1. #1601
    It's definitely feminist. It's one thing to put more focus on Moiraine, it's another thing to strip the male characters of any thing that makes them either look good, strong, or cool. It's so one sided it's astonishing .

    I've been listening to the audio books as well recently, and all the male centred stuff is cut from the show, completely. Knowing how the story develops and how cool Egwene, the Aes Sedai, Moiraine and all the female character are and get... their changes do not make sense. Worse, they twist them into horrible i don't want to like or follow.. they lose touch with many of the more real aspects of the narrative (which is so important in a fantasy story that has so many unreal things) for a poor substitute.. and I thought to myself, who on earth would like this or think this behaviour cool? And I realised, the militant male hating ultra feminist group, that basically want to be men and replace men, and revel in the most destructive and disgusting attributes males exhibit because it's powerful.. and worse every ounce of tenderneess, compassion, kindness is stripped from the female characters because these charlatan militant extreme fanatics think this sort of thing is weak and resent it. Fools! They take the view of ignorant men, and put it on a pedestal, hating the gender while basically trying to emulate the worse characteristics of them. The irony and hypocrisy is incredible.

    There is no balance , iti s lopsided.. Tell you their is the stench of ultra feminism in this, don't let statements like "trying to be Game of Thrones" fool you. This might be what motivates the male showrunners and writers, but the narrative has been re-writtne as an ultra feminisht male hating wet dream.

    Such a shame.

  2. #1602
    I haven't seen the leaks myself, but there's some shots from the next two episodes floating around on reddit and it looks like we're getting an AoL flashback with LTT looking swag as fuck.

    On top of that, LTT's actor is credited in the next two episodes. I have a sneaking suspicion someone's gonna channel conciously for the first time and our beautiful insane boy is gonna have the last line of the season. I hope he just wails "ILYENA" and then it cuts to black.

    Finale's gonna be lit.

  3. #1603
    Bloodsail Admiral Smallfruitbat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mace View Post
    It's definitely feminist. It's one thing to put more focus on Moiraine, it's another thing to strip the male characters of any thing that makes them either look good, strong, or cool. It's so one sided it's astonishing .
    As a woman, I absolutely hate the feminist angle. -I agree, it's definitely there.

    When I was reading the books, I loved the men as much as the women. It was a nice escape to fantasize about some of them. -Yes, I fall in love with fictional characters, I'm odd, I'll own that. Changing Lan, Abel and to some degree Tam has taken something from me. I understand them wanting to loosen Lan up a bit, but I loved that stoic grunting. -Yes, that probably says more about me than the character.

    I also don't like the fact that women seem to be completely independent and taking over everything -in quite an aggressive manner. I do not want to see Siuan sentencing Logain to a miserable existence because he's a man who dared to channel. It loses the nuance.

    I did like the relationship between Siuan and Moiraine; it actually felt more fitting than in the books. Whether or not they were knocking boots in the books was immaterial. It was the closeness and utter loyalty to the point both were prepared to give their lives for the cause and in protection of the other.

    All in all, I tend to agree the showrunners have cut out the heart of the show and sacrificed it on the altar of woke.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kharadin View Post
    I haven't seen the leaks myself, but there's some shots from the next two episodes floating around on reddit and it looks like we're getting an AoL flashback with LTT looking swag as fuck.

    On top of that, LTT's actor is credited in the next two episodes. I have a sneaking suspicion someone's gonna channel conciously for the first time and our beautiful insane boy is gonna have the last line of the season. I hope he just wails "ILYENA" and then it cuts to black.

    Finale's gonna be lit.
    I'm excited at the prospect of seeing Rand step up. I doubt we'll get anything Mat related but maybe a bit more a hint at what's going on with Perrin. Maybe put Nynaeve and Eggers on the back burner a bit.

  4. #1604
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    It isn't multiverse crap. It is a different turning of the wheel. So it is the past or future when looking at it from the perspective of the books. If you don't like it then you also hate the books. Because it is the core concept of the books lol. That the wheel repeats and the pattern weaves out things to keep that cycle going.
    It might be a different turning of the wheel, but aint the entire point of the wheel of time story, that the turning of the wheel will be different this time. That rands confrontation with the Dark One will make an end to this constant rise and fall of the dragon.

    It just makes it odd, that the story who is supposed to impact how the wheel turns, is made different to how the wheel turns O.o

    Besides, turning of the wheel does not mean that the same things happen all the time with minor differences. It means, that elements of the world are reacurring, like the dragon vs the evil fight, but it does not mean the same people. Atleast not unless you are connected to the horn.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kharadin View Post
    I haven't seen the leaks myself, but there's some shots from the next two episodes floating around on reddit and it looks like we're getting an AoL flashback with LTT looking swag as fuck.

    On top of that, LTT's actor is credited in the next two episodes. I have a sneaking suspicion someone's gonna channel conciously for the first time and our beautiful insane boy is gonna have the last line of the season. I hope he just wails "ILYENA" and then it cuts to black.

    Finale's gonna be lit.
    If they can make LTTs role right and make his role in the show as the shadow living in Rands mind, i think it could uplift the show in its final episodes. If they want to shortend the story down, the one thing i would not mind seeing earlier, is the interactions between Rand and LTT mentally. How they struggle to find out who is real and who is not, if each of them are just a sign of insanity or if there is something more to it. The revelation of rand in book 6-7, that changes their relationship completly, could be awesome to have earlier in the story. Might also be a way to write Asmodean out of the show, as Rand would not need a teacher then.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gumble View Post
    However...... he had better include as the last line of the last show they are allowed to film, when the Rand has fallen and the world is losing hope.... a voiceover that says "I HAVE WON AGAIN, LEWS THERIN!"
    If they have the balls to that....If they end the show in a few seasons, with Rand being pushed to battle the dark one and they somewhat lose.....I will gain a new found respect for it, that will last a long time :O

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gumble View Post
    There are a lot mental hurdles people go through trying to justify things they want to like but know there are major issues with.

    This show is crap, but if it makes people get into WoT, I'll be happy. (I'd like my sons to read it, and they watched the first episode and enjoyed it) If the show does well enough and they go for more "by the book" season 2, then we could be ok. The first book admittedly turns a lot of new readers off with how much traveling the party has to do. I find the travels interesting and eventful, but I know what is coming, so that works in my favor on re-reads. I haven't been a new reader since the early 90s, so I can see how redoing alot of the first book was an idea they thought would work. I dislike how they are redoing it, and I find the changes they've made to either be A) pointless B) detrimental to developing characters that need it or C) issues that will make following the books later all but impossible.

    If people like the show, great, more Wheel of Time fans and maybe some day we get a Peter Jackson who makes the story and does it well.

    Until then, just keep reminding people that "its ok to like the show, and become a WoT fan. The books are better. Read them."
    With the show being crap currently, i will agree that it is actually a good prospect to set up some popularity right now and then go book-close later on. If there is any book, that you should change ALOT, then it is the first one as most of the characters don't have core moments yet, or atleast not ones that can be saved later. Like losing matt early hurts, but his main scenes comes first much later, so it does not hurt to make changes now.

    If that is the way they are going, i would not mind that much. And if in the future, in 10-20 years, some brilliant directer comes and want to make it right, i will look forward to it.
    May the lore be great and the stories interesting. A game without a story, is a game without a soul. Value the lore and it will reward you with fun!

    Don't let yourself be satisfied with what you expect and what you seem as obvious. Ask for something good, surprising and better. Your own standards ends up being other peoples standard.

  5. #1605
    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    Take it as you will. Whether this particular show is the one Bezos asked for or not, this series is already well-regarded by critics and audiences as being Amazon's answer to Game of Thrones. And I'm using the terminology no differently in that regard.
    It's definitely not currently well regarded by critics lol

  6. #1606
    Quote Originally Posted by Xath View Post
    It's definitely not currently well regarded by critics lol
    Seems like it got good ratings all over the place. It's more the book fans that are trowing a fit (I am one of them). Just need to repeat to my self while watching "This isn't like the books, its only based on the books, watch it for the cheap entertainment value".


    Reading the first book again now, and I kinda understand why they do what they do. Kinda, but mostly not.
    The books are slow, even maybe boring, and would NOT captivate most people. Personally I love that style, but lets be real - people dont have the patience for it, they want action every episode.
    Quote Originally Posted by atenime45 View Post
    The 10% reward. It's was unspoken rule that you DONT attack other faction so everyone could enjoy the 10% reward. But now no one cares about that anymore

  7. #1607
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noxina View Post
    Reading the first book again now, and I kinda understand why they do what they do. Kinda, but mostly not.
    The books are slow, even maybe boring, and would NOT captivate most people. Personally I love that style, but lets be real - people dont have the patience for it, they want action every episode.
    I'm rereading book 1 too, I think there is enough action to compete with the travelling time. I would have loved to see the mob trying to force Moiraine out of Emmonds Field following the Trolloc attack or their escape from Baerlon.

  8. #1608
    Quote Originally Posted by Corvus View Post
    Elsewhere, I've been watching someone who calls themselves a fan of the book go through all sorts of mental hurdles trying to convince others that having not one but five Dragon Reborns is totally in keeping with the books and doesn't really change anything. *headdesk*
    Is it one of the dragonmount mods? They have been very vigilant in talking about how the series is totally in line with the books.

  9. #1609
    Quote Originally Posted by Xath View Post
    It's definitely not currently well regarded by critics lol
    "Critics" doesn't even mean much anymore, sadly. You google for some reviews you can find anything from "Why WoT is the best thing since sliced bread" to "Why WoT is the literal death of fantasy TV" - and it's very hard to discern whose opinion is worth paying attention to, because anyone can be on the internet. Add to that the mounting suspicion that big critics aggregators are not impartial when it comes to big budget producers like Amazon, and it's really tough to get a representative impression of what "the critics" think.

  10. #1610
    Quote Originally Posted by Noxina View Post
    Seems like it got good ratings all over the place. It's more the book fans that are trowing a fit (I am one of them). Just need to repeat to my self while watching "This isn't like the books, its only based on the books, watch it for the cheap entertainment value".


    Reading the first book again now, and I kinda understand why they do what they do. Kinda, but mostly not.
    The books are slow, even maybe boring, and would NOT captivate most people. Personally I love that style, but lets be real - people dont have the patience for it, they want action every episode.
    70s are not good ratings when spending 10 million an episode.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Smallfruitbat View Post
    I'm rereading book 1 too, I think there is enough action to compete with the travelling time. I would have loved to see the mob trying to force Moiraine out of Emmonds Field following the Trolloc attack or their escape from Baerlon.
    They even undercut that. The mob forcing her out to being awed and straightening in pride finding out what their ancestors did is hugely important to the later books. The importance of the old blood is enormous later.

  11. #1611
    Quote Originally Posted by Noxina View Post
    Seems like it got good ratings all over the place.
    So does the "Shannara Chronicles."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Smallfruitbat View Post
    I'm rereading book 1 too, I think there is enough action to compete with the travelling time. I would have loved to see the mob trying to force Moiraine out of Emmonds Field following the Trolloc attack or their escape from Baerlon.
    A perfect moment for a cutscene of fabled Manethren...and with the sparkling chime of a voice that Moiraine is supposed to have, she'd be the perfect narrator.

  12. #1612
    The Unstoppable Force rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Surfd View Post
    The Cycles of the Wheel were never intended to repeat individual stories.
    Do you have any proof? It isn't low effort metaphysical rules. It is simply something you don't like so you find any excuse to discount it even after you already said it is possible to happen. Weird right?
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  13. #1613
    Quote Originally Posted by Xath View Post
    It's definitely not currently well regarded by critics lol
    You're right, wrong words. I meant widely-acknowledged there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Do you have any proof?
    There you go again lol
    Last edited by Triceron; 2021-12-14 at 04:03 PM.

  14. #1614
    The Unstoppable Force rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    There you go again lol
    What is wrong with asking people to prove a claim about something from the books? Are you that upset that I questioned you that you now need to troll any post that asks for claims to be proven? They already admitted it is possible but keep claiming it doesn't work that way, wouldn't you ask for definitive proof in that situation?
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  15. #1615
    Hmf...rumor mill says they want to kerp Rosamund Pike busy for 8 seasons if Amazon keeps the bills paid.

  16. #1616
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    What is wrong with asking people to prove a claim about something from the books?
    Nothing wrong at all. You're just asking proof for something that you know can't be proven, since the author's fucking dead lol

  17. #1617
    The Unstoppable Force rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    Hmf...rumor mill says they want to kerp Rosamund Pike busy for 8 seasons if Amazon keeps the bills paid.
    https://www.thewrap.com/the-wheel-of...adapted-books/

    It isn't a rumor. The show runners plotted out a plan for 8 seasons before the show was picked up by Amazon.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    Nothing wrong at all. You're just asking proof for something that you know can't be proven, since the author's fucking dead lol
    It could have been stated somewhere in stuff already written. Robert Jordan had extensive notes. It could be something that I haven't personally seen. Like the "casting list" Robert Jordan made for example. I saw that for the first time in this thread. But hey I can't ask questions because you might get upset again or something. Lol.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  18. #1618
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    It could have been stated somewhere in stuff already written. Robert Jordan had extensive notes. It could be something that I haven't personally seen. Like the "casting list" Robert Jordan made for example. I saw that for the first time in this thread. But hey I can't ask questions because you might get upset again or something. Lol.
    You can ask the questions. I'll just point out how you're either pretending to be ignorant just to imply someone is wrong, or willingly ignorant since you aren't bothered to looking into it yourself.

    A more nice way to ask it is to ask for a source. When you just straight up ask for proof, all while adding statements that undermine their claims, then you can't exactly pretend to be genuinely curious. It's pretty obvious what you're intentions are, and it's not in finding out something you don't already know. You know it, you refute it, and you even called them out on it.

    'It is simply something you don't like so you find any excuse' is not a genuine line of inquiry, lol.
    Last edited by Triceron; 2021-12-14 at 04:52 PM.

  19. #1619
    The Unstoppable Force rhorle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triceron View Post
    A more nice way to ask it is to ask for a source.
    Asking for proof is asking for a source. Stop being salty because I questioned your claims.
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  20. #1620
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Asking for proof is asking for a source. Stop being salty because I questioned your claims.
    Asking for proof while dismissing their claims as being an excuse before they get a chance to provide any answer is being an asshole. Just being clear to you, since you seem to be willingly unaware of that as well.
    Last edited by Triceron; 2021-12-14 at 04:58 PM.

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