1. #2201
    Quote Originally Posted by Selastan View Post
    So, they seem to be changing the story quite a bit.


    Looks like the AVALANCHE bomb in the reactor didn't destroy it, and President Shinra instead ordered it to self-destruct. That change kind of works out good. I mean, it didn't really seem like AVALACHE style to hurt innocent people, like that massive reactor explosion certainly did, and it is really REALLY more up President Shinra's style to blow up his own people to scapegoat AVALANCE.
    Just because their bomb was a dud doesn't change intent. It is some weak disney like twist trying to keep the "good guys" clean when morally nothing is different with them, still grey and where willing to kill people with their eco terrorist attack if they had to.

    Overall it's whatever cause it doesn't change that much but if they continue to try to write this shit like disney it will be super annoying by the 3rd game.

  2. #2202
    Quote Originally Posted by Tech614 View Post
    Just because their bomb was a dud doesn't change intent. It is some weak disney like twist trying to keep the "good guys" clean when morally nothing is different with them, still grey and where willing to kill people with their eco terrorist attack if they had to.

    Overall it's whatever cause it doesn't change that much but if they continue to try to write this shit like disney it will be super annoying by the 3rd game.
    There is hint in the original that the bomb jessie made wasn't that powerful and she thought she had made a mistake but it was the Shinra

  3. #2203
    Quote Originally Posted by Tech614 View Post
    Just because their bomb was a dud doesn't change intent. It is some weak disney like twist trying to keep the "good guys" clean when morally nothing is different with them, still grey and where willing to kill people with their eco terrorist attack if they had to.

    Overall it's whatever cause it doesn't change that much but if they continue to try to write this shit like disney it will be super annoying by the 3rd game.
    Disagree with your take on the change. I actually liked it and thought it fit in much more with the overall theme of the game...which it super does. It reinforces that over-arching narrative as it was a bit incongruous in the initial game.

  4. #2204
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    Im just glad they kept barrets swearing in

  5. #2205
    Quote Originally Posted by Video Games View Post
    Im just glad they kept barrets swearing in
    And his musical hums.

    I'm so glad they kept his character silly and super extra. I like pretty much everything they're doing with these characters, though Jessie's new traits (maybe I missed them in the original game) make her dialogue an utter delight.

    She's thirsty as fuck and I love every minute of her aggressive flirting

  6. #2206
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Disagree with your take on the change. I actually liked it and thought it fit in much more with the overall theme of the game...which it super does. It reinforces that over-arching narrative as it was a bit incongruous in the initial game.
    It reinforces nothing other then trying to emphasize "the good guys didn't do it" which the original game already hinted at but wasn't blatant about. Fact of the matter is they set a bomb to a large reactor, Barrett even mocks Cloud for his cockiness with the 20 min timer because he knows they need to gtfo. Nobody is buying the characters are morally clean unless you're a 10 year old that doesn't understand the consequences of what they did.

    Further more, trying to absolve them of guilt basically ruins avalanche and the entire point of them so once again I say if they keep emphasizing shit like this in the story the story is going to go from meh like the original to just being another shitty Disney re-telling of a fairy tale. Might as well of called it KH4 if they want to go down that route.

  7. #2207
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    Wasn't a fan of the re-telling of the narrative to be AVALANCHE good, SHINRA bad either but it won't change anything ultimately. In the original AVALANCHE destroyed the reactor and they did the same on the remake.

  8. #2208
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    And his musical hums.

    I'm so glad they kept his character silly and super extra. I like pretty much everything they're doing with these characters, though Jessie's new traits (maybe I missed them in the original game) make her dialogue an utter delight.

    She's thirsty as fuck and I love every minute of her aggressive flirting
    Thought it was a bit too much imo. Scale it back a tad and it's good.
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  9. #2209
    They have a really nice chance to make this local multiplayer like the older final fantasy games (you could set characters to other controllers) I think it would benefit from allowing a friend to take control of one other character directly.

    I bet a lot of people will shit on this idea but with this active style of combat it would work well.
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  10. #2210
    Quote Originally Posted by Colmadero View Post
    Wasn't a fan of the re-telling of the narrative to be AVALANCHE good, SHINRA bad either but it won't change anything ultimately. In the original AVALANCHE destroyed the reactor and they did the same on the remake.
    It was already implied in the original that something didn't quite work as expected, as Jesse points out the bomb she made shouldn't have caused an explosion that big. And the original also had the setup of Shinra making AVALANCHE into a boogieman to push through more authoritarian measures (like rate hikes on mako) so it fits perfectly well into the narrative.

  11. #2211
    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    It was already implied in the original that something didn't quite work as expected, as Jesse points out the bomb she made shouldn't have caused an explosion that big. And the original also had the setup of Shinra making AVALANCHE into a boogieman to push through more authoritarian measures (like rate hikes on mako) so it fits perfectly well into the narrative.
    The bomb not being a nuke makes sense for the narrative. The bomb being a small puff of smoke that does absolutely jack shit and is basically a dud does not. Again, what is implied in the original was turned into the disney esque "trust us they're the good guys" story telling and makes absolutely no sense with them trying to get away from what they still know should be a big explosion.

  12. #2212
    Quote Originally Posted by Tech614 View Post
    The bomb not being a nuke makes sense for the narrative. The bomb being a small puff of smoke that does absolutely jack shit and is basically a dud does not. Again, what is implied in the original was turned into the disney esque "trust us they're the good guys" story telling and makes absolutely no sense with them trying to get away from what they still know should be a big explosion.
    They were already "trust us they're good guys" from the get go...I don't think anyone thought they were bad guys.
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  13. #2213
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unholyground View Post
    They have a really nice chance to make this local multiplayer like the older final fantasy games (you could set characters to other controllers) I think it would benefit from allowing a friend to take control of one other character directly.

    I bet a lot of people will shit on this idea but with this active style of combat it would work well.
    Bring back FFIX system with 4 characters and let 2 players control 2 each!

  14. #2214
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    They were already "trust us they're good guys" from the get go...I don't think anyone thought they were bad guys.
    While they tried to keep civilian costs to a minimum avalanche was 100% morally gray and still are. Nobody is buying they're the "good guys" with this disney fairy tale twist lmao, they want to save the planet and if that meant some innocents died well shit happens. Just because you retcon the bomb to be a dud doesn't change this. It's one thing if you make it clear the bombs explosion was smaller as was hinted at in the original. It's another thing entirely to make it do nothing at all.

  15. #2215
    Quote Originally Posted by Colmadero View Post
    Bring back FFIX system with 4 characters and let 2 players control 2 each!
    There you go! I like the idea of experiencing any FF game with a friend.
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  16. #2216
    Quote Originally Posted by Tech614 View Post
    While they tried to keep civilian costs to a minimum avalanche was 100% morally gray and still are. Nobody is buying they're the "good guys" with this disney fairy tale twist lmao, they want to save the planet and if that meant some innocents died well shit happens. Just because you retcon the bomb to be a dud doesn't change this. It's one thing if you make it clear the bombs explosion was smaller as was hinted at in the original. It's another thing entirely to make it do nothing at all.
    I never saw them as morally grey...they were painted as good guys since the start and shinra as the bad guys... and it kept it like that all the way to the end :/
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  17. #2217
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    I never saw them as morally grey...they were painted as good guys since the start and shinra as the bad guys... and it kept it like that all the way to the end :/
    They were definitely grey. Get the job done by any means to save the planet from shinra aka capitalism . It's barret whole arc really about his inner turmoil after selling out his previous town to shinra

  18. #2218
    Quote Originally Posted by RobertoCarlos View Post
    They were definitely grey. Get the job done by any means to save the planet from shinra aka capitalism . It's barret whole arc really about his inner turmoil after selling out his previous town to shinra
    The entire beginning is all about how shinra is destroying the world and keeping riches for themselves as shown by all the slums and peoples expressing about the whole poor vs rich thing... The message is clear "Shinra is ruining the world for greed" and we since the start fought for the people being pushed around as well as for the planet. Only to be reinforced even further after shinra destroys the sector and blame Avalanche.

    The only way they are morally grey is in the eyes of the people within the game because some see them as terrorists through propaganda from shinra...for us players, we always knew they were good since the start. Even with this change they remain "morally grey" within the game world, but to us they are and always were good guys because we knew more.
    Last edited by Kumorii; 2020-03-04 at 07:43 PM.
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  19. #2219
    Quote Originally Posted by Kumorii View Post
    The entire beginning is all about how shinra is destroying the world and keeping riches for themselves as shown by all the slums and peoples expressing about the whole poor vs rich thing... The message is clear "Shinra is ruining the world for greed" and we since the start fought for the people being pushed around as well as for the planet. Only to be reinforced even further after shinra destroys the sector and blame Avalanche.

    The only way they are morally grey is in the eyes of the people within the game because some see them as terrorists...for us players, we always knew they were good since the start. Even with this change they remain morally grey within the game world, but to us they are and always were good guys because we knew more.
    The first shinra president is an over zealous madman and gets a sword in the back rather quickly for it via sephiroth. Rufus is actually more balanced and represents the technology and science benefits of capitalism with his help vs the weapons. Barret himself even admits he likes the tech that comes with modern living but as you say the devide between the rich and the poor is too great and parts of the planet are becoming unliveable through greed. Sound familiar?

  20. #2220
    Quote Originally Posted by RobertoCarlos View Post
    The first shinra president is an over zealous madman and gets a sword in the back rather quickly for it via sephiroth. Rufus is actually more balanced and represents the technology and science benefits of capitalism with his help vs the weapons. Barret himself even admits he likes the tech that comes with modern living but as you say the devide between the rich and the poor is too great and parts of the planet are becoming unliveable through greed. Sound familiar?
    Yes, not sure what your point is though... the game is straight up telling you directly they are the bad guys and you being the good guy. It's a social commentary on society absolutely, doesn't change how it's presented in game.
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