious for beginners to start off with something simple like Lux Mid, and avoid slightly more complex mids like Viktor / Azir. The problem with labeling though, is that everyone seems naturally more adept at certain champions - one person could find Riven infuriating to play because they naturally want to hang back, be cautious, and poke before they commit - Riven can't do that. Another noob can sit down and find Riven to be an extension of their own playstyle - they want to hop and hop and dash and stun and dash and hop and stun and hop and dash and hop and stun - for an hour without reprieve.

    One person might find Zed's burst combo really hard to pull off, waiting for the opponent to stand on your ghost for the cleave, making sure they have maximum energy before they ult - and then landing all their damage in the ult window. Another person might get it 95% perfect on their second try after pretty much only reading the abilities. I taught a friend LoL and he picked Zed as his first toon (I was hesitant), he'd never played a MOBA before, L8 on his first game he pulled of a ~perfect Zed ult, and he even recognized the BotRK synergy on his own on his first game.

    So they could do a better job of easing beginners into the game on lower complexity champions - but it's also hard to identify what different people find complex. Mostly it's about matching a persons playstyle to a champion who plays like they think - if they think like their champion is meant to be played - then they will find them easier to control: but how do you know what playstyle someone is before they have played?

    Also generally, I like to avoid letting beginners play mana users just because mana management in LoL at low levels is a consistent problem for beginners. You give them someone like Riven or even Zed - they get used to the idea of ability timing and aiming (micro) - but with mana they need to also think about saving up abilities for when they will need it: a macro concern.
    Youtube ~ Yvaelle ~ Twitter

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •