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  1. #21
    The Undying Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Don't censor video games in general. Now if the creator is ok to change it, fine whatever.
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  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    Don't censor video games in general. Now if the creator is ok to change it, fine whatever.
    Agreed.

    If the creator wants to make a game where you run around nude all day and smack people with cotten candy then so be it.
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  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Who decided what now? Nobody knew about this change until the game was released, as far as I know. Who is puritan Tommy and when did he have any input on the game?
    Oh my fucking god...

    The BROAD AMERICAN CULTURE has decided that video games they weren't going to play need to be censored and that I don't get the personal choice of having the game in its intended form.
    I must have missed where you showed this.
    More like you're constantly choosing to ignore what I said.
    Hyperbole? Because that's where you already jumped to earlier and it was completely irrelevant.
    Explain how this is hyperbole.

  4. #24
    In an ideal world? Sure. But in a world where a company needs to make profit they may need to censor certain things. I think outside censorship should be avoided aside from restricting access to the appropriate age levels though.

    If something is offensive to you, educate others regarding why it's offensive. Don't turn into a Nazi about it though.

  5. #25
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Nakloh View Post
    I agree. No game (or any other entertainment medium) should be censored. If you don't like it, don't view/play it.
    Censoring by itself isn't a problem, but there should be an option to turn it off.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by unholytestament View Post
    The BROAD AMERICAN CULTURE has decided that they weren't going to play need to be censored and that I don't get the personal choice of having the game in its intended form.
    Are there a few words missing here? Either the coffee I'm drinking hasn't totally kicked in or something else is going on, because I'm not sure what you're trying to say.

    Quote Originally Posted by unholytestament View Post
    More like you're constantly choosing to ignore what I said.
    No, I haven't. You just called it a "loaded term" and then a falacy and jumped to the below example to try to prove a point.

    Quote Originally Posted by unholytestament View Post
    Explain how this is hyperbole.
    Quote Originally Posted by unholytestament View Post
    but you know what's "more accepted"? Wholesome conventional clothes like you would wear to church!
    You're ignoring this wonderful thing called context that was presented in discussing the differences in cultural attitudes towards sexual/sexualized content between the US and many European countries or Japan.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aeilon View Post
    Censoring by itself isn't a problem, but there should be an option to turn it off.
    That defeats the purpose of the change. If the change was made to make an ESRB/Pegi rating (M or Pegi 18 rather than AO or whatever the Pegi version of that is), then having it in the game in any way will defeat the purpose and the game will get the higher rating.

  7. #27
    Deleted
    It doesn't fucking matter if their culture finds something 'not accepted'. You have the choice to not play/view it. Stop telling what your peers should/can do.

  8. #28
    I really shouldn't be so kind to Edge in these arguments. I should have just responded to the garbled mess he posted instead of waiting for him to fix it since he apparently couldn't be bothered to check and see if I edited my post.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Nakloh View Post
    It doesn't fucking matter if their culture finds something 'not accepted'. You have the choice to not play/view it. Stop telling what your peers should/can do.
    When it comes down to, "We can make a few minor changes to ensure a M rating vs an AO rating so that we can actually sell this game." or "We can make a few minor changes to X or Y to make sure we can get the retail box into these stores to increase sales.", culture does matter.

    If it didn't, you wouldn't have localization teams.

    Quote Originally Posted by unholytestament View Post
    I really shouldn't be so kind to Edge in these arguments. I should have just responded to the garbled mess he posted instead of waiting for him to fix it since he apparently couldn't be bothered to check and see if I edited my post.
    I see it now, coffee may have kicked in. I was speaking in generals, not in specifics. Again, look back to the example I gave.

    Broad cultures: Selling hentai mags on magazine stands without any kind of plastic cover to obscure nudity on the covers and having topless women in every day commercials was (and I assume still is) no biggie in Italy. Culturally, that type of stuff is cool. But in the US? Culturally not cool, so if you try to get away with it you're in for a hassle.

    Bringing it down to a more granular level, if you want your game stocked at retail in a country you have to conform to whatever cultural standards they have for the presentation/images on the box. If you want your game released in a country with a specific rating, you're going to have to conform to their cultural standards and whatever ratings guidelines they have set, which are informed by the local culture.

    This isn't new. This isn't unique to games. This isn't "moral handwringing", this is business. This is working to sell the highest volume of games to the most people possible.

  10. #30
    Deleted
    No one is arguing whether it is like this or not. The bottom line is that it shouldn't.

  11. #31
    It's dumb to censor an M rated game just because it had lingerie and claim it's because of America's perception of that kind of stuff when the Witcher 3 has topless and naked women everywhere and Game of Thrones is hugely popular.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    In an ideal world? Sure. But in a world where a company needs to make profit they may need to censor certain things. I think outside censorship should be avoided aside from restricting access to the appropriate age levels though.

    If something is offensive to you, educate others regarding why it's offensive. Don't turn into a Nazi about it though.
    Thats the thing though, as the article says unless the content is totally out of place for the game, people who would complain about the content wouldn't be buying it either way so it doesn't matter. Why censor a fanservice heavy game to appease people who wouldn't buy it even if censored?
    Last edited by Krause; 2015-10-21 at 07:50 PM.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    This isn't new. This isn't unique to games. This isn't "moral handwringing", this is business. This is working to sell the highest volume of games to the most people possible.
    Except it really, really isn't. As per the VP from the article, the people who cry for censorship aren't going to be buying the game anyway. Censoring it, as per the VP again, is going to piss off the people who were going to buy it.

    I have seen this in action. It continues to play out across the internet. But I can say is that if there is a loud enough cry for censorship, and the developer gives zero fucks, then that actually boosts the signal of the game and leads to more sales *cough*Hatred*cough*.

    But hey, I look forward to the next highly visible public thing you want to compare to the content of a video game.

  14. #34
    What is the point in having ratings if people are just going to censor shit anyway. The group chosing to censor something was never going to buy it in the first place.

    Having people who have no clue about what they are controling running the show is stupid. I want real gamers running the show not some old fokes that feel sex is bad.

    Fuck having someone decide for me if something is bad or not let me decide on my own.
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  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Jtbrig7390 View Post
    What is the point in having ratings if people are just going to censor shit anyway. The group chosing to censor something was never going to buy it in the first place.
    Ratings only has an indirect effect on censorship. The main purpose is for the parents/users that want to be aware of what they are about to buy.

    Otherwise, none of the platform holders allow an AO product on their platform.
    This is the main problem IMO.

  16. #36
    Stood in the Fire Affixiation's Avatar
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    Censoring is bad.
    And wrong.

    There needs to be a new, stronger word for censoring games. Like bad-wrong, or badong.
    Yes, censoring games is badong.

    From this moment, I will stand for the opposite of censoring. Gnodab.

    America, let my 2d titties run free.

  17. #37
    because censoring it would alienate the very audience that we are trying to bring the game for, while not really appeasing any of the critics that had no purchase intent in the first place
    I really like that one. People bothered by the content are not going to assuaged by mere censorship, while people who were interested in the original content will potentially feel betrayed and misled. Censorship is a bad business decision unless it's going to render the game completely unsaleable - for example garnishing an AO rating, which almost all brick-and-mortars will refuse to sell.
    ~ flarecde
    Reality is nothing; Perception is everything.

  18. #38
    Censoring depends entirely on the govenrment - to a whole i am opposed on censoring anything, though i can understand the reasons behind the censroship methods.

    HOWEVER.

    Specifically for videogames which are a pretty powerful media, especially for small children, multiple rating systems are in place.

    I'm not arguing about these ratings being too strict/too shallow, the fact is that they exist.

    If a parent buys his/her child a game rated 18+, it's his/her fault.

    Violent games are not the cause for bad behaviour, but as movies and even tv news (in which some reports are pretty much very violent and most of all real scenes) you cannot simply put your kids in front of the TV and pretend they're adults and can filter the contents they're seeing. They're just sponges absorbing everything.

    I was tempted to write all the post in caps as i'm very passionate about the argument. Every time censorships arguments happen the the videogame world, every time is the same unending list of complaints about violents/guns/blood/nudity/etc etc etc.

    Holy hell if you don't want to show your son this kind of stuff, don't buy him the fucking game ffs.
    No one wants to choose. Everyone wants everything.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by unholytestament View Post
    Except it really, really isn't. As per the VP from the article, the people who cry for censorship aren't going to be buying the game anyway. Censoring it, as per the VP again, is going to piss off the people who were going to buy it.

    I have seen this in action. It continues to play out across the internet. But I can say is that if there is a loud enough cry for censorship, and the developer gives zero fucks, then that actually boosts the signal of the game and leads to more sales *cough*Hatred*cough*.

    But hey, I look forward to the next highly visible public thing you want to compare to the content of a video game.
    It's an amazing skill, to be able to quote a person multiple times in several different posts and not even once actually reflect on the context presented by that person. You manage to give it a context that suits your argument the best. This last one is glorious. It literally does NOT touch on anything Edge says.

    Are you arguing that there is no such thing as culture?

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Vespian View Post
    Are you arguing that there is no such thing as culture?
    I can understand the culture argument for slightly censoring a broad audience game (for example: Bravely Default). But censoring a clearly targeted game (for example: Criminal Girls) is not going to make it appeal to the broader culture, and is going to alienate the existing target culture.

    Everything being said, without numbers it's really hard to make an argument as to whether either tactic works. It would be almost impossible to get these numbers, as American gaming companies in particular hold them as market secrets. Existing "sources" are wildly inaccurate.
    ~ flarecde
    Reality is nothing; Perception is everything.

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