1. #2881
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Surfd View Post
    It literally does not matter if A is more intricate than B by a few fractional degrees.
    So the sword is not more intricate but it is more intricate by a few degrees. You are agreeing with me. It is as simple as that.
    Last edited by rhorle; 2022-01-10 at 04:59 AM.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
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  2. #2882
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    So the sword is not more intricate but it is more intricate by a few degrees. You are agreeing with me. It is as simple as that.
    Ok, fuck it, fine, I give up, you win. Making a book accurate prop sword would 100% have required making a more "intricate" prop, which likely would have cost them a whopping 15 to 20 bucks more in production costs, so they probably would have been forced to buy plain hamburg buns instead of kaiser rolls for lunch one Saturday to make up for the crushing budget overrun that would have required. So glad you proved your point.

  3. #2883
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Surfd View Post
    Ok, fuck it, fine, I give up, you win. Making a book accurate prop sword would 100% have required making a more "intricate" prop, which likely would have cost them a whopping 15 to 20 bucks more in production costs, so they probably would have been forced to buy plain hamburg buns instead of kaiser rolls for lunch one Saturday to make up for the crushing budget overrun that would have required. So glad you proved your point.
    My comments were not about what it would take to make a book accurate prop sword. It was about making a more intricate one, closer to the fableblades example, would have cost more then the less intricate one they did create. Simple as that. It would have been nice if they did have a more intricate, ornate, or any other descriptor for "better" you can think of then the one the show did so it was both "unique" and "book accurate".

    I also don't think you have knowledge of production costs if you think it would be $15 or $20 dollars extra. The Fableblades site says it can cost up to $XX,XXX for a sword and up to the same from a scabbard. The minimun was $X,XXX for each. Do you have anything to show that the swords used on the show are not normal swords and just "props" painted/whatever to look real?
    Last edited by rhorle; 2022-01-10 at 06:05 AM.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
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  4. #2884
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Do you have anything to show that the swords used on the show are not normal swords and just "props" painted/whatever to look real?
    Are you actually asking if shows like GoT and Wheel use REAL FUCKING SWORDS for their shit? Nobody, anywhere, is going to use "normal swords" for TV or Movie combat. Even a moderately good "normal sword" is going to cost you several hundred bucks, minimum. That's literally why they have prop departments. A single, moderately good "real" sword would cost them 10x what a comparable prop would, easy. Not to mention the fact that nobody in their right mind is going to actually USE a several hundred dollar sword for literally anything other than display purposes, because simply hitting shit with it would do nearly irreparable damage to it..... Don't be mental. That's about as dumb as asking if they destroyed actual million dollar super cars in every installment of Fast and the Furious.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    It was about making a more intricate one, closer to the fableblades example, would have cost more then the less intricate one they did create. Simple as that.
    Except that you have no way to prove that. You are simply making that statement based on the appearance of the Fableblade item, which is literally a display piece designed by a company that specializes in selling over priced display shit to collectors with more money than sense.

    Any competent propmaster could have made a book accurate prop for a fraction of what that Fableblade piece actually costs because literally the only thing that matters when making props is the visual look. The material cost for the Fableblade piece alone would likely pay for 20 prop swords going by the crazy prices they list for shit on their website.

    I mean, christ, a quick google search can turn up a dozen places selling move quality prop swords for around 120 bucks as a FINISHED PRODUCT complete with scabbard. You think someone with the backing of a giant like freaking Amazon couldn't find someone willing to wholesale them prop sword parts for dozen different styles of swords for a literal fraction of that on a per item basis? Don't make me laugh.
    Last edited by Surfd; 2022-01-10 at 06:40 AM.

  5. #2885
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Surfd View Post
    Are you actually asking if shows like GoT and Wheel use REAL FUCKING SWORDS for their shit? Nobody, anywhere, is going to use "normal swords" for TV or Movie combat.
    https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/...weapons-artist

    This seems to indicate that Game of Thrones had both "real" steel swords, aluminum ones for fight scenes and action shots, with rubber ones for some stuntwork. I was asking if you knew what the Wheel of Time show used or if you are just using the same "I know everything" attitude that had you argue for several pages on something you actually agreed with me about.

    Also they spent millions to create the Two Rivers village and then burned/destroyed most of it for the Trolloc attack scene. I don't think you know enough about how the film industry treats sets to be calling anyone mental or things dumb. Amazon wasn't even upset about it. https://www.cbr.com/wheel-of-time-bu...urned-it-down/
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
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  6. #2886
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Also they spent millions to create the Two Rivers village and then burned/destroyed most of it for the Trolloc attack scene. I don't think you know enough about how the film industry treats sets to be calling anyone mental or things dumb. Amazon wasn't even upset about it. https://www.cbr.com/wheel-of-time-bu...urned-it-down/
    So wait. Let me get this straight. They spent MILLIONS OF DOLLARS to create a fake village that literally appears in maybe 1.5 Episodes and then destroyed it, yet they can't be arsed to spend maybe 200 bucks, literally, tops, to make a prop sword that is actually book accurate so Rand can carry it around for at least probably 2 full seasons?

    Glad to know the moron in charge of this shitshow has his priorities straight. Gods.

  7. #2887
    The Insane rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Surfd View Post
    So wait. Let me get this straight. They spent MILLIONS OF DOLLARS to create a fake village that literally appears in maybe 1.5 Episodes and then destroyed it, yet they can't be arsed to spend maybe 200 bucks, literally, tops, to make a prop sword that is actually book accurate so Rand can carry it around for at least probably 2 full seasons?
    Is the moron the one that does things that please the people paying the bills, or the one that pulls a random number out of the air to continue complaining about a show you've disliked for weeks already? Because I'm pretty sure you don't have proof that it literally costs $200 and are misusing that word as well.

    Also what do you honestly expect them to do with the village? It isn't present again till later if the show even goes back there. Would you rather the cheaped out on the winters night attack? Spent money to upkeep and preserve it in some random quarry? Hollywood has long destroyed, buried, or abandoned sets that cost a lot of money to build. The most famous one is probably the DeMille set that was dismantled and buried in the desert after filming was done. http://dunescenter.org/visit-the-dun...ty-of-demille/
    Last edited by rhorle; 2022-01-10 at 06:52 AM.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  8. #2888
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Because I'm pretty sure you don't have proof that it literally costs $200 and are misusing that word as well.
    The simple fact that I can buy THIS, which includes an actual hand forged folded Damascus Steel Blade and authentic Ray Skin on on the hilt for 400 Canadian dollars is pretty much all the proof I need. It tells me that you would have to be insane to imagine that a propmaster (Ie, a guy that makes functional but essentially fake weapons) couldn't make a decent book accurate blade for a significantly less.

    I mean, fuck, they will even engrave it at no additional charge, so I could get a heron mark on it for free! Score! (Hell, you could probably get them to replace the dragon on the hilt with a Heron at minimal additional charge too, if you asked nicely about it).

    Do you really expect me to believe that a prop sword, even a REALLY PRETTY prop sword meant entirely to be used as a "presentation" piece, can't be made for under 200 bucks when I can buy a literal professionally produced authentically blacksmith made sword that has been marked up for retail sale to include labor costs at just 400 bucks? For that matter, that same website offers a slightly less fancy but nearly identical Katana (no special electroplated red blade) for a mere 300 bucks CAD.

    At the current exchange rate, that works out to about 240 American. So again, tell me how ball-parking a prop weapon (the entire point of which is to be less expensive than the real thing) at 200 bucks American on the top end is somehow unrealistic when a professionally hand smithed sword made using premium materials costs ~240 after markup for retail sale......

    Like, think about it: if you are correct and my estimate on what it costs to make a "quality" prop weapon is too low then hell, they could literally have custom ordered their "Heron Mark Katana" piece from this website and it would have probably cost them less than what they spent to make that cheapass looking piece of garbage from the picture with it's insulting glue on heron decal.

    I mean, christ, 99% of the actual "high end" steel prop swords these people are dealing with are made of basic industrial spring steel and cost a fraction of what a real sword blade would be worth. The blades aren't even "forged" in the traditional sense of the blacksmithing process. They are made of industrially produced bar stock that can be cut to shape with a CNC machine in an hour and then have a "blade" put on them with an angle grinder in a couple more. The material for the blade on that katana I mentioned above probably makes up half cost of the damn thing. The spring steel needed to produce a prop likely costs you about 20 to 30 bucks at wholesale prices by comparison.
    Last edited by Surfd; 2022-01-10 at 08:35 AM.

  9. #2889
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    Quote Originally Posted by kenn9530 View Post
    rotten tomatos is useless not enough ratings to base anything accurately of it, imbd is the only one with a decent amount and most of its ratings were all 7 and above with most at a 10 rating, the rating was probably dropped by one whole mark because book fans didnt get the story they wanted otherwise it would be over 8.

    Its a solid good show and that is proven by all the data available, even most of the ratings on amazon are mostly max ratings, ppl who give something the lowest rating are just doing it out of spite not because its actually bad.
    Imma flip that around real quick.

    The people giving it max ratings are just doing it out of spite/fanboyism.

    That was easy.

  10. #2890
    7.2 on IMDB now. I think it can hit below 7 before second season. It can go quite low. Ofcourse there are lot of "good" TV shows at 6.5s. Hell, very successful transformers movies are 7 or less on IMDB.

    We were just clueless about what passed for good on Amazon. Its all good. Kudos to rafe and team.

  11. #2891
    Quote Originally Posted by Mazza View Post
    *Doesn't believe the data*
    *Claims the data proves him right*

    Right then...
    Do you think less than 5k is enough of a sample base to even give a remotely accurate reading, at least imbd has over 70k to get something from, you are just trying to use a website that doesnt do stuff accurately to try and back your view.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gigantique View Post
    Imma flip that around real quick.

    The people giving it max ratings are just doing it out of spite/fanboyism.

    That was easy.
    Ppl who give 1 ratings when its very obvious its not are just immature children because they didnt get what they imagined the tv series to be, you dont always get what you want so suck it up, the tv series is more than good enough for ppl to give a max rating because what is most important in a tv series is entertainment, if it does that its done its job.

    My point stands the series is good, its not the best series ever but is solid and enjoyable, too many series that are good still dont get enough seasons though.
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  12. #2892
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    Are you crying? There's no crying in these forums! No crying...
    Dude, this whole thread literally lives on the tears of the people complaining lol You're one of the biggest people contributing to that with posts of even less substance than this one I'm typing right now...

    Have a long-winded whinge that most people ignore about the "ultra feminist agenda" or whatever cringe Mace wants to post, and get that ranking increased! Or, just keep searching the internet for random shit you can post to be more and more sad about a TV show where you can't handle that some people may have enjoyed it and need to label them as trolls because of that opinion.

  13. #2893
    Quote Originally Posted by kenn9530 View Post
    Ppl who give 1 ratings when its very obvious its not

    How is it "very obvious" that its not a 1?


    I'm not saying that it IS a 1, but you are making as much of an assumption as anyone else that "so many people loved it". Between the ways ratings can be gamed online (both for and against) and the ways studios go out of their way to make everything look like a success (Disney is supposedly the biggest offender of this, but Amazon could easily be doing this too)..... trying to make an accurate judgement on "how people think about the show" is a slippery guess at best.

    Maybe alot of people liked it, maybe not, maybe people liked it at the start and soured on it as the season went on, maybe tons of people loved every second.

    We don't know, and we are all just guessing. If we are going by the people posting, it looks like way more people had a very negative view of it than a very positive view (as neutral views tend to not bother to post about stuff). That doesn't offer an incredibly accurate picture, but it certainly tells you it wasn't universally liked. Given how many online reviewers started positive and got progressively upset by the season, I'd say that the most likely assumption is that the show started off with a swell of optimism and people hoping it was going to be good, but it looks like the end of the season turned alot of people off.

    Will those people come back for season 2? Hard to say.


    But yea, just because its "not obviously a 1" doesn't mean it was a good show. It was a mediocre fantasy show that did a very bad adaptation of a popular series that faltered at the end of the season for multiple reasons and turned alot of viewers opinions negative. Its not a 1, but it also wasn't good.

  14. #2894
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Which is what I've said from the start. And yet that is what people have been arguing with me about.

    So again you agree with me. If there are differences between the two then one is more intricate the the other even if both are plain because of the differences between the two.
    Not sure where you're going with this.

    The sword they used was garbage and not at all representative of the sword from the books.

    Rafe has gone on record MANY times to say how HUGE of a fan he is and how he wants to do this story justice and has reviewers and consultants and blah blah blah....a crew to make sure he does it "right," according to the books essentially. Yet he pulls shit like this, left, right, and center throughout the show.

    With the budget they had, a few thousand dollars to buy a legit replica of the sword is drops in the bucket. This sword plays a role in and of itself throughout the story, it should have been faithful to the books description. The show doesn't even describe wtf a heron marked blade even is, or why it matters, so of course they're not going to do justice to the actual sword itself.

    None of the excuses are good enough for why they couldn't do it right.

    This show is an absolute garbage adaptation.

    It's fine if you enjoy the show for what it is, but it sure as hell isn't a good adaptation of the book series.

  15. #2895
    Quote Originally Posted by Gumble View Post
    Will those people come back for season 2? Hard to say.
    Bigger question; will those who seem to be "Rafesworn" such as rhorl or kenn disappear after the show receives its already overdue cancellation notice?

  16. #2896
    I was fully prepped to hate this show and ended up liking it. Actually got me to pull a couple of the books out of the basement to remember what happens next.

  17. #2897
    Quote Originally Posted by Pratt View Post
    I was fully prepped to hate this show and ended up liking it. Actually got me to pull a couple of the books out of the basement to remember what happens next.
    No point in reading the books for that given just how far they have deviated from the plot in the books.

  18. #2898
    Quote Originally Posted by Pratt View Post
    I was fully prepped to hate this show and ended up liking it. Actually got me to pull a couple of the books out of the basement to remember what happens next.
    Quote Originally Posted by Corvus View Post
    No point in reading the books for that given just how far they have deviated from the plot in the books.
    I agree.
    Reading the books would likely get one to hate the show since it doesn't resemble the books at all. And that's not delving into how silly or the logical inconsistencies the contrived script is.

  19. #2899
    The Insane Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Corvus View Post
    No point in reading the books for that given just how far they have deviated from the plot in the books.
    While it’s obviously playing out in a lot different ways things like the hunt for the horn and the seanchan are obviously still happening next so going into book 2 isn’t without merit if you want a refresher on how things generally played out.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  20. #2900
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    Quote Originally Posted by kenn9530 View Post
    Do you think less than 5k is enough of a sample base to even give a remotely accurate reading, at least imbd has over 70k to get something from, you are just trying to use a website that doesnt do stuff accurately to try and back your view.

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    Ppl who give 1 ratings when its very obvious its not are just immature children because they didnt get what they imagined the tv series to be, you dont always get what you want so suck it up, the tv series is more than good enough for ppl to give a max rating because what is most important in a tv series is entertainment, if it does that its done its job.

    My point stands the series is good, its not the best series ever but is solid and enjoyable, too many series that are good still dont get enough seasons though.
    I agree the show is definitely not a 1, but it is by no means definitely a 10 either. Book bias put aside it has serious flaws that stops it from being a 10, so if you disregard 1s because they're unrealistic you have to disregard 10s for the same reason.

    Unless you're full of it and just want your take to be true, logic be damned.

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