How much can I dirty up my diet.

[dixincide]

TL;DR: I'd like to increase my macros to meet 5k per day, but I always feel grossly full by 3700 - 4000.

• Is it okay to dirty up my diet to increase the calorie count?
• is there an alternative to dirtying up my diet that will allow me to hit the 5k?

Hey everyone,

Target Cals I'd like to start hitting is 5k.
Unfortunately at my best I'm only able to get 3700 - 4000 (if i push myself)
My issue at the moment is that I just get full too fast. To the point where I can no longer trust a burp or a fart.
I'm in the gym every day, for 1 hour. No cardio as I am trying to bulk however I feel I may need to incorporate this in order to ramp up my appetite.

My diet is very plain and clean which I'm suspecting could be the lead cause of me not getting the cals I need. As I could simply not be enjoying my meals.

Diet

• Breakfast: Liquid Egg Whites in milk, 2 Packets of Quaker Oatmeal, Banana or Texas Toast (x2 slices w/ butter)
• Snack: 1200 Gainer Shake (Precision Pure Mass)
• Lunch: 8 oz Chicken breast & 1.5 Cups of rice (OR if chicken is expensive 2.5 Cups of home made chili and 2.5 cups of rice)
• Snack: 100g Pumpkin seeds
• Pre Workout: 150g of Raisins, Caffine pill
• Dinner: (As I live with the parents still this is always a variable. at this point I can barely fit anything in me even after returning from the gym I usually eat about half of what is put in front of me, which is usually a pasta of sorts with some red meat (beef/pork typically))
• Ideally, I'd have a second 1200 Cal shake and 2 PB&J sammiches on whole wheat but this just isn't happening as I am too full.

I've asked around and people have suggested adding in some MCT oil/Olive Oil/Coconut oil to my shakes to give me an extra 400 cals.
Other people have told me that simply eating the same meals every day for 8 months has caused me to lose interest in meals and subconsciously get full faster. Which makes me wonder, is it okay to add some flavor and bad carbs/cals/sugars into the mix in the interest of eating more?

Thanks in advance.

[Wikko]

So you're in the gym for 1 hour per day and nothing else besides that? And you want 5k calories daily? Are you trying to have something like 2000 calories surplus or what? Mostly you'd gain fat

[Zelion]

So you're in the gym for 1 hour per day and nothing else besides that? And you want 5k calories daily? Are you trying to have something like 2000 calories surplus or what? Mostly you'd gain fat

this. What are your stats? So youre losing weight on 3.7-4k calories? If not then 5k is not a smart idea.

Secondly, you need to get the idea of certain foods being good and bad or clean and dirty out of your head now. It is a silly way to look at it. Can you even define it?

You have to look at foods in the context of your diet, not on an individual basis.

So yes, if you really need to get in 5k cals, you will need to incorporate more calorie dense foods. And why the fuck are you eating just egg whites and complain about getting calories in? I dont understand this.

[dixincide]

So you're in the gym for 1 hour per day and nothing else besides that? And you want 5k calories daily? Are you trying to have something like 2000 calories surplus or what? Mostly you'd gain fat

I went from this to that. By going from a 1500 cal diet to 3500. I figured if i added even more I could continue to bulk as I've started to level out.

this. What are your stats? So youre losing weight on 3.7-4k calories? If not then 5k is not a smart idea.

Secondly, you need to get the idea of certain foods being good and bad or clean and dirty out of your head now. It is a silly way to look at it. Can you even define it?

You have to look at foods in the context of your diet, not on an individual basis.

So yes, if you really need to get in 5k cals, you will need to incorporate more calorie dense foods. And why the fuck are you eating just egg whites and complain about getting calories in? I dont understand this.

Honestly I'm just going off of what my old trainer had told me about foods being good or bad. I'm not too familiar with much of the science behind it.

Not just eggwhites, I have them in my milk with oatmeal and toast. or if I'm full i cut out the toast.

The reason why it's just egg whites and not the whole egg is because I get them from costco and they come in cartons. It's just easier. The good stuff comes from the yolk but it's a lot more expensive and time consuming going through that many eggs instead of the ready to go cartons.

[Wikko]

Dont think of the bulking as a sprint from the start to the finish. If I were you I would keep at about 500 calories surplus and gain lean mass instead of eating a hell of a lot more and gaining mostly fat and only little muscle. With your height/weight and gym routine I seriously doubt that you would need 5k calories per day.

[Zelion]

I went from this to that. By going from a 1500 cal diet to 3500. I figured if i added even more I could continue to bulk as I've started to level out.





Honestly I'm just going off of what my old trainer had told me about foods being good or bad. I'm not too familiar with much of the science behind it.

Not just eggwhites, I have them in my milk with oatmeal and toast. or if I'm full i cut out the toast.

The reason why it's just egg whites and not the whole egg is because I get them from costco and they come in cartons. It's just easier. The good stuff comes from the yolk but it's a lot more expensive and time consuming going through that many eggs instead of the ready to go cartons.

I see.

Just a FYI, Body impediance is a terrible way to find measure body composition (as are all the other methods really, even bodpod/dexa are unreliable). So take those measurements with a grain of salt. The best way is going to be the mirror.

As Wikko says below this is not a race, most elite athletes don't need 5k, but there are exceptions to everything. You need very little, even 500 above maintenance is pushing it, to put on mass. The max I would put on is 2 lbs/month and even then half of that is going to be fat and that is as a beginner where you will put on the most muscle tissue. If you don't mind extra fat gain you can go for more.

Slowly add in calories if you have plateaued in weight. Sometimes as little as 100 will push you past.

Aren't shelled eggs cheaper than the liquid? Jwing. I never enjoyed the liquid cartons.

As for the good and bad foods. Most of the people that preach good and bad foods also follow the 1 day a week cheat meal/day thing in which you end up binging, creating an unhealthy relationship with food. Why not incorporate these foods in moderation to a balanced diet which is a much more mentally healthful way to approach it. It will help adherence as well.

[dixincide]

I wonder why 5k per day was ever suggested to me in the past if only a 300 cal difference is all that is needed.

If I can push 800 extra cals over my maintenance can I start running and still gain (Assuming I only burn the difference to keep an excess of 300 cal?)

[Bluesftw]

Milk with eggwhites ...and oatmeal? Please tell me you're puting this in the pan and making an omlette and not in a bowl and eating it like cereal... anyways i'd add some nuts and fruits to that ... you know...so it have taste. or spices. Also you can scrap that and have 4 sunny sides up for breakfast with that toast, eliminating yellows from eggs when you're trying to increase callories seems counterproductive.

[Random010203]

Even for a hard-gainer, 5k calories is completely unnecessary and quite frankly; ridiculous. Pro/IFBB participants eat around that and I can assure you they are much taller and much heavier. From what you posted you have a body-type like mine and what I have gathered from your post is that you want to gain more weight? Your caloric intake is fine, it's actually more than what it needs to be. The body doesn't just absorb whatever you put into it at the rate/level you want, if you are plateauing and your caloric intake is fine, try supplementing vitamin B, zinc and copper, all very inexpensive and safe vitamin/mineral(s) that will help utilize what you assimilate. Also drop the shake and put in another meal, hard-gainers benefit from higher carb ratios rather than protein. Also protein will fill you up faster, hit your protein macro and move onto the carbs.

Also, good job on your progression, I was checking the last thread you posted in and it seems you have made some good progress. Don't try and rush body transformation it takes time.

[dixincide]

The body doesn't just absorb whatever you put into it at the rate/level you want, if you are plateauing and your caloric intake is fine, try supplementing vitamin B, zinc and copper, all very inexpensive and safe vitamin/mineral(s) that will help utilize what you assimilate. Also drop the shake and put in another meal, hard-gainers benefit from higher carb ratios rather than protein. Also protein will fill you up faster, hit your protein macro and move onto the carbs.

Also, good job on your progression, I was checking the last thread you posted in and it seems you have made some good progress. Don't try and rush body transformation it takes time.

Thanks for the informative reply! And the compliment on my progress. I was very underweight when I started so the progress I made was very quick, which is why I feel like I'm not progressing very well today. I got used to making such large jumps in such a low time frame that I figured I could get back to the quick gains by adding even more calories. I now know that this is pretty stupid.

I never really looked into my zinc/copper/B12 put I might go by the store and pick some of those up, after some light research they look as though they'd be very helpful for me.

[truckboattruck]

define dirty?

bbq ribs and rice/potatos? great..eat more
ice cream and candy? no value

you cant cleanly eat 3500+ calories
and if you can...is it worth it?

[dixincide]

define dirty?

bbq ribs and rice/potatos? great..eat more
ice cream and candy? no value

you cant cleanly eat 3500+ calories
and if you can...is it worth it?

adding some more sauces and sugars.

I picked up a ZMA suppliment too, hoping to see it help with muscle recovery and sleep which i think would make a big difference.


I don't have much of a sweet tooth so sugary candy/ice cream/juice aren't going to hit the menu. lol.

[StayTuned]

Did I read this correctly? You are 160cm and you weight 78kg and you want to keep on... bulking?

Edit: 180 cm, I totally misread how tall you are in ft. Sry, nevemind me

Although I still don't understand why you need so many calories. You want to bulk muscles, not fat.

[Deleted]

I picked up a ZMA suppliment too, hoping to see it help with muscle recovery and sleep which i think would make a big difference.

Is it your first time using ZMA or a Zinc-supplement? If so, have fun with the possibly weird/vivid dreams you'll be getting

[dixincide]

Is it your first time using ZMA or a Zinc-supplement? If so, have fun with the possibly weird/vivid dreams you'll be getting

No dreams yet, although I've slept so much better now than when i wasn't taking the stuff. It's pretty nice!

[RippedGeek]

5k Calories? are you out of your mind?

heres a great introduction to calories, and its actually useful
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/calo...et-results.htm

[dixincide]

5k Calories? are you out of your mind?

heres a great introduction to calories, and its actually useful
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/calo...et-results.htm

I've been getting so many conflicting responses to this question.
Some people say I need 500 cals over my TDEE
Some say I need to eat for maintenance at my target weight. (195LBS 9% bodyfat I think would be nice)
So some people say 5000 cals is good to aim for, as long as I eat lean meats/good carbs.

Than other's are saying that it's ridiculous and will turn into fat. It's all very confusing. But this article helps.

[Deleted]

I've been getting so many conflicting responses to this question.
Some people say I need 500 cals over my TDEE
Some say I need to eat for maintenance at my target weight. (195LBS 9% bodyfat I think would be nice)
So some people say 5000 cals is good to aim for, as long as I eat lean meats/good carbs.

Than other's are saying that it's ridiculous and will turn into fat. It's all very confusing. But this article helps.

I'd say make it a case of personal trial and error. Start at a surplus of 500 kcal for a month and see if you're happy with it. More kcal most definitely results in faster strength gains, at a cost of gaining more fat, but it's something you should decide for yourself.

5k kcal for your height is way too much though, you'd get fat in no time on it. That amount is something a (taller) professional athlete on roids would consider, to put it in perspective