1. #3181
    Merely a Setback Adam Jensen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Sarif Industries, Detroit
    Posts
    29,017
    Quote Originally Posted by Celement View Post
    To be honest they would of had a far better shot at telling a compelling story if they simply set it in the universe. The wheel of time is so heavy on inner dialogues I can't see any plausible way to covert that into another media without it just be inner monologues the tv series.
    I was just thinking that. The story is built up on layers of layers of exposition. Part of why episode 1 didn't work for me was because it skipped over so much exposition that becomes necessary down the road, some of it immediately in Eye of the World, and some in later books.

    Like

    Tam Al'lthor and the Flame and the Void
    Tam's feverish rambling after he's injured
    Moiraine's speech about Manetherin
    The prohibition on saying the Dark One's name
    The insular nature of the Two Rivers
    Discussions about foreigners especially concerning the Dragon, the Aiel and the war in Gheldean (barely mentioned in the show)

    This context (and I'm sure I didn't hit everything) is required build up and the show glossed over or entirely skipped most of it. Thing is though, if you include this stuff, you have a slow moving pilot with a lot of exposition and very little action, and that might be too much to hold an audience, while skipping this stuff gives a story that doesn't make a lot of sense or give the context the viewer needs to understand the story and the world.

    I'm not entirely sure the Wheel of Time can be brought to TV, maybe it can, but this particular series was a failure.
    Putin khuliyo

  2. #3182
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Jensen View Post
    I was just thinking that. The story is built up on layers of layers of exposition. Part of why episode 1 didn't work for me was because it skipped over so much exposition that becomes necessary down the road, some of it immediately in Eye of the World, and some in later books.

    Like

    Tam Al'lthor and the Flame and the Void
    Tam's feverish rambling after he's injured
    Moiraine's speech about Manetherin
    The prohibition on saying the Dark One's name
    The insular nature of the Two Rivers
    Discussions about foreigners especially concerning the Dragon, the Aiel and the war in Gheldean (barely mentioned in the show)

    This context (and I'm sure I didn't hit everything) is required build up and the show glossed over or entirely skipped most of it. Thing is though, if you include this stuff, you have a slow moving pilot with a lot of exposition and very little action, and that might be too much to hold an audience, while skipping this stuff gives a story that doesn't make a lot of sense or give the context the viewer needs to understand the story and the world.

    I'm not entirely sure the Wheel of Time can be brought to TV, maybe it can, but this particular series was a failure.
    I can't see the wheel of time every working... the universe sure but so much of the plot is based around how characters infer from one another ( almost of the chosen work that way for their plots never mind main characters).

    It is a decent universe to tell stories in... the borderlands pre the wheels of time story would of worked well or fall of the city that became a rival to the dark one...

    Just the main plot is set and can't really be adapted to any other medium save audiobook.

  3. #3183
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Jensen View Post
    I was just thinking that. The story is built up on layers of layers of exposition. Part of why episode 1 didn't work for me was because it skipped over so much exposition that becomes necessary down the road, some of it immediately in Eye of the World, and some in later books.

    Like

    Tam Al'lthor and the Flame and the Void
    Tam's feverish rambling after he's injured
    Moiraine's speech about Manetherin
    The prohibition on saying the Dark One's name
    The insular nature of the Two Rivers
    Discussions about foreigners especially concerning the Dragon, the Aiel and the war in Gheldean (barely mentioned in the show)

    This context (and I'm sure I didn't hit everything) is required build up and the show glossed over or entirely skipped most of it. Thing is though, if you include this stuff, you have a slow moving pilot with a lot of exposition and very little action, and that might be too much to hold an audience, while skipping this stuff gives a story that doesn't make a lot of sense or give the context the viewer needs to understand the story and the world.

    I'm not entirely sure the Wheel of Time can be brought to TV, maybe it can, but this particular series was a failure.
    It's a poor adaptation - they shoulld do a reboot like Final fantasy did, and actually try and tell the actual story.

    jordan literally wrote a series that should be super easy to adapt. just add some talent to really bring out the suspense, tension, the heroism, the magic and the wonder etc...

    but as most people are saying, the show seems to be more concerned about preaching it's own message rather than telling the story that millions worldwide loved, and so ended up being a very mediocre production that was confusing, lacked any of the attachment and compelling immersion in the characters and ethos t, not to mention the mystery that had some sense to it, that are all present in the books.

    You'd have to try really hard to mess it up this badly. They just wanted a platform to preach their message, so they converted a popular series .. I think they're genuinely shocked i'ts not popular, and are blaming every rfan critical of it for it's disappointing performance - everyone but themselves and their agenda driven adaptation.

  4. #3184
    Titan
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    America's Hat
    Posts
    13,785
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Jensen View Post
    I was just thinking that. The story is built up on layers of layers of exposition. Part of why episode 1 didn't work for me was because it skipped over so much exposition that becomes necessary down the road, some of it immediately in Eye of the World, and some in later books.

    Like

    Tam Al'lthor and the Flame and the Void
    Tam's feverish rambling after he's injured
    Moiraine's speech about Manetherin
    The prohibition on saying the Dark One's name
    The insular nature of the Two Rivers
    Discussions about foreigners especially concerning the Dragon, the Aiel and the war in Gheldean (barely mentioned in the show)

    This context (and I'm sure I didn't hit everything) is required build up and the show glossed over or entirely skipped most of it. Thing is though, if you include this stuff, you have a slow moving pilot with a lot of exposition and very little action, and that might be too much to hold an audience, while skipping this stuff gives a story that doesn't make a lot of sense or give the context the viewer needs to understand the story and the world.

    I'm not entirely sure the Wheel of Time can be brought to TV, maybe it can, but this particular series was a failure.
    Don't forget the gutting of Mat's story arc involving the dagger of Shadar Logoth, which literally ties him at the hip to Padan Fain (one of the more nefarious of the villains that is focused on) for the majority of the series.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mace View Post
    It's a poor adaptation - they shoulld do a reboot like Final fantasy did, and actually try and tell the actual story.

    jordan literally wrote a series that should be super easy to adapt. just add some talent to really bring out the suspense, tension, the heroism, the magic and the wonder etc...

    but as most people are saying, the show seems to be more concerned about preaching it's own message rather than telling the story that millions worldwide loved, and so ended up being a very mediocre production that was confusing, lacked any of the attachment and compelling immersion in the characters and ethos t, not to mention the mystery that had some sense to it, that are all present in the books.

    You'd have to try really hard to mess it up this badly. They just wanted a platform to preach their message, so they converted a popular series .. I think they're genuinely shocked i'ts not popular, and are blaming every rfan critical of it for it's disappointing performance - everyone but themselves and their agenda driven adaptation.
    Which is kind of ironic when you think about it. The story is diverse, the story has great female characters and they are literally the power structure within it and some of the most prominent people of power within the series are also female monarchs, not to mention the Aes Sedai. The difference is that characters like Egwene and Nynaeve take time to build up, they have to go through their struggles, their moments of innocence and weakness as young women, before they get to that point. Egwene's experience with the Seanchan was definitely her coming out moment as far as her ability to channel and she develops wisdom through her training with the Aiel later on that helps her mature (and I feel like Sanderson kinda messed her up by making her hot headed in AMoL). Once Nynaeve breaks her barrier, it puts her on a pedestal that few Aes Sedai her age have held since the Age of Legends as far as her abilities and the fact that she kicks the ass of one of the Chosen is a pretty big deal. Why the fuck was all of that character development pigeonholed for a coming out moment that was supposed to belong to Rand at the end of the 8th episode?
    Last edited by Rennadrel; 2022-03-23 at 10:06 PM.

  5. #3185
    Dated last year...Wheel of Time Prequel Film Trilogy In The Works

    Not seeing any movement...

  6. #3186
    Titan
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    America's Hat
    Posts
    13,785
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    Dated last year...Wheel of Time Prequel Film Trilogy In The Works

    Not seeing any movement...
    Oh god, it'll be even worse, guaranteed.

  7. #3187
    Quote Originally Posted by Rennadrel View Post
    Which is kind of ironic when you think about it. The story is diverse, the story has great female characters and they are literally the power structure within it and some of the most prominent people of power within the series are also female monarchs, not to mention the Aes Sedai.
    I know right - and it goes to show that these people are not interested in diversity really, nor in equality - but their own weird cult-like crazed stuppurd super cranked up rhetoric. I went through the entire book series again between January and March 2022 - and RJ had it all. Strong women, different races/ethnicities, gay characters and homosexuality, even a form of transgenderism - while presenting an authentic world in terms of people that aren't fixed to some weird ideology the activists are leaning into. But in Jordan's work, everyone could Identify with something, men and women were not the same but overall seemed pretty even to me, unlike the show that seems to think they need to be "diverse" by rubbishing males, and changing an already well balanced story and world.

    Once this phase passes in society people would look back and just write them all off as under some weird mental influence exacerbated by the placebo effect of rising global social media.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rennadrel View Post
    The difference is that characters like Egwene and Nynaeve take time to build up, they have to go through their struggles, their moments of innocence and weakness as young women, before they get to that point. Egwene's experience with the Seanchan was definitely her coming out moment as far as her ability to channel and she develops wisdom through her training with the Aiel later on that helps her mature (and I feel like Sanderson kinda messed her up by making her hot headed in AMoL). Once Nynaeve breaks her barrier, it puts her on a pedestal that few Aes Sedai her age have held since the Age of Legends as far as her abilities and the fact that she kicks the ass of one of the Chosen is a pretty big deal. Why the fuck was all of that character development pigeonholed for a coming out moment that was supposed to belong to Rand at the end of the 8th episode?
    One of the things that Jordan's series does better than any other fantasy, including Tolkein is his character build up, all the characters get an incredible build up to their power levels, and it feels authentic, this is not easy to do, especially given how incredible their rise is - I mean in particular Rand and Egwene, Egwene doesn't have any Ta'veren help to get where she gets, but it works, better than any series I have read.

    SO to the male characters, the 3 boys in particular achieve some incredible growth, and by the time of their final bloom in the last book, they are really incredible, but you totally buy it because of the story and the background and the build up done, although the show decides that this is not relevant nor is it important - because you know we have to make the Wheel of Time some woke Game of Thrones, rather than just make it what it is, Wheel of Time a book series I felt was superior to Game of Thrones.

  8. #3188
    So they are casting white guys to play Asian parts, a black girl to play a ginger, and a ginger to play the golden-haired Elayne.


    I'm...... wow..... all those times people said RJ was overly descriptive in his books to the point of annoynance...... I guess he wasn't nearly descriptive enough.


    Thank goodness I'm beyond the point of doing anything other than laugh at this show. I'll see more of it on youtube making fun of it than I will through Amazon. It makes me feel for LOTR fans.... you're in for a rough time.







    (Oh, and before anyone says, "BUT THEY WERE THE BEST ACTORS!!!!"...... we all saw Season 1..... they didn't cast good actors, so just stop)

  9. #3189
    Quote Originally Posted by Gumble View Post
    So they are casting white guys to play Asian parts, a black girl to play a ginger, and a ginger to play the golden-haired Elayne.


    I'm...... wow..... all those times people said RJ was overly descriptive in his books to the point of annoynance...... I guess he wasn't nearly descriptive enough.


    Thank goodness I'm beyond the point of doing anything other than laugh at this show. I'll see more of it on youtube making fun of it than I will through Amazon. It makes me feel for LOTR fans.... you're in for a rough time.







    (Oh, and before anyone says, "BUT THEY WERE THE BEST ACTORS!!!!"...... we all saw Season 1..... they didn't cast good actors, so just stop)
    Ironic how you decided to rant a bit, but you're "beyond the point of doing anything other than laugh at this show". Just dont watch it if you dont like it? No need to come here and have some empty complaint about how actors look, as if that matters in a fantasy show. Atleast do like everyone else; have a fit over how they fucked up the show compared to the books.

    Or just keep quiet, read the books again to cleanse your mind.
    Quote Originally Posted by atenime45 View Post
    The 10% reward. It's was unspoken rule that you DONT attack other faction so everyone could enjoy the 10% reward. But now no one cares about that anymore

  10. #3190
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Jensen View Post
    I was just thinking that. The story is built up on layers of layers of exposition. Part of why episode 1 didn't work for me was because it skipped over so much exposition that becomes necessary down the road, some of it immediately in Eye of the World, and some in later books.

    Like

    Tam Al'lthor and the Flame and the Void
    Tam's feverish rambling after he's injured
    Moiraine's speech about Manetherin
    The prohibition on saying the Dark One's name
    The insular nature of the Two Rivers
    Discussions about foreigners especially concerning the Dragon, the Aiel and the war in Gheldean (barely mentioned in the show)

    This context (and I'm sure I didn't hit everything) is required build up and the show glossed over or entirely skipped most of it. Thing is though, if you include this stuff, you have a slow moving pilot with a lot of exposition and very little action, and that might be too much to hold an audience, while skipping this stuff gives a story that doesn't make a lot of sense or give the context the viewer needs to understand the story and the world.

    I'm not entirely sure the Wheel of Time can be brought to TV, maybe it can, but this particular series was a failure.
    I don't think it can be done as a live action. I believe it could be done animated but the problem is to actually give the story the room to breathe it needs each book needs at least 1 season and the entire story takes about 2 years real time so the actors and actresses would change too much to do that. But with animation you can definitely do that.

  11. #3191
    Quote Originally Posted by Noxina View Post
    Ironic how you decided to rant a bit, but you're "beyond the point of doing anything other than laugh at this show". Just dont watch it if you dont like it? No need to come here and have some empty complaint about how actors look, as if that matters in a fantasy show. Atleast do like everyone else; have a fit over how they fucked up the show compared to the books.

    Or just keep quiet, read the books again to cleanse your mind.
    Agreed! Good riddance this tragedy I am shocked to see this comment section still gets few posts!

  12. #3192
    Quote Originally Posted by jdbond View Post
    Agreed! Good riddance this tragedy I am shocked to see this comment section still gets few posts!
    I enjoyed Season 1 tbh, its not exactly the books, but that doesnt bother me much. I still have the amazing books to watch, and a new fantasy show to enjoy.
    Quote Originally Posted by atenime45 View Post
    The 10% reward. It's was unspoken rule that you DONT attack other faction so everyone could enjoy the 10% reward. But now no one cares about that anymore

  13. #3193
    Quote Originally Posted by Noxina View Post
    Ironic how you decided to rant a bit, but you're "beyond the point of doing anything other than laugh at this show". Just dont watch it if you dont like it? No need to come here and have some empty complaint about how actors look, as if that matters in a fantasy show. Atleast do like everyone else; have a fit over how they fucked up the show compared to the books.

    Or just keep quiet, read the books again to cleanse your mind.
    I have, on Knife of Dreams atm, working through the slog of mr Perrin and his obsessive hunt.

    And posting on here about the silliness that Amazon is doing is laughing at the show, and lamenting for LOTR fans who are going to go through all of this soon.


    if you enjoyed this show, more power to you, you must enjoy most things that are made

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •