'No means no': Judge delivers blistering rebuke of lower court sex-assault decision

[Deleted]

i think even rapists know that no means no, i just think they dnt fucking care

[Advent]

Seeing what feminism have done to society here in the west makes me regret not taking all the drunk girls that did grop my big but all the time when i was drunk to court i could have made a living out of it.

and the times girls were pushing for sex when i was not in mood.

Maybe you should have. This farce of a trial would look ludicrous in light of it. If we're going to start ruining the lives of all young men and women everywhere by labeling them as sex offenders for some unwanted groping, I'm seriously concerned for what happens next. This is a punishable offense, but a trial, and potentially ruining his life forever over it is NOT a punishment which fits this action. Not by a long shot.

[Trollhammer]

Groping is not serious? Seriously?

When 15? No.. The shit that went on in my school when I was 15 was insane.. It was a mess of hormones and grabby hands, it was also equal, plenty of girls grabbing arses etc

[Fastlane_hellscream]

I read the OP twice, and have yet to find where a sex-assault occurred in this story...

Hugging someone in Canada is sexually assaulting them?

Seriously? Bullshit response to an incident that could have been handled by a grown man (Teacher) having a discussion with the young man...Did he go to far? Obviously he made her feel uncomfortable so yes. Is he guilty of sexual assault? Can't believe that is even being discussed.

Being human is going to be more and more lonely in the near future, when feminists kill off all affection in our race. Stupid.

[Moonfalora]

I read the OP twice, and have yet to find where a sex-assault occurred in this story...

Hugging someone in Canada is sexually assaulting them?

Seriously? Bullshit response to an incident that could have been handled by a grown man (Teacher) having a discussion with the young man...Did he go to far? Obviously he made her feel uncomfortable so yes. Is he guilty of sexual assault? Can't believe that is even being discussed.

Being human is going to be more and more lonely in the near future, when feminists kill off all affection in our race. Stupid.

Then you did not read it at all.

The interaction was captured on a video entered as an exhibit at trial and watched by the judge. It showed the girl smiling and giggling. The boy then pushed the girl into a locker, grabbed again at her buttocks, ran his hands over her body and tried to kiss her. She quickly moved away and told him to leave.

The two moved out of camera range. The boy ignored the girl's demand and followed her, then pushed her into a closed doorway, Topolniski wrote. For a third time he grabbed her buttocks, then her breasts, and tried to kiss her as she tried to push him away and fend him off with a water bottle.

The boy said she should "just let him do it."

^That right there.

[cousinit1686]

Some of the posters on this site make me fearful for the future.

When he first grabbed her butt, and she laughed, and when he did it again, she tried to get away from it, is when he should have stopped. Being 15 or 19 should make no difference. Like there's something magical that happens the second you turn 18 that automatically makes you an adult? As if! Sexual education and consent classes should be regulated and uniform so that this kind of ignorance can't go on.

Example, when I meet up with my baby's mother, we usually hug and I grab her butt. When I first did it, I apologized and said if it bothered her I wouldn't do it. She said she didn't mind and barely even noticed it. I wouldn't push my luck, if it made her feel uncomfortable I wouldn't do it.

Maturity is a difficult thing, because some people can be mature as hell as a teen, and on the other spectrum, some people never mature and act like a derp for the rest of their life.

[Tennis]

I'm convinced the OP has a serious issue and should seek psychological therapy. Every day, a different thread....but they're always the same thing. When all you can talk about is one topic all day long, you might need an intervention or something.

So because I make threads I need psych therapy? What should I tell the counselor exactly?

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i just hope all of you are held accountable for every instance of injustice toward another that you ever had and ever will have.
or maybe you wouldnt want to be?
or do you hold yourselves accountable?
hmmm

I don't get it. Is there a point you're trying to make here?

[Polyxo]

It's surprising how many people are willing to pass off repeated sexual assault as just 'boys will be boys'. The initial ass-slap as a simple crossed boundaries should have very uncomfortable consequences (ie longtime probation and community service). This far exceeds that circumstance.

[Tennis]

It's surprising how many people are willing to pass off repeated sexual assault as just 'boys will be boys'. The initial ass-slap as a simple crossed boundaries should have very uncomfortable consequences (ie longtime probation and community service). This far exceeds that circumstance.

Why do people try to downplay such behaviour? Isn't the goal to stop it from getting worse. Downplaying it just enables worse behaviour.

[Noradin]

So a kid murdering someone is less serious than an adult murdering someone? No, the result is the same, someone was murdered and it is as serious when a kid does as when an adult does it, it does not make it less serious what they did
You don't hurt others by a brain fart

A kid misunderstanding a situation is definitely serious than an adult doing the same.

[Tennis]

A kid misunderstanding a situation is definitely serious than an adult doing the same.

15 years old isn't a kid. Let's be real.

[Noradin]

15 years old isn't a kid. Let's be real.

When I grew up you counted as a "kid" till you were over 21.
Age definitively should be taken into account when the guilt depends on how a social interaction was interpreted by the accused.

[meian]

Not my reaction, my reaction is more one of concern that we're putting young kids on trial for something that I don't think is actually all that serious. I came from an inner city high school, and there was a lot of fucked up stuff going on every day, a lot of kids who clearly had been raised in very difficult circumstances and were damaged because it, often acting wildly inappropriately. I think that had an effect on my view of circumstances like this because I got to know a few of these kids personally and they weren't irredeemably bad people - they were young and had gotten terrible guidance. So it bothers me seeing the bloodthirst in some of these posts - give someone a chance to grow up before you treat them like an adult.

Wait, so you're using an "I grew up somewhere shitty so everywhere should be shitty" argument? You're letting your personal biases run wild and being stubborn about it when people are calling you out on it.

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That's why, when I hear something like this, I think: here's a guy who's gotten the wrong message, but he's young and hasn't figured this whole dating/sex thing out yet. Make sure he knows that what he did is very wrong, punish him, but nothing that will impact his life long term. He deserves the chance to prove whether he's learned from his mistake.

So would you feel comfortable with community service and counseling but having his legal file flagged that if he does it again he is subject to the harsher of possible outcomes? Personally, I am a bigger fan of attempting to rehabilitate first time offenders outside of extenuating circumstances. I feel like that is the point of a criminal justice system. It's easy to just burn people at the stake, but a better society will try to rehabilitate first if possible.

Edit: Oh, and by community service I mean like... have him volunteer at a women's shelter or something similar as appropriate so he can see where the road of his actions leads him. Picking up trash on the side of the road is kinda lame. I like community service as a punishment, but I believe it should be applicable to the crime in question.

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So because I make threads I need psych therapy? What should I tell the counselor exactly?

The amount of time you spend on this forum is probably bad for your mental health. This isn't the worst cesspit I've been to but it's still pretty bad.

[meian]

No. I'm not saying everywhere should be shitty obviously. What I am saying is, when I see a 15 year old doing something like this my mind goes back to the kids I knew at 15 who might have done the same thing, and I'm saying I mostly feel pity for those kids because they grew up in very tough situations. I think asking them to be mature and responsible at 15 is a huge stretch. 21? Sure. But at 15 no way.

I don't think describing it as personal bias is accurate. What I'm trying to do is describe how I think my experiences have been different from most posters on this forum (and while that's an assumption, I don't think it's crazy to assume that most posters on this forum didn't go to schools where there were near riots for the Rodney King and OJ verdicts). But while my experience is somewhat different from most people on this forum, I think it is representative of a large part of society that people on here tend to ignore and not understand. I might be wrong, but hell it's an opinion, just like yours is, and personal experiences have a huge influence on those. Pretending I have personal bias and others don't doesn't make a lot of sense. I'm open to hearing and trying to understand yours.

And yeah I have no problem with community service. I have a problem with something that could materially limit his future options, the way a conviction and registry as a sex offender certainly would.

Yeah, I don't see how putting him in the registry is going to be a benefit to society. Not when counseling and community service could do the trick. lol, maybe make him give a presentation on identifying consent in front of the school could be a thing as well.

Mmn, as for me. Where I grew up I would say that it would be unthinkable for any but the biggest dipshits to go as far as he did. "No means no" was pretty strongly beaten into everyone's heads. There were some sleazy people that tried to dance around the topic but they all had two left feet mentally so they didn't get too far. That's not to say that other bad things didn't happen. I certainly did my share, but that wasn't one of them. Actually the only incident I can think of from his perspective, I was making out with another girl, I started touching her in other places, she said no, I stopped and let her lead for what she was comfortable with. I didn't want to, but I did anyways because it wasn't my call. Alternatively, there have been a few times where others had to be told that I wasn't interested in how they were touching me. >.>

Edit: I guess I can give a bit more detail on that. Two of them backed off and we did other things, the other one was more persistent, and to my regret, I eventually acquiesced to their advances. I shouldn't have, but I did. So be really careful with how you go about things. Sometimes a person will give in because they care about you and not because it's what they really want for them. It's a really fucked up gray area which seems to have different sets of standards based on each set of circumstances. Makes it all rather confusing.

[Deleted]

15 years old isn't a kid. Let's be real.

yeah - no a 15 year old is a kid.

[Fenixdown]

So because I make threads I need psych therapy? What should I tell the counselor exactly?

That you have a morbid obsession. Duh.

[Tennis]

If He says No, it means stop as well.

Both sides of the coin, not just one side.

Why are you bringing this up? Why not focus on what the thread is about?

[Treeskee]

Yea, you also seem to not understand the fact that the brain of a 15 year old just isn't fully developed yet, that is why it is a brain fart for them. Go read up on the subject, thats the last im going to say on this, i'm off.

So according to you it's okay to commit crimes until you're 25? Because that's when the male brain is full developed.

Also Tennisace the thread is about no meaning no! Stop trying to derail it, asking people why they aren't talking about the thread adds nothing positive to the discussion.

OT though: Glad this is being reviewed since this article at least makes it sound like the first judge was an idiot.

[Polyxo]

So according to you it's okay to commit crimes until you're 25? Because that's when the male brain is full developed.

Lets be honest, a lot of people here just want to be rapey forever.

[Thage]

I could open a warehouse with the fedoras in this thread and make a killing selling them wholesale.