Mars Colonization and the Moon and Mars as the 51st and 52nd state of the Union?

[Dezerte]

Ownership is enforced, not granted. So we either respect the outer space treaty or we potentially go to war over celestial bodies.

[Pengekaer]

You would actually force others into a war by doing so. Perhaps even make other powerfull countries work together to stop you.
Also don't forget how vulnerable the transportation to the colonies would be for missile interception.

I suppose even a laser-weapon could bug-zap small craft.

[owbu]

what could possibly go wrong if a country tries to colonize an area much bigger than them, somewhere far away from them

Also isnt puerto rico supposed to be 51?

[Hyve]

I recall reading somewhere that you're unable to own anything like the Moon, Asteroids, Comets and such.

No doubt that'll change in the future, but for now, no.

[S7orm]

What country has the guts to shoot an American shaceship? China? Russia? Nuclear armed countries? Are they that irrational to potentially start a thermonuclear war with the most powerful country in the world?

You don't understand how a treaty works apparently. You violate the terms and you have every other country against, all at once

Even without going nuclear, the US economy would collapse in years

[Kaleredar]

There's a treaty prohibiting claiming the moon, space, or other celestial bodies, being claimed by any nation.


Now whether that treaty is enforceable or not is an entirely separate question, but...

[timesmash]

Paint that shit glorious Red, White, and Blue.

If any of you think for one second we'd let those dirty commies lay claim to a giant peice of Rock, you haven't been paying attention.

[Ravenblade]

Paint that shit glorious Red, White, and Blue.

If any of you think for one second we'd let those dirty commies lay claim to a giant peice of Rock, you haven't been paying attention.

Okay, white, blue and red. Got it.

[Ryme]

Paint that shit glorious Red, White, and Blue.

If any of you think for one second we'd let those dirty commies lay claim to a giant peice of Rock, you haven't been paying attention.

When did the French get so bold?

[Flutterguy]

We should carve the faces of our presidents into the moon for all to see.

[Soeroah]

"What is the consequence if we just break (the Outer Space Treaty)?"


Have you heard of things called politics? Diplomacy? Let me break it down for you real quick.

The US practices diplomacy with other countries to avoid conflicts and wars. Countries sign treaties to avoid conflicts and wars.

The US government deciding to just 'break' the treaty and claim the moon or Mars is completely ridiculous. You ask "what consequence" that would result in? How about every other country on the planet deciding they can't trust the US at all, that all its treaties aren't worth a damn, they they are willing to completely betray any sense of international community they professed to police and encourage?

Breaking the treaty to colonise a literal planet isn't a "oh well damn, that sucks" moment, it's a realisation that the international community can't trust anything you say anymore.

The US might be powerful but it's unlikely it could win a war against multiple other heavy military nations, and even if it tried, its own people are likely to revolt against the Government for bringing war to their doorstep over something that doesn't matter to the individual in this lifetime, but is of such great importance to humanity as a whole as to measure up to, if not eclipse the diplomatic issues North Korea is causing with its nuclear testing.


The 'consequences' of breaking an international treaty that represents an effort to keep the rest of the universe the common heritage of mankind is putting the country on a chopping block with a bullseye on its chest.

[Noradin]

Paint that shit glorious Red, White, and Blue.

If any of you think for one second we'd let those dirty commies lay claim to a giant peice of Rock, you haven't been paying attention.

To claim it for Russia?

[Deleted]

Paint that shit glorious Red, White, and Blue.

If any of you think for one second we'd let those dirty commies lay claim to a giant peice of Rock, you haven't been paying attention.

Yes, the Netherlands has a very big space program.

[Cthulhu 2020]

Won't happen because NASA's budget was gutted by Republicans.

[ItachiZaku]

So I've been thinking, if the US were to reach mars and return to the moon, could we colonize and claim both celestial bodies as part of our country?

From what I've read, the Outer Space Treaty of 1967 prohibits nations from claiming ownership of anything in space that they didn't put there themselves. But there is a loophole, do we really need to abide by this treaty? What is the consequence if we just break it? Think about the potential for the US to colonize entire moons and planets.

In addition, how far are we aware from a manned mission to mars?

No, Obama defunded NASA, so they wouldn't possibly be ours.

[Deleted]

what if china claims the mars ? is the usa irrational enough to start a thermonuclear war on earth about it ?

its bad enough with the artificial islands in south china sea...

[kidchest]

what if china claims the mars ? is the usa irrational enough to start a thermonuclear war on earth about it ?

its bad enough with the artificial islands in south china sea...

That would be a good incentive to get to mars first. We didn't go to the fucking moon because "we felt like it" we wanted to out do the soviets. But considering the power of the United States of America, we would probably get to Mars before China does. China's space agency is very young, we've been at it for half a century. We got an edge over the rest of the world and quite frankly, we DESERVE it. Europe and the rest of the world never took space exploration seriously. Space exploration is a uniquely American thing and we deserve the rest of the solar system. We deserve Alpha Centari star system. Hell, in fact it was an American that discovered the system.

Lets look at foreign aid, which country gives the most amount of family planning contraceptives and development aid to poor country? THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. We help poor countries develop and slow down their birth rates. We earn the stars.

[unbound]

So I've been thinking, if the US were to reach mars and return to the moon, could we colonize and claim both celestial bodies as part of our country?

From what I've read, the Outer Space Treaty of 1967 prohibits nations from claiming ownership of anything in space that they didn't put there themselves. But there is a loophole, do we really need to abide by this treaty? What is the consequence if we just break it? Think about the potential for the US to colonize entire moons and planets.

In addition, how far are we aware from a manned mission to mars?

The consequence of breaking the treaty? Keep in mind that while we are the most powerful military in the world, we would lose if Russia and China sees us as a common enemy.

Realistically, a manned mission to Mars is at least a couple of decades away, and likely further out since we are spending averse for the foreseeable future. Keep in mind that for-profit corporations have no reason to go to Mars at this time, so if a government doesn't spend the money (no expectations on return on investment), we are likely looking at closer to a hundred years before we realistically send a manned mission to Mars (some hint at profit).

[Adam Jensen]

I don't think we have to really worry about America getting there anytime soon unless they find Oil.

Scientists discover oil on Kepler B!

*5 months later*

Scientists have invented faster than light travel!

[kidchest]

The consequence of breaking the treaty? Keep in mind that while we are the most powerful military in the world, we would lose if Russia and China sees us as a common enemy.

Realistically, a manned mission to Mars is at least a couple of decades away, and likely further out since we are spending averse for the foreseeable future. Keep in mind that for-profit corporations have no reason to go to Mars at this time, so if a government doesn't spend the money (no expectations on return on investment), we are likely looking at closer to a hundred years before we realistically send a manned mission to Mars (some hint at profit).

There might be ways to get around this idiotic treaty. If EU and US unite, we can pretty much ignore China and Russia.