Mafia 65: Murder on the Orient Express

[Dendrek]

No one else visited you throughout the game?

Why are you so sure tumppu is town?

Nope.

And because I was sure his character was in the game.

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From the OP: "Tragedy strikes again as Diane Kegley was found dead early this morning in her brother's home"

From Virothe's RP: "As you have aged, these words have seemed to ring more and more truthful that is except for one, Diane Elliot."

Conclusion: Diane has a brother. His last name is Elliot.

[Blood Fox]

why are you fuckers still talking?

[Dendrek]

If that's your power then i can see them equally wanting to kill listo or me.

My role is not dangerous, I agree. But as Lelly pointed out, scum like to kill off vocal town. I've been the most vocal this game. It's possible they'll keep me alive, especially if one of my reads on my FoSs is wrong, but I've been expecting to die for some time now. And if the mafia only has to snipe town at this point, there's no reason I should be allowed to survive.

[Blood Fox]

Maxilian (6) - Listo(921), Tumppu(924), Lelly(939), PalawinFC (984), Cruelle (989), Arialla (997)


Everyone gangs up on Nettie Harris and throws her from the moving train.

Maxilian playing Nettie Harris (SK) has been lynched!

Spoiler: 

It is now night, Please submit Night actions within 18 hours.

[Xanjori]

Bump .

[Blood Fox]

Everyone converges in the morning to find one more passenger slain in the night.

Dendrek playing Father Norman Mathews (Priest) has been slain!

Spoiler: 

Let the investigation begin!

Day deadline:

With 8 players alive it takes 5 to lynch

[PalawinFC]

Oh. Day started hours ago but no posts? Lol.

Going to need people to be more active than this. I'm rereading the last few days but for now:

Lelly, max obviously didn't have the ability to investigate and he wasn't aligned with dranx so he couldn't get the info from the mafia lovers.
Can you explain why your claim is the same as the fake claim max came up with before you made it?

[listo95]

So as of right now if we have 3 mafia we are in mylo. If we have 2 we can afford 1 mislynch. My top suspects right now are Celtic cause his character should have 0 reason to want Erik dead (who wants to bet all the VTs killed Erik?) and Lelly cause unless Max is extremely good at guessing you should not have something near the same RP.

[SatsuBL]

Did they have same RP? Max was some slave woman, and Lelly a girl who married a mafia guy who ended up in a river. This is some weird stuff going on, there was something in Max's QT that he was supposed to check, maybe some moderror and he got wrong RP. I think there should be only 2 mafia left right now. 9 mafia in a game with only a cop and a modified JK, would be an overkill.

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If he got a wrong (Lelly's) RP than Lelly shouldn't be mafia because they don't have RP in rolecards. If Lelly told a fake RP that she got from some cop check, that whose RP is that.

[Deleted]

So as of right now if we have 3 mafia we are in mylo. If we have 2 we can afford 1 mislynch. My top suspects right now are Celtic cause his character should have 0 reason to want Erik dead (who wants to bet all the VTs killed Erik?) and Lelly cause unless Max is extremely good at guessing you should not have something near the same RP.

He killed those poor innocent children! Who wouldn't want that monster dead?I'd rather go after more i nactives over lelly since it's been well established that scum are lurking among them

[Deleted]

So as of right now if we have 3 mafia we are in mylo. If we have 2 we can afford 1 mislynch. My top suspects right now are Celtic cause his character should have 0 reason to want Erik dead (who wants to bet all the VTs killed Erik?) and Lelly cause unless Max is extremely good at guessing you should not have something near the same RP.

Yep I agree with this.

The rp thing gives me a headache trying to figure it out. Even if he was a good guesser he still knew way to much. Go back and read the exchange between me Raza and Max on #756/757/758. Raza suggested an SK team, to which I reply that I hadn't considered that.

So far its the only thing I have come up with, also only 1 night kill last night so that doesn't support my theory at all...But then if there was two nks wouldn't that make it obvious?

Anyway I just wanted to comment on the rp thing. Will post more on Celtic an Lelly (and the rest of you) when I get home.

[tumppu]

I really hope this RP thing does not end up being a simple slip in the distribution of CCs. It has muddled the waters quite a bit.

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Did they have same RP? Max was some slave woman, and Lelly a girl who married a mafia guy who ended up in a river. This is some weird stuff going on, there was something in Max's QT that he was supposed to check, maybe some moderror and he got wrong RP. I think there should be only 2 mafia left right now. 9 mafia in a game with only a cop and a modified JK, would be an overkill.

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If he got a wrong (Lelly's) RP than Lelly shouldn't be mafia because they don't have RP in rolecards. If Lelly told a fake RP that she got from some cop check, that whose RP is that.

If someone has not noticed and counterclaimed at this point, it starts to tip in Lellys favor being town, though it's still weird how Max managed to cook up so similar a claim. Obviously he flipped something entirely different than what he was claiming earlier. So if that turns out to be a foul up, I'm going to be sad.

[PalawinFC]

For fucks sake. Satsu and tumppu - you've either completely misunderstood or you're trying to obfuscate the issue.

They didn't coincidentally make up the same claim. They didn't claim at the same time!

This is what can have happened:

IF Lelly is mafia - she fake counterclaimed max (both of them lied). Maybe she guessed max was sk and wanted to strengthen her own position by taking the risk that he would flip something else, adding credibility to her claim.

IF Lelly is town - max somehow obtained her role play information. We have seen his role card and he had no way to do this.

IF lelly is also sk - veryuremote possibility that there is an sk pair who came up with the same fake claim as a gambit to get town credibility. The lynch was between max or lelly so this gambit would have been attractive. It's remote because of game balance and because it requires the sks to have alternate night kills despite sharing a qt or dendrek was double tapped last night.

[Deleted]

Will post more on Celtic an Lelly (and the rest of you) when I get home.

I am going to do this when I wake up tomorrow. I am so tired I can't concentrate.

@ Tumppu-I'm not sure I follow you. Are you saying if no one counters you that means your town. Because none of us were countered and we can't all be town.

(If I'm not making sense its because I am half a sleep)

[Lellybaby]

For fucks sake. Satsu and tumppu - you've either completely misunderstood or you're trying to obfuscate the issue.

They didn't coincidentally make up the same claim. They didn't claim at the same time!

This is what can have happened:

IF Lelly is mafia - she fake counterclaimed max (both of them lied). Maybe she guessed max was sk and wanted to strengthen her own position by taking the risk that he would flip something else, adding credibility to her claim.

IF Lelly is town - max somehow obtained her role play information. We have seen his role card and he had no way to do this.

IF lelly is also sk - veryuremote possibility that there is an sk pair who came up with the same fake claim as a gambit to get town credibility. The lynch was between max or lelly so this gambit would have been attractive. It's remote because of game balance and because it requires the sks to have alternate night kills despite sharing a qt or dendrek was double tapped last night.

So let me see if I have this right... You're claiming that due to Max's role card there should be no way for him to know my character claim, but then you go and say there is a possibility of me being a SK also even though on Max's role card (which you're claiming is absolute truth) it clearly says his character can kill each night.

We all know the Sk suggestion is ridiculous so I'm not going to bother to respond.

Only one kill last night, I'm more than prepared to suggest that its Town vs Mafia remaining.

I don't know why Max had my claim. We have possible explanation in that there may have been a mix up.

Evidence Piece A - Agatha Christie posted in the main thread that Max should check his QT. Not enough to make a confident reading but possible suggestion as per Satsu's comment - that indeed there may have been an error

Evidence Piece B - In the mafia discussion thread (Which really shouldn't be included) - Max posted (after he had been lynched) showing surprise and awe at his character claim. Again not proof by any means but it does cast some reasonable doubt on the situation.

6 mafia & 1 Sk killed.

Rule of three still dictates 3 scum remaining (mafia)

If that is true and we all go on a mafia today we will need all 5 remaining town to lynch that mafia.

Our remaining players: I suggest everyone post a Most Trust -> Most Distrust and see if we have consensus.

1.Arialla
2.Celtic209
3.Cruelle
4.lellybaby
5.Listo95
6.PalawinFC
7.SatsuBL
8.Tumpuu

Trust:

Lellybaby
Arialla
Celtic
Listo95
Palawin

Unsure:

Satsu
Tumpuu

Don't Trust:

Cruelle

[PalawinFC]

Wow no posts all morning? Is Thursday night in the us right? How can none of you be around?

Ok if no one will offer anything then I'll ask for it:

I think that listo, Arialla and cruelle are probably town.
Lelly, Celtic, Tumppu and Satsu are not likely to be town.

Obviously all 4 can't be scum or the game would be over so im wrong about at least 1 of you.

Lelly - I'm pretty sure you're scum. Your claim makes no sense whatsoever. Please give me a plausible explanation because otherwise im inclined to vote on you today.

Celtic - your claim yesterday had issues. Townies all have a motive to kill erik.

He killed those poor innocent children!

Are you just inferring this or does your role card talk about it? Give us more information please.

Tumppu - mate you act so insanely scummy every game. I'm so reluctant to trust my read on you because it's 100% scumread every game. Please give us a list of the remaining players and who you think is scum and why.

Satsu - you've skated by the entire game on your early claim. To be honest initially i thought your character was probably a tpr based on his close relationship with the police chief. Even if not a tpr, a claimed character who most think is innocent would be a better kill target than many who have died. You should have been night killed by now.
This makes me think you're scum. I have a theory that mafia could have had a safe fake claim and you used it early when pressured because you are the other mafia lover and didn't want to lose your investigation ability.
Can we please have your thoughts on the remaining players?

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Dammit. Twi posts since i started writing lol.

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So let me see if I have this right... You're claiming that due to Max's role card there should be no way for him to know my character claim, but then you go and say there is a possibility of me being a SK also even though on Max's role card (which you're claiming is absolute truth) it clearly says his character can kill each night.

We all know the Sk suggestion is ridiculous so I'm not going to bother to respond.

Only one kill last night, I'm more than prepared to suggest that its Town vs Mafia remaining.

I don't know why Max had my claim. We have possible explanation in that there may have been a mix up.

Evidence Piece A - Agatha Christie posted in the main thread that Max should check his QT. Not enough to make a confident reading but possible suggestion as per Satsu's comment - that indeed there may have been an error

Evidence Piece B - In the mafia discussion thread (Which really shouldn't be included) - Max posted (after he had been lynched) showing surprise and awe at his character claim. Again not proof by any means but it does cast some reasonable doubt on the situation.

6 mafia & 1 Sk killed.

Rule of three still dictates 3 scum remaining (mafia)

If that is true and we all go on a mafia today we will need all 5 remaining town to lynch that mafia.

Our remaining players: I suggest everyone post a Most Trust -> Most Distrust and see if we have consensus.

1.Arialla
2.Celtic209
3.Cruelle
4.lellybaby
5.Listo95
6.PalawinFC
7.SatsuBL
8.Tumpuu

Trust:

Lellybaby
Arialla
Celtic
Listo95
Palawin

Unsure:

Satsu
Tumpuu

Don't Trust:

Cruelle

It seems like an impossible error given its not even sending the wrong role card is sending someone else's role card as a safe claim.

Can you elaborate why you trust celtic and distrust cruelle?

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Also i just read maxes post and you've severely mischaracterised it.

He said his role card was "weird as fuck - my character sounds like a mad woman".
He's obviously talking about the psycho "nettie get the ak" shit. You've stretched this so much to suit yourself.

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Also Agatha Christie's warning came right after max gave specific details of his role card. Particularly when he said his ability is called revenge.

[Lellybaby]

Also i just read maxes post and you've severely mischaracterised it.

He said his role card was "weird as fuck - my character sounds like a mad woman".
He's obviously talking about the psycho "nettie get the ak" shit. You've stretched this so much to suit yourself.

I haven't stretched anything. Its all there in the role-card

Why would he say that now when we have all had our RP flavour text since the start of the game.

You've got blinkers on.

I've now had 3 scum (1sk & 2 mafia) both try to push me over an AFK mafia team member. Why would they go so heavily on me instead of trying to gain town cred for doing away with an AFKer who was scum to boot, because they thought I was a soft easy target.

You're the one that started the train and look how all the scum jumped on. That's why I think you're town. You were going to be a patsy. Crackle was smart enough to jump off when he saw the Kel vote.

It might sound like Ego, but I've only ever been lynched as town maybe three times in my entire time playing on this forum, 2 of those times at my own begest.

I don't get lynched as town. I get NKed.

I'm more than freely to admit at the start of this game I was playing shit. I tried something new and it backfired. I was prepared to pay the price. But when the scum jumped on my wagon for the first time I finally saw the scum among the town.

From Day 5:

Scum List from my perspective:

Kel
Max
Cruelle
Anakso

3 for 3 so far, do we really want to see if I'm 4 from 4.

Lelly (7) - Palawin(654), Maxilian(658), Kel(663), Anakso(685), Tumppu(691), Celtic(692), Crackle(695)

That's a lot of scum on my train already. I don't believe either Tumppu or Celtic would jump onto the wagon straight after Kel and Anakso.

The people who didn't vote: Satsu, Listo95, Cruelle, Arialla

Three who didn't post during that time while one did: Cruelle

I have no actual guilty on Cruelle or anything. I'm just incredibly suspicious.

[Arialla]

*strangles the person playing Tuppance* :P

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Sorry, 12 hour day at work and I was so busy i came home and napped.

[PalawinFC]

I'm not wearing blinders. Ive addressed 4 different people.

The reason i posted so much about you is because you're argument is sneaky and you're changing multiple small things very slightly to create a larger argument . Seeing as i dint trust half the people left and the other half are afk, i feel responsible to point to the logical flaws in what you're saying.

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Fucking phone. I'll type more on the train ride home.

[Deleted]

Our remaining players: I suggest everyone post a Most Trust -> Most Distrust and see if we have consensus.

1.Arialla
2.Celtic209
3.Cruelle
4.lellybaby
5.Listo95
6.PalawinFC
7.SatsuBL
8.Tumpuu

Trust:

Lellybaby
Arialla
Celtic
Listo95
Palawin

Unsure:

Satsu
Tumpuu

Don't Trust:

Cruelle

Well it appears we don't really agree on a whole lot this game.

How are Satsu and Tumppu that low, they are both much higher up my list. So your plan is lynch me go after Satsu and Tumppu? If town follows you Lelly we have lost. Have you read Satsu's posts? have you read Tumppu's character claim I strongly recommend you go back and re-read. I can't work out why you are so far off the mark.


Also

You find everyone on your wagon from earlier in the game to be scummy. A wagon I wasn't on. and then give the reason that because I wasn't on it I'm scummy. So if I voted you I'm scummy and if I didn't vote you I'm scummy, can't win that one can I?

I find it very suspicious that your being so selective with your reasoning, for example you didn't say who I was actually voting for. Which as it happens is someone who is high up on your trust list! You also neglected to include the rest of my vote record. I think you at least owe me that other than Cru is scum " I just no". I haven't played a perfect game look at my vote record plenty to ask questions about... so do it. Same with everyone lets look at everyone's vote records we can't afford a mislynch.


I also have mixed feelings about your list thing. It feels like "everyone make a list so I can work out who to kill tonight ta" but saying that we should at least acknowledge that town must lynch 3 scummies in a row because 1 mislynch and its over.

I can partially agree with you on the SK thing. Even though we don't have any other explanations for it, I really am baffled as to how to explain it away and can't wait for end game to find out.

Will be back to post more later as my break is about to finish.

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Also to quickly add

There is a lot of discussion to be had about voting records, character claims and dead townies views on others.
Were 18 hours into the day and we really have not touched on a lot of this stuff because the SK thing has taken so much attention.

I hopefully will be able to post more myself after my meeting has finished. be back as soon as I can.