Rogue Stealth Nerfs/Buffs

[Spriestlawl]

Soooo the real question am I spending all my artifact power on Outlaw>Assas>Sub?

Right now you're waiting until the last possible minute to make that decision... At the T19M levels all the specs are reasonably close. Waiting for the official numbers before I try to re-sim outlaw.

[Sarrus1]

But I mean if the AoE spec is reasonably close to the king of ST (Sin)... isn't it worth going Outlaw for Mythic+'s as well as raids just for those fights with adds

[Izenhart]

Numbers are through

Exsanguinate now causes bleeds to tick 100% faster, down from 400% faster.

Run Through’s damage has been increased by 25%.

Between the Eyes damage has been increased by 18%.

Jolly Roger causes Saber Slash to have an additional 25% chance of striking an additional time (was 40%).

Buried Treasure increases your base Energy regeneration by 25% (was 40%).

Shark Infested Waters increases Critical Strike Chance by 25% (was 40%).

Grand Melee increases your attack speed by 50% and your Leech by 25% (was 40% and 20%).

Slice and Dice now increases attack speed by 100% (was 90%).

[Wow]

But I mean if the AoE spec is reasonably close to the king of ST (Sin)... isn't it worth going Outlaw for Mythic+'s as well as raids just for those fights with adds

Yes, assassin being way ahead was the only thing that kept it going if outlaw can really reliably do close to assass/sub st we become a 1 spec class.

[Spriestlawl]

Numbers are through

Exsanguinate now causes bleeds to tick 100% faster, down from 400% faster.

Run Through’s damage has been increased by 25%.

Between the Eyes damage has been increased by 18%.

Jolly Roger causes Saber Slash to have an additional 25% chance of striking an additional time (was 40%).

Buried Treasure increases your base Energy regeneration by 25% (was 40%).

Shark Infested Waters increases Critical Strike Chance by 25% (was 40%).

Grand Melee increases your attack speed by 50% and your Leech by 25% (was 40% and 20%).

Slice and Dice now increases attack speed by 100% (was 90%).

looks like a net buff for outlaw.

Edit: looks like at T19M ... not accounting for the Run Through and BtE buffs 315k dps. Accounting for them 338k dps.. Sin is sitting at 330k dps and sub is 325k dps. Around a 3% difference assuming I math'd properly in the simc. Because of the change I think it's going to bring RtB more inline and even less than the potential 8k you could get when accounting for the Run Through / BtE buffs.

[Skylarking]

Is BtE used as a dps ability? Read the tooltip and says it stuns so i thought its outlaws version of kidney shot. But then it has the 4x damage from crit and with SiW nerfed what does that make the ability now?

[Wow]

Is BtE used as a dps ability? Read the tooltip and says it stuns so i thought its outlaws version of kidney shot. But then it has the 4x damage from crit and with SiW nerfed what does that make the ability now?

The math was you need 48% crit to be worth using with shark and base crit you have 40% so you only need 8% from gear if that math still holds since it didn't get buffed as much.

[Spriestlawl]

Is BtE used as a dps ability? Read the tooltip and says it stuns so i thought its outlaws version of kidney shot. But then it has the 4x damage from crit and with SiW nerfed what does that make the ability now?

It's not strictly part of the rotation right now no.. but remember there's a legendary (wrist?) that increases the damage of your next pistol shot by 300% (I think it was 850 now it's 300). You'll be using run through almost exclusively though

Edit: prepatch it's strictly NOT used, the class trinket boosts run through to retarded levels.

[Minka]

I don't get it why do they Nerf assa -.- assa has 0 scaling so the other specs will catch up / surpass with higher ilvl

[Spriestlawl]

I don't get it why do they Nerf assa -.- assa has 0 scaling so the other specs will catch up / surpass with higher ilvl

Exsang scaled so well with just AP it was still ahead of the other specs accounting for T19 Mythic gear. That's the 2nd raid release...

[Gaidax]

I don't get it why do they Nerf assa -.- assa has 0 scaling so the other specs will catch up / surpass with higher ilvl

Because Rupture doing 60% of your damage and being absolutely and silly OP in single target like 40% more than anything existing WAS a balance issue.

[Saintlel]

Because Rupture doing 60% of your damage and being absolutely and silly OP in single target like 40% more than anything existing WAS a balance issue.

Except Rupture was designed as the main draw of the spec, bleeds AND poisons

[Minka]

Because Rupture doing 60% of your damage and being absolutely and silly OP in single target like 40% more than anything existing WAS a balance issue.

Ok so you want to change every class which does *% of damage with one spell?

Ok so firemage most dmg is from Pyro, i think we should nerf that becasue it is yxz% of his damage!

No matter if the class suxx then.
etc etc this is not a good point of yours.
If you hate that rupture does so much damage then move some damage from rupture to other spells.

ATM outlaw is close / above assa single target with an specific ilvl. AOE outlaw is the king. So why play assa when outlaw is as good in ST and better on AOE?
And this also applies to sub. It will surpass Assa also the mobility will grant you more active time to damage etc.

They should wait some month in to raiding before making Assa again bullshit before the expansion launches.
Or buff assa spells when they want to nerf rupture

[Krille]

Except Rupture was designed as the main draw of the spec, bleeds AND poisons

Still is. The artifact has a bunch of traits that impact Rupture. Did some casual testing on my rogue yesterday and exsanguinate still did more damage than the other talents.

But i do honestly feel like this was a fix for PVP since the burst you could dish out with exsanguinate opener was insane. Not just the damage but getting over 100 energy in a matter of seconds was pretty broken.

[Gaidax]

Ok so you want to change every class which does *% of damage with one spell?

No, I merely point out that Rupture with exsanguinate WAS broken. Don't see what are you so up in arms about that.

I play in Alpha and Beta and I did plenty of dungeon and raid testing to clearly see this one is broken and honestly I am surprised it took so long to fix, which is Bizzard's mistake, because they should have adjusted it long before Legion pre-patch hit.

And yes, if Assassination needs buffs in other areas then it should get those. Does not mean it should keep the obviously broken stuff until then though.

And honestly don't try to convince me it was balanced - it was shit OP in single target by a metric ton and the only "balance" for it was the fact that Assassination is somewhat weak in AoE and such.

[Minka]

Still is. The artifact has a bunch of traits that impact Rupture. Did some casual testing on my rogue yesterday and exsanguinate still did more damage than the other talents.

But i do honestly feel like this was a fix for PVP since the burst you could dish out with exsanguinate opener was insane. Not just the damage but getting over 100 energy in a matter of seconds was pretty broken.

You know that exsang was tuned down in pvp to 100% before or? There was no 400% burst in pvp

[Gaidax]

But i do honestly feel like this was a fix for PVP since the burst you could dish out with exsanguinate opener was insane. Not just the damage but getting over 100 energy in a matter of seconds was pretty broken.

It was a fix for PvE because it WAS broken in PvE - I remember some Mythic+8 Halls of Valor run with some Assassination Rogue and the moment we got this Valkyr buff at Odyn, he literally roflstomped him in one phase of a buff.

[EternalBany]

Soooo the real question am I spending all my artifact power on Outlaw>Assas>Sub?

I am having the same dillemma
But i can tell you its gonna be either between assassin or sub
Some pessimists are saying we will have to swallow a whole expansion of braindead facedesk mashing with subtely

I reckon assassin is still better and you should put your artifact points into it, if sub ever gets ahead it will be 1 year from now as blizzard likes to spice things up with stats and numbers

[Conformist]

Thank god for the exsanguinate nerf. I think sub is the stronger specc overall in arena so I've been playing it exclusively, but I always worry when I fight a assassination rogue because I know he'll own me if I don't have a healer. Now I'm a little less worried.

[EternalBany]

Thank god for the exsanguinate nerf. I think sub is the stronger specc overall in arena so I've been playing it exclusively, but I always worry when I fight a assassination rogue because I know he'll own me if I don't have a healer. Now I'm a little less worried.

ofc its best in pvp cause sub is unpeelable and assass doesnt even have blind or gouge
but pve is a different matter, maybe if you get obscene amounts of mastery sub will be superior to assassin, but that could take a while