[PROT] Protection artifact talents

[Recke]

The Vrykul practice rune magic and King Ymiron used magic to buff himself, so using a magic shield really isn't that big of a deal. Besides, warriors and fire are like bread and butter these days.

I still feel that if we're going to be focusing on the Vrykul warriors, it should be underlined, highlighted, and probably typed in bold that warrior's don't use magic. Or, maybe that's just my opinion and by popular demand or blizz's design, warriors can and will start to use magic.

[Valech]

I still feel that if we're going to be focusing on the Vrykul warriors, it should be underlined, highlighted, and probably typed in bold that warrior's don't use magic. Or, maybe that's just my opinion and by popular demand or blizz's design, warriors can and will start to use magic.

We use items infused with magic. We drink potions made my magic. We do not CAST.

[Toppy]

Nor should we be casting shadow anything since the whole point of the prot shield is that its from the scales of neltharion before he was deathwing.

The prot artifact line is just sad. Its not really bad, its just incredibly boring, and if the "shoot fire out our shield" effect roots us, it'll just make prot unfun to play.

[Valech]

Nor should we be casting shadow anything since the whole point of the prot shield is that its from the scales of neltharion before he was deathwing.

The prot artifact line is just sad. Its not really bad, its just incredibly boring, and if the "shoot fire out our shield" effect roots us, it'll just make prot unfun to play.

What implies that it roots us? The word "defensive posture"? Whenever Blizzard implements something, that has possible negative impact on your performance, they try to balance it with something else. Taking more damage as Fury? here, have a frequent self heal and a higher healthpool. Now, if these balances are sufficient is another topic, but since I do not see the ability of shadowflame shield outweighing a possible root in any kind, I highly doubt that it roots us.

Another topic is, that I beliebe Black dragon´s always used shadow as their element. Nefarian being a great example, as the eldest son of Neltharion. We even had to wear a damn cloak to shield us from his Shadow flames.
I am not sure how right I am regarding Lore, but I always associated (cleansening) fire with the red dragon swarm, nature magic with the greens, arcane with the blues and shadow with the black swarm. Just like shadow priests use shadow attacks without being corrupted.

[Deleted]

What implies that it roots us? The word "defensive posture"? Whenever Blizzard implements something, that has possible negative impact on your performance, they try to balance it with something else. Taking more damage as Fury? here, have a frequent self heal and a higher healthpool. Now, if these balances are sufficient is another topic, but since I do not see the ability of shadowflame shield outweighing a possible root in any kind, I highly doubt that it roots us.

Another topic is, that I beliebe Black dragon´s always used shadow as their element. Nefarian being a great example, as the eldest son of Neltharion. We even had to wear a damn cloak to shield us from his Shadow flames.
I am not sure how right I am regarding Lore, but I always associated (cleansening) fire with the red dragon swarm, nature magic with the greens, arcane with the blues and shadow with the black swarm. Just like shadow priests use shadow attacks without being corrupted.

Neltharion the Earthwarders breath type was lava/molten rock, which makes a lot of sense since they were tasked with protecting the earth and deep places of Azeroth. Shadow is just a tie in to the old god corruption, which happened (only) 10000 years ago.

On the other hand Dragon Scales retain a lot of magic and a strong connection to their dragon after having been shed, so something can be said of the shield being corrupted even though it no longer had a physical connection to neltharion. But that's really a lore excuse cause sometimes that's not the case and sometimes it is.

(also the new shadow priest insanity mechanics heavily hint at them being corrupted by old gods)

[Valech]

Interesting. Where do you have that molten earth/lava thingy from? I never read the books.

[Toppy]

Interesting. Where do you have that molten earth/lava thingy from? I never read the books.

His associated element is earth and he has been shown to breath molten lava. Did you do the Deathwing fight? I dont think Deathwing himself has -ever- used shadow? Only one of his sons, who was also a powerful caster.

[Valech]

His associated element is earth and he has been shown to breath molten lava. Did you do the Deathwing fight? I dont think Deathwing himself has -ever- used shadow? Only one of his sons, who was also a powerful caster.

Wait... something in your train of thoughts is flawed.

First you claim a shadow theme on a shield from a scale of the uncorrupted Deathwing makes no sense. Fine.
That means it would make sense if the scale was from the corrupted Deathwing. Otherwise it would have been very obsolete to mention the state of Deathwings corruption at all.
THEN you say, that even the corrupted Deathwing did not use any shadow themes attacks.

Unless you made an obsolete statement (but that would be silly, you surely don´t do that) to yet again express your disdain of x (with x being the prot shield in this case) I am not sure why you would mention Deathwing´s corruption at all.


Also, I believe there were one or two shadow themed abilities at the last Deathwing fight. Will look up if needed.

[Toppy]

Wait... something in your train of thoughts is flawed.

First you claim a shadow theme on a shield from a scale of the uncorrupted Deathwing makes no sense. Fine.
That means it would make sense if the scale was from the corrupted Deathwing. Otherwise it would have been very obsolete to mention the state of Deathwings corruption at all.
THEN you say, that even the corrupted Deathwing did not use any shadow themes attacks.

Unless you made an obsolete statement (but that would be silly, you surely don´t do that) to yet again express your disdain of x (with x being the prot shield in this case) I am not sure why you would mention Deathwing´s corruption at all.


Also, I believe there were one or two shadow themed abilities at the last Deathwing fight. Will look up if needed.

Its more so that it makes a little more sense for shadow based attack with corrupted deathwing, since, shadow magic or not, he was still corrupted. TBH, it still makes more sense with corrupted deathwing to be fire, since ffs, all through cata he would nuke zones with fire breath.

The point is that having our shield shoot shadow due to his scales might make sense if they were corrupted, since the domain of old gods is shadow. Even if he never used shadow it would still make some sense.

And no need to be an ass about it. Or purposely dense.

[KrotosTheTank]

Few random thoughts here and there.

One, briefly, for the above discussion, perhaps it's as simple as fire damage tends to lead to DoT type damage, which may not play into the dev's thoughts on the ability, whereas shadow damage could be more of a stream/ "channeled".

Two, super random, but the talk of rooting made me think a great ability for warriors could be "Uproot" which gives us the strength to break free from that which binds us. (great druid / frost mage counter). I know Avatar does this, but would be nice to have a baseline ability or better yet something that pulses. We used to get second wind from moments like these at least...

Lastly, for the spell reflect comments. I just wanted to add that back in BC I found it incredibly useful (though I'm sure not by game design) that on the Al'ar encounter you could reflect while on the Flame Patches and it would "kill" them. Made for great ground clutter cleanup.

I am one that definitely wishes Spell Reflect could be showcased more often, perhaps something that let's us shine in 5 mans. I have no clue how anyone is supposed to compete with DKs there, grip is too powerful. (perhaps one of the CM "buffs" will not allow mobs to be moved by players). BUT it does appear vengeance DH may have a form of "grip" similar to a delayed ursol's vortex without the need for the mobs to move. Would just be nice to have that niche like they do.

Krotos

[Vyrtt]

I've been playing around in the alpha and on the topic of spell reflect. I'm not sure if it's just because alpha or if it is the new intended change that you get to spell reflect just about any cast. I hit spell reflect on accident on a moose charge and the moose was knocked back instead of my character. I'm also able to reflect kobold shots and flurry attacks.

[Shelly]

Multiple shields in the game have had damage procs, I really don't think it's a big deal for the Warrior Artifact to get one too.

If you want some fancy lore reason just look at the Dragon Soul which was a dragon scale infused with the power of every aspect. We've just got one infused with the aspect of Earth. Whether it stays shadowflame - used by pretty much everyone in the black dragon flight - or it goes to fire doesn't really matter and if you're whining about it then you're just splitting hairs because you feel like you need wild justification for why you don't like something rather than just not liking it.

Anyway, spell reflect being a flat damage reduction would be incredibly helpful just all around. Lots of bosses and trash do volley spells, there's the slash from Gruul, there's the mines on Blackhand, so on and so forth. It's worth using and who knows, maybe they'll have more things that are reflective in Legion?

[tommos]

An items attributes is determined by it's maker and it's origin. Blacksmith makes and axe and infuses it with fire. Warrior wields axe and does fire damage. The blacksmith has to know stuff about fire magic to make the axe. The warrior doesn't have to know stuff about fire magic to use the axe. Cenarius makes this axe and infuses it with druidic power. Brox wields axe and cuts Sargeras. Does Brox know anything about druids and the Emerald Dream? Nope. Is the fantasy that Brox is a badass warrior ruined? Nope.

So by all means stick runes and shit on the shield/sword. Vrykul love runes. They sprinkle that shit on their cereal in the morning. It'll make the weapon more interesting to look at and won't ruin "class identity" because it was the Vrykul who used runes not the warrior.

[Vyrtt]

What implies that it roots us? The word "defensive posture"? Whenever Blizzard implements something, that has possible negative impact on your performance, they try to balance it with something else. Taking more damage as Fury? here, have a frequent self heal and a higher healthpool. Now, if these balances are sufficient is another topic, but since I do not see the ability of shadowflame shield outweighing a possible root in any kind, I highly doubt that it roots us.

It roots us in the effect that you're channeling an ability that does beans for damage. If you move the channel breaks and the effect ends. And while it's channeling you can't hit anything otherwise it ends. It's a bad skill that's only really good for aoe, but even that isn't much better.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ss=0&source=32
In case you're curious about numbers (which I know aren't tuned cause it's alpha) there's a sample from the dungeon on alpha.
And stats in partial dungeon gear and partial quest gear.
http://i.imgur.com/00YpXQr.png

[TheAbomb]

There seems to be some nice damage via Shield Slam and ramp up with Focused Rage. I want WotLK Prot to come back. My question is how much does the scales from the shield make the enemy vunerable by what %? Does this function like old arm penetration? If so yes!

I also like the heroic leap cd reduction in the artifact think Prot should be the most mobile warrior spec.