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  1. #1
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    WoD did not ruin WoW, MMO-Champion did

    Warlords of draenor is a wonderful expansion to the game, beautiful landscapes, close to endless supply of new quests, items, achievements, challenges, secrets and other activities... yet everything feels so boring and easy, why is that?

    One of the main reasons is due to sites like MMO-champion unfortunately. Too much information is availible to everyone, it's like playing games while tabbing out to see what the play-through guide tells you what to do.

    Everything new and exciting is spoiled weeks or even months in advance. When a new raid is out you are expected to have full knowledge of all the phases of all the fights before setting your foot into the instance. If you don't like spoilers and decide to venture into the new raid without reading up and/or watching tutorials of the encounters, the raid leader will just tell you to get the fuck out of his raid.

    I enjoy to play adventure games like monkey island but if you get stuck for several hours you might check online for the solution, but the next time you get stuck you might only try for half an hour before checking the solution and later on you might just keep the guide on the 2nd screen so you can get to the end of the game and be done with it.

    The same applies to wow, the game is far from easy, the game is pretty damn hard even. However the constant use of a walk-though guide will make the game feel dumb and easy. "Okay this vendor wants me to find a blueprint before I can buy this upgrade for my awesome epic battleship. Hmm it was last seen outside of the hellfire citadel. Sweet, I should venture there and start looking for it.. but alas, if I do that then maybe it will take too long to find it and I will fall behind everyone else on my legendary quest and then my damage output will suffer and I might not be able to join the raid group later on, ah well screw that I'll just check wowhead and be done with it... Okay now I got the blueprint and what should I do now? damnit I have nothing more to do now, why is this game so easy and stupid, why oh why did Blizzard have to create such a nobrainer expansion with no content whatsoever :/"

    There is only new content for a select few people nowadays and that's for the top 20 or so mythic raid guilds world wide. They venture into the dark, not knowing the optimal strategy to defeat the encounter so they have to test different strategies and succeed by trial and error. If you fall behind then you can check the Method kill vids that they release after X guilds completes a boss and if you are struggling with the boss and not checking the kill vid, then get the fuck out of the raid scrub.

  2. #2
    This isn't something specific to WoW or news and forums sites like mmo-champion though. If you don't want to have your games spoiled, you should avoid sites that publish spoilers or discuss strategy

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by cyndallis View Post
    This isn't something specific to WoW or news and forums sites like mmo-champion though. If you don't want to have your games spoiled, you should avoid sites that publish spoilers or discuss strategy
    Not really a valid argument. People go to MMO-champion and wowhead, look up everything about upcoming content and then log in and talk about it freely in trade chat.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by fizzloges View Post
    One of the main reasons is due to sites like MMO-champion unfortunately. Too much information is availible to everyone, it's like playing games while tabbing out to see what the play-through guide tells you what to do.
    If you don't know what to do in an encounter before you set foot in it for the first time, you are wasting your fellow raiders' time, because they already know.

    I'm sorry if you think that it's OK to be "immersed" in content and "figure it out as you see it" or whatever bullshit follows, but you are just playing the game wrong.

  5. #5
    You nailed it. THAT is why Vanilla and TBC were the golden years of Warcraft. No Youtube, no WoWhead, etc. Old shitty Thottbot was all there was. It's not rose-colored glasses or nostalgia. It's fact.

  6. #6
    The Lightbringer Bosen's Avatar
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    Question

    Of the people that play World Of Warcraft, how many of them visit sites like these or use the official forum?

  7. #7
    Sorry OP I completely disagree. The developers/shareholders screwed the game.

  8. #8
    What is this .. I don't even .....

    But no seriously, people ruined WOD, not BLIZ, not WOD, not MMO-C.

    The community has just been growing increasingly toxic for a long time now and it's just getting unbearable at this stage. It both spoils the in-game experience and bombards the forums with "WOD hate" threads, etc.

  9. #9
    Stood in the Fire
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    I guess you are right in s sense, that WoW-related sites greatly influenced game-developers in a way, which spoiled this game.
    Quote Originally Posted by Secret81
    I´ve heard, there will be Epic loot as normal quest rewards in Cata while you level.
    To make the quest feel more epic.

  10. #10
    Stood in the Fire Preliatus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tiporispit View Post
    You nailed it. THAT is why Vanilla and TBC were the golden years of Warcraft. No Youtube, no WoWhead, etc. Old shitty Thottbot was all there was. It's not rose-colored glasses or nostalgia. It's fact.
    Thottbot, WCM (For dungeon guides, farming guides, etc.), and video downloads from filefront.

    Before someone points this out, Youtube did come out in 2005, but it never caught on until later.

    If you're seeking a nostalgia trip, Thottbot still exists, but it's a front for wowhead now.

    As a pro-tip from someone who has gotten into raids for a raid the first day they're available. Lie. Say you've watched a few videos, and have an idea on what to do.

    Then flow with the people that are closest to you. Follow the MDPS, follow the RDPS, follow the gaggle of healers etc.

    I have beers in me, and partially awake.

    I might've posted in the wrong thread.

    Where's the button to post this?

    Enter is not twerking.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    Not really a valid argument. People go to MMO-champion and wowhead, look up everything about upcoming content and then log in and talk about it freely in trade chat.
    I've seen a few guilds who go out of their way to avoid reading strategy guides and watching content clears in WoW to avoid spoiling content. I'm not saying that they're not at a disadvantage compared to players who do in so far as progression and clear speed go. But if your argument is that WoW is bad because content is spoiled then then you absolutely can avoid doing so if you choose.

    When I get a Wii U and Zelda (if Nintendo ever get their backsides into gear) I will absolutely avoid any content about the game before I complete it because that is a game I want to experience the content in

  12. #12
    While that may be true, it's just a reality of multiplayer games. There's no way back. If you would take down wowhead, all video guides about bosses etc. people would just make another wow database and do new video guides. Maybe you could have fun on the first two days of a new raid tier without prior knowledge, but then there would be new video guides popping up and people would watch them.

    Part of the fun of singleplayer games is not knowing stuff and figuring it out for yourself, but that doesn't work in multiplayer games where people are competing with each other. So there's no point in riddle quests for example, because people would just look up the solutions online.
    Last edited by Tx20; 2015-07-11 at 08:21 AM.

  13. #13
    Deleted
    Yeah sorry, I beg to differ as well. When a new patch is released I'm in complete agony (besides the fact that the game is quite bugged and addons are not working)
    that I don't know anything at all. Nowadays, when classes are simplified to the ground the only thing that sets apart good and bad players is information - even though this applied to previous expansions as well. I hated thottbott and wandering aimlessly for several minutes. Wow offers a huge scale of activities and if you can't do them efficiently the game won't be fun on the long run. The only scenario I could relate to are the betas and ptr-s several expansions ago, which were the pre-progression phase for many guilds even more so than these days, therefore in lot of the cases it felt somewhat compulsory.

  14. #14
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Tx20 View Post
    While that may be true, it's just a reality of multiplayer games. There's no way back. If you would take down wowhead, all video guides about bosses etc. people would just make another wow database and do new video guides. Maybe you could have fun on the first two days of a new raid tier without prior knowledge, but then there would be new video guides popping up and people would watch them.
    Yeah I understand that everything has changed now, some to the better, some to the worse and some things are just different. There is no going back, however what I'm trying to say is that the game is getting better and better, but since everything new leaks out all the time you will never feel as excited as you once was with the game. Everyone is blaming Blizzard for this, but it's a side effect of the new information era.

    Sure there's some steps Blizzard did take to make it a better game that severely backfired such as cross-realms.. but most problems are due to the free flow of information and it will require some major outside the box thinking to solve these issues.

  15. #15
    The Undying Lochton's Avatar
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    I have to chuckle a little for the time being, and then say, no.

    There is generally a spoiler warning about content on this page, people could just read that, it is quite often at the top of the content news.

    So, really, MMO-champion had nothing to do either, it's a fan site that runs on building up around news and release, as well as spoilers. Maybe OP should blame the ones yelling out the spoilers, or him/her self for not blocking the person spitting out spoilers.
    FOMO: "Fear Of Missing Out", also commonly known as people with a mental issue of managing time and activities, many expecting others to fit into their schedule so they don't miss out on things to come. If FOMO becomes a problem for you, do seek help, it can be a very unhealthy lifestyle..

  16. #16
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by fizzloges View Post
    Warlords of draenor is a wonderful expansion to the game, beautiful landscapes, close to endless supply of new quests, items, achievements, challenges, secrets and other activities... yet everything feels so boring and easy, why is that?

    One of the main reasons is due to sites like MMO-champion unfortunately. Too much information is availible to everyone, it's like playing games while tabbing out to see what the play-through guide tells you what to do.

    Everything new and exciting is spoiled weeks or even months in advance. When a new raid is out you are expected to have full knowledge of all the phases of all the fights before setting your foot into the instance. If you don't like spoilers and decide to venture into the new raid without reading up and/or watching tutorials of the encounters, the raid leader will just tell you to get the fuck out of his raid.

    I enjoy to play adventure games like monkey island but if you get stuck for several hours you might check online for the solution, but the next time you get stuck you might only try for half an hour before checking the solution and later on you might just keep the guide on the 2nd screen so you can get to the end of the game and be done with it.

    The same applies to wow, the game is far from easy, the game is pretty damn hard even. However the constant use of a walk-though guide will make the game feel dumb and easy. "Okay this vendor wants me to find a blueprint before I can buy this upgrade for my awesome epic battleship. Hmm it was last seen outside of the hellfire citadel. Sweet, I should venture there and start looking for it.. but alas, if I do that then maybe it will take too long to find it and I will fall behind everyone else on my legendary quest and then my damage output will suffer and I might not be able to join the raid group later on, ah well screw that I'll just check wowhead and be done with it... Okay now I got the blueprint and what should I do now? damnit I have nothing more to do now, why is this game so easy and stupid, why oh why did Blizzard have to create such a nobrainer expansion with no content whatsoever :/"

    There is only new content for a select few people nowadays and that's for the top 20 or so mythic raid guilds world wide. They venture into the dark, not knowing the optimal strategy to defeat the encounter so they have to test different strategies and succeed by trial and error. If you fall behind then you can check the Method kill vids that they release after X guilds completes a boss and if you are struggling with the boss and not checking the kill vid, then get the fuck out of the raid scrub.
    You are wrong just because MMO-Champ was already there, at least at the end of BC. Look at my subscription date to the forum, and I did not subscribe immediateley to the site...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_of_Warcraft

    And as for Youtube and Warcraftmovies, they were also already there : I remember the great videos by JackHunt about MC, BWL, AQ40 and Naxx 60 thanks to which I started raiding. I also remember Happyminty and her amazing world PVP videos : Nerf Sap !

    A couple of links...
    BWL 60 by Jackhunt : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncFLSI7I9s0
    Naxx 60 by Jackhunt (original French version) : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rp5JNSGkBDA
    Nerf Sap 6 by Happyminti : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GiYJHwKYILc
    Last edited by mmoc972a289242; 2015-07-11 at 08:47 AM.

  17. #17
    laughable that you think MMO-Champ caused all the subscribers to leave

  18. #18
    mmo-champion has 0 impact on the game. please close this thread because OP is clearly trying to troll

  19. #19
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by cyndallis View Post
    This isn't something specific to WoW or news and forums sites like mmo-champion though. If you don't want to have your games spoiled, you should avoid sites that publish spoilers or discuss strategy
    I have to agree with OP.

    Your argument isn't valid because it's about the majority of the people. The majority of players are watching guides, are reading instructions, do everything to get everything first and ASAP (Legendary Q, Shipyard etc.), and look everything up. If you decide to not look everything up, you are the one being completely ignored by the majority of the community and get the stamp of n00b. Plus: All the people going for the ASAP methods by looking shit up, are the ones complaining about "Nothing to do!!11" and "Content?!". People who do not look every little quest up are not the ones complaining because they've shit to do.
    Enjoying the game in different ways like exploring or questing can get frustrating really quick because the community did not evolve around that it's all about more DPS, more Loot, more Raids, doing something else (in an MMORPG) results in isolation. There are niche "casual" guilds who are not as bad in this consent but still, the "meta" drips down from the top and even in casual guilds most of the time its all about the DPS.

    (I am not saying it's all MMO-C's fault, the problem is clearly more wide spread and has also to do with the "competetive" aspect of a PvE orientated game and the players consume behaviour. Imagine Playing the Witcher or Dragon Age, when 5 weeks in advance you have a set plan to beat the game as fast as possible in the easiest way possible (don't want to miss the "cool" stuff? Theres probably a guide for how to reach the cool stuf as fast as possible too! Much fun.)
    Last edited by mmocc2f450f39f; 2015-07-11 at 08:47 AM.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by DomesticViolence View Post
    Of the people that play World Of Warcraft, how many of them visit sites like these or use the official forum?
    Most/many. Do not feed into the nonsense they give that only like 10% do.

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