1. #8741
    I have semi-intentionally dropped my QP mmr and I have gained quite a bit of insight that I didn't have before, mostly regarding Symmetra. I always thought that Symm would be more fun the lower the rating, but alas I found out that is not the case. Most of my QP experience over the years came from I'd guesstimate 2800-3300 teams, but now I know what ~2k rating looks like. I've even seen a few mythical creatures (soloQ bronze players).

    Symmetra
    I finally understand why people lament her as a useless hero.

    At low ratings her shield gen is not worth much. Low skilled tracers, genjis, mercies, widows etc don't really care about 75 extra health; it doesn't make much of a difference on them. Healers also don't really care about the extra layer of health on teams as people tend to get picked off out of position very often. At higher ratings 75 extra health is the difference between death and a kill and is overall a very noticeable blanket on teams. Often it is worth just staying and defending the shield gen from flankers, this is absolutely not the case at lower ratings. To add a bit of concrete fact to this: normally I would be surprised if I lose a game where I managed to have close to 100% uptime on shield gens. At lower ratings I can barely tell the difference and will lose/win just as often whether the uptime is 100% or 0%.

    Her teleporter is pretty much pointless at low ratings as well for obvious reasons. You can put down a perfect TP with 5 people dead under the bridge point B anubis, and you will see people literally take the TP only to walk backwards into the tunnel to wait for something to happen.

    Her offensive capabilities are a mixed bag. Juking people is noticeably easier, and 1v1s can be a ton of fun. On the other hand flanking or punishing overextended or careless flankers doesn't really mean much at these low ratings. Teamfights seem to be determined mostly from team comp value or big ults like mcree, reaper and zarya. Your team will most likely not take advantage of, or even notice, the ulting genji you just killed. Her turrets are also not as effective at these ratings, at least the kind of turrets I'm used to placing. Maybe death chambers are effective again but tbh I haven't tried setting many of those up. Teamfights are over quick if ults are used, and there is a whole lot of waiting around doing nothing while people run in one by one to die, giving enemy teams plenty of pressure-free time to clear your turrets (and ults).

    Overall I would not recommend her in gold/silver and below if you want to win. It can be fun and it is super easy to get play of the game and gold damage/elims, but honestly it is far more satisfying and rewarding to play Symm at higher ratings. The value you get out of her is too often lost on low skilled teams, and dare I agree with all the whiners that she really is useless after all.

    Moira
    Very strong at lower ratings! I always thought it was a bad idea to play her with a dps bias, but at lower ratings she is one of the most effective and high value heroes. Heal noobs till you have ult then go full offense. Most of these games are determined by little more than which side gets more kills, and you can get tons of kills with her. And of course heal. You don't get punished as much either while you ult, so you can really go all out offense. If I were stuck at a low rating I'd play her to get out of there.

    Roadhog
    Also very strong at these ratings. His health and healing add a ton of value to him as a hero pick. People do far less damage at the lower ratings, and a good hog can live for eternity all by himself. Other than his hook bullshit I never understood why people hated him so much, but now I do.

    Junkrat
    Another one I now understand why people hate him so much (other than random left click spam kills). At low ratings it is pretty much guaranteed that no one will even try to shoot his tire. Every tire is pretty much a guaranteed single or double kill. Good choice as well if you want to climb out of those ratings.

    The Snipers
    Oh my god, silver Hanzos and Widows. No shame in their game lol!

    The healers
    More power to the people that brave healing silver teams. I can only imagine what it would be like trying to climb out of there as a healer. Win your placements! I heal quite a bit myself, and the only time I ever touched 4k in competitive was playing mercy, but even my mercy can't make a reliable difference here. It's a completely different game down here. You never know whether there is a point in saving someone's life or whether something is worth the risk. I can't say I have noticed any OP healers at this rating either. Maybe Mercy simply because you can more easily avoid death despite your team wiping, reducing feelings of frustration and failure.

    Disclaimer: I don't know how much of this applies to competitive and I hope I never have to find out, but I doubt silver/gold people play much differently in competitive than QP other than stacking up a bit more.

  2. #8742
    Been playing a lot of Brigitte. Best Champ in game.

    My games generally at the moment go 1 of 2 ways.

    1. My team Stays as a group and we win.
    2. Idiots on my team run at the enemy in single file and we lose.

    Won 8 games in a row in Quickplay with a team of randoms that knew to stick together.
    lost 4 in a row with randoms that just chose either long range champs and never tried to actually move forward in attack. Or just Genjis/Tracers/Sombras running face first into enemy teams.

    Spamming Group up doesn't seem to work, though I figure they are just too illiterate to understand the words.

    My current main hate list:

    Junkrat. His basic fire just disregards my Barrier. Woo yeah!
    Sombra. her hack feels like it lasts way too long and is basically a instant death sentence.

    I think the one change I'd make to Brig would be removing 100 of her Barrier health to add 50 more armour on her HP bar.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pandragon View Post
    10 games in a row where the enemy wins without even trying, cause my team just runs in 1 at a time and dies. I can see this is gonna be like every other team game I play. I get nothing but idiots. Just need to quit playing this now.
    Your pain. I feel it.

  3. #8743
    I'm never going to get out of my elo without a better pc I don't think.

    Anyway, I am eagerly awaiting seeing the new skins.

  4. #8744
    The Insane Jessicka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meat Rubbing Specialist View Post
    Been playing a lot of Brigitte. Best Champ in game.

    My games generally at the moment go 1 of 2 ways.

    1. My team Stays as a group and we win.
    2. Idiots on my team run at the enemy in single file and we lose.

    Won 8 games in a row in Quickplay with a team of randoms that knew to stick together.
    lost 4 in a row with randoms that just chose either long range champs and never tried to actually move forward in attack. Or just Genjis/Tracers/Sombras running face first into enemy teams.

    Spamming Group up doesn't seem to work, though I figure they are just too illiterate to understand the words.

    My current main hate list:

    Junkrat. His basic fire just disregards my Barrier. Woo yeah!
    Sombra. her hack feels like it lasts way too long and is basically a instant death sentence.

    I think the one change I'd make to Brig would be removing 100 of her Barrier health to add 50 more armour on her HP bar.

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    Your pain. I feel it.
    You can just raise your shield in Sombra's face to break Hack, then stunlock and kill her... And of all the things Hack is, it is neither instant nor a death sentence.

  5. #8745
    Bloodsail Admiral ThatsOurEric's Avatar
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    Tracer needs something of a nerf. Because in the right hands, she is just to fucking overpowered. High damage,
    the best escapes, and her ability to just obliterate or escape her supposed counters is too strong.

  6. #8746
    The Unstoppable Force Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatsOurEric View Post
    Tracer needs something of a nerf. Because in the right hands, she is just to fucking overpowered. High damage,
    the best escapes, and her ability to just obliterate or escape her supposed counters is too strong.
    Flashbang, headshot, no more Tracer.
    BAD WOLF

  7. #8747
    Bloodsail Admiral ThatsOurEric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kelimbror View Post
    Flashbang, headshot, no more Tracer.
    And if no one is good with McCree?

    Yeah, a lot more complex than that.

  8. #8748
    Quote Originally Posted by ThatsOurEric View Post
    And if no one is good with McCree?

    Yeah, a lot more complex than that.
    Always remember where she was in the last 3 seconds and force her recall. One mccree bullet and a few collateral damage is enough to scare her. When she recalls, flashbang where she was 3 seconds ago and headshot/fth.

    If no one's good, get Brigitte/Sombra. Even a good s76 can do the trick with hs/rockets.

    If tracer's still causing havoc...gid gud.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Being bad is the first step to gittin gud, before anyone was gud, they were bad. Not everyone is as equally skilled at the start but everyone can learn to git gud. - Ythisens
    Tofinish list : NOTHING CAUSE I FINALLY DID IT.
    Todo list : S;G0, New Game, Erased.

  9. #8749
    Quote Originally Posted by Meat Rubbing Specialist View Post
    Been playing a lot of Brigitte. Best Champ in game.

    My games generally at the moment go 1 of 2 ways.

    1. My team Stays as a group and we win.
    2. Idiots on my team run at the enemy in single file and we lose.

    Won 8 games in a row in Quickplay with a team of randoms that knew to stick together.
    lost 4 in a row with randoms that just chose either long range champs and never tried to actually move forward in attack. Or just Genjis/Tracers/Sombras running face first into enemy teams.

    Spamming Group up doesn't seem to work, though I figure they are just too illiterate to understand the words.

    My current main hate list:

    Junkrat. His basic fire just disregards my Barrier. Woo yeah!
    Sombra. her hack feels like it lasts way too long and is basically a instant death sentence.

    I think the one change I'd make to Brig would be removing 100 of her Barrier health to add 50 more armour on her HP bar.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Your pain. I feel it.
    You are basically saying you hate anything that counters Brig which you play. There is no character in the game that doesn't have a direct counter. Pharah is a much easier counter than junkrat because junkrat cant make his prim fire blow up at your feet. It either hits and blows or bounces past. Most of the time your shield should be taking the primary fire. His mine on the other hand he can det at will. Pharah always shoots for your feet and always does splash damage if not impact damage.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ThatsOurEric View Post
    And if no one is good with McCree?

    Yeah, a lot more complex than that.
    You so much as scratch a tracer and she will burn the recall. A good trick with roadhog is to melee, Tracer will think he is hooking and zip elsewhere or recall, when she is trying to figure out her bearings you hook her because you can see which direction she goes.

    Torb turret also tends to shut her down as Tracers don't like getting even a scratch on them and they will think twice about skipping around in your back yard.
    If you push a button that finds you a 'random group' and it gives you a random group of people with random skill and random knowledge then you have no right to complain that a 'random group' button did what it was designed to do. The fault lies in your inability to make friends to play with instead of relying on a button designed to be random. It is a 'random group' button, not a 'best of the best' button.

  10. #8750
    Quote Originally Posted by DeadmanWalking View Post
    You are basically saying you hate anything that counters Brig which you play.
    Yes. I'm am glad you got that from my glaringly obvious intention.

    I'm fine with Pharah, since she generally needs LoS to attack whereas Junkrat just bouncing grenades off walls and around corners is frustrating. That and I enjoy slapping Pharahs out of the sky with my SHIFT.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ThatsOurEric View Post
    And if no one is good with McCree?

    Yeah, a lot more complex than that.
    Brigitte is a Tracer Slayer. Can generally murder a Tracer in a Shield Stun, Melee-Shift combo.

  11. #8751
    Quote Originally Posted by Meat Rubbing Specialist View Post
    Yes. I'm am glad you got that from my glaringly obvious intention.

    I'm fine with Pharah, since she generally needs LoS to attack whereas Junkrat just bouncing grenades off walls and around corners is frustrating. That and I enjoy slapping Pharahs out of the sky with my SHIFT.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Brigitte is a Tracer Slayer. Can generally murder a Tracer in a Shield Stun, Melee-Shift combo.
    I tend to find that Junkrats grenades are far easier to dodge than pharahs missiles. I tend to bob and weave through them, its really only the mines that he chucks which get me consistently. Pharahs wreck me on Brigs. 3 rockets in my general area put me out of the fight. Even if you knock them back they don't get knocked down.

    - - - Updated - - -

    I would really like to see a more natural counter to pharah, be it someone who can get in the sky with her to dance (not firing slow missiles) or someone who can bring her down to the ground (Hacking is too short of range).
    If you push a button that finds you a 'random group' and it gives you a random group of people with random skill and random knowledge then you have no right to complain that a 'random group' button did what it was designed to do. The fault lies in your inability to make friends to play with instead of relying on a button designed to be random. It is a 'random group' button, not a 'best of the best' button.

  12. #8752
    Bloodsail Admiral ThatsOurEric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by A-sayo View Post
    If tracer's still causing havoc...gid gud.
    You stopped having a credible and intelligent response the moment you said the last part.

    Quote Originally Posted by DeadmanWalking View Post
    You so much as scratch a tracer and she will burn the recall. A good trick with roadhog is to melee, Tracer will think he is hooking and zip elsewhere or recall, when she is trying to figure out her bearings you hook her because you can see which direction she goes.

    Torb turret also tends to shut her down as Tracers don't like getting even a scratch on them and they will think twice about skipping around in your back yard.
    Bad Tracers will recall when that happens, the good ones are plenty smart enough to keep going after one hit,
    not to mention that they're going to be extremely hard to hit anyway. They don't move in predictable patterns.

    The problem with Hog vs. Tracer is that she can put a lot of hurt on him, and shut him down imo, more easily
    than he can do the same to her. Especially if the hook misses.

    And the turret only works if its in a place she can't get too easily. Otherwise, she can easily burst it down and
    destroy it, unless you waste a Molten Core.

    Quote Originally Posted by Meat Rubbing Specialist View Post
    Brigitte is a Tracer Slayer. Can generally murder a Tracer in a Shield Stun, Melee-Shift combo.
    Unfortunately, she's not available in Comp atm.

  13. #8753
    Quote Originally Posted by ThatsOurEric View Post
    Unfortunately, she's not available in Comp atm.
    Oh really? Didn't even realise, had just been playing her in lots of quickplay to get a hang of her.

  14. #8754
    The Unstoppable Force Kelimbror's Avatar
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    chateu deathmatch with Brigitte is the most fun shit ever.
    BAD WOLF

  15. #8755
    Quote Originally Posted by Kelimbror View Post
    chateu deathmatch with Brigitte is the most fun shit ever.
    Unless you are not brigette :P Most characters can't deal with her one on one. Reaper gets stunned and flogged, genji flogged, anna can only use grenade... it is pretty much just pharah, junkrat and McCree.
    Last edited by DeadmanWalking; 2018-04-01 at 02:08 AM.
    If you push a button that finds you a 'random group' and it gives you a random group of people with random skill and random knowledge then you have no right to complain that a 'random group' button did what it was designed to do. The fault lies in your inability to make friends to play with instead of relying on a button designed to be random. It is a 'random group' button, not a 'best of the best' button.

  16. #8756
    The Unstoppable Force Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeadmanWalking View Post
    Unless you are not brigette :P Most characters can't deal with her one on one. Reaper gets stunned and flogged, genji flogged, anna can only use grenade... it is pretty much just pharah, junkrat and McCree.
    Any character that can not be near her can counter her easily. That's a whole hell of a lot of people. Also, most people just think she's op b/c they don't have timing down on how to counter her. Reaper counters if he does what he's not use to doing, holding his shots. Don't fall for the ole shield up shield down shit and only wraith when she charges.

    I think my favorite part about her though is that she can go toe toe with Roadhog and either annoy him so much he has to go somewhere else or she can attrition him out if his cds aren't perfect.
    BAD WOLF

  17. #8757
    I have no strong opinion on Brigitte but I will say Rein feels absolutely awful to play with all the latest heroes and changes, and it's going to get even worse when/if the Mei and Reaper (lol) changes go through.

  18. #8758
    Quote Originally Posted by Kelimbror View Post
    Any character that can not be near her can counter her easily. That's a whole hell of a lot of people. Also, most people just think she's op b/c they don't have timing down on how to counter her. Reaper counters if he does what he's not use to doing, holding his shots. Don't fall for the ole shield up shield down shit and only wraith when she charges.

    I think my favorite part about her though is that she can go toe toe with Roadhog and either annoy him so much he has to go somewhere else or she can attrition him out if his cds aren't perfect.
    It will be easier to deal with her as reaper once wraith walk gets updated.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Woobels View Post
    I have no strong opinion on Brigitte but I will say Rein feels absolutely awful to play with all the latest heroes and changes, and it's going to get even worse when/if the Mei and Reaper (lol) changes go through.
    Mei isn’t going to change Rhein any, his shield will either protect him or it won’t as it is on live. The difference is the team mate standing behind Rhein will also get frozen. She isn’t exactly anti-tank, she is more lethal to squishies as she can’t freeze and face shot Rhein in one shot.
    Her changes are not to anti-tank but rather just to make her more desirable for comp play.
    If you push a button that finds you a 'random group' and it gives you a random group of people with random skill and random knowledge then you have no right to complain that a 'random group' button did what it was designed to do. The fault lies in your inability to make friends to play with instead of relying on a button designed to be random. It is a 'random group' button, not a 'best of the best' button.

  19. #8759
    Bloodsail Admiral ThatsOurEric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meat Rubbing Specialist View Post
    Oh really? Didn't even realise, had just been playing her in lots of quickplay to get a hang of her.
    Yeah unlike before, they've changed it so now whenever a new character is released, they aren't available
    until the next Comp Season.

  20. #8760
    Elemental Lord Jinro's Avatar
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    First game in a few days, 5-man premade and they ask me to get on voice chat. Say hello. Instant rape threat.

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