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  1. #1781
    Bloodsail Admiral Cannibalus's Avatar
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    Serious question(s): Why the fuck are people even considering the 2p of the Argus raid? When is ever barkskin a lifesaver?

    Current 2p & 4p are amazing, i just realized that they might be indispensable, even in the next raid. Right now that is my current plan, hoping for titanforged pieces.

    Also what's up with the idea of pairing tanking trinkets? What if i have a crazy mofo officer tank who wants to do damage, so i'm forced to take the armor one even though it's not much of an upgrade for a bear. I feel like throwing up, just like when they fermly suggested that i take the darkmoon trinket... as a motherfucking bear... "Sco and the other tank are using it, you think you're smarter?" All the while i believe that a simple versa trinket is better... sad times.

    I hope the stats will change come next patch
    Face your Demons, befriend them, listen to their needs and feed them regularly in times when you and your closest ones get afflicted the least. No one likes a hungry demon on the loose.

  2. #1782
    It's pretty early to make any determinations on the argus set pieces. They're crap right now (lol +5% healing after BS...) but might get tuned to be decent. They'd have to be pretty over the top for me to want to take it. I personally hate it when they pair set bonuses to our defensive abilities that the 4 piece...

  3. #1783
    Quote Originally Posted by Cannibalus View Post
    Also what's up with the idea of pairing tanking trinkets? What if i have a crazy mofo officer tank who wants to do damage, so i'm forced to take the armor one even though it's not much of an upgrade for a bear. I feel like throwing up, just like when they fermly suggested that i take the darkmoon trinket... as a motherfucking bear... "Sco and the other tank are using it, you think you're smarter?" All the while i believe that a simple versa trinket is better... sad times.
    The likely reason Method used those trinkets was because the group DPS was good enough (after all the rounds of nerfs) and had their tanks focus just on survival, because I guarantee if tank DPS was needed to kill mythic KJ they'd be using DPS trinkets and gear setups. More specifically, the Skorp trinket was used for specific mechanics, so if a fight doesn't really need the extra CD there are better options available. Just keep in mind that every raid is different and has different needs. One of the biggest follies I've seen out of progression guilds is the mentality of "X guild did it this way, that must be the only way our raid can do it" versus "let's learn from X guild's strat and tailor our strat to our raids strengths/weaknesses." However, if your survival is questionable, maybe your officer is kindly suggesting get more tanky, who knows. If your group's DPS is not meeting certain requirements for mechanics or your tank DPS is really helping the raid out, you can always make that argument.

    As Valkon said, it's still pretty early into the PTR, and our set bonuses have already changed four times (I think, lost count after a while). I've grown quite fond of our current tier set bonuses, actually... not as much as when I'm boomkin, but the love is there!

  4. #1784
    Quote Originally Posted by Cannibalus View Post
    S...just like when they fermly suggested that i take the darkmoon trinket... as a motherfucking bear... ...
    It's still the best defensive trinket going. For all tanks, including bear. Armour is THAT good. I have it on all my tanks, including main, it rarely leaves it's slot in raids.

  5. #1785
    While DMC:I is the weakest for bears, it is still pretty good. It still does more on average than a versa stick of the same level, as long as the damage you take is mostly physical (it is pretty senseless to equip it when tanking spirit realm on Desolate Host). And I mean the alternatives, if you didn't roll an amazing stat stick are pretty uninteresting either way.
    Monk/Main,Druid/Alt, Logs. Meine Gilde rekrutiert. Bei Interesse kontaktiert mich hier, unsere Offiziere in Game oder bewerbt euch direkt auf unserer Website.

  6. #1786
    Anyone know if SI Ring, talent, & KJ trinket (with average RNG) is enough to have SI up for every hammer on Maiden? Sitting at 11.1m HP with leggo chest (10.5% TH), Pulverize (9%), SM (4%) and SI (63%) seems to be enough to soak every hammer if topped, and it's possible to add Barkskin or RotS to every single one just to be safe.

    Haven't seen enough of the fight to know if SI is up for every one, though. Would love some advice from those who've got a bit further than myself

  7. #1787
    Quote Originally Posted by Toybox View Post
    Anyone know if SI Ring, talent, & KJ trinket (with average RNG) is enough to have SI up for every hammer on Maiden? Sitting at 11.1m HP with leggo chest (10.5% TH), Pulverize (9%), SM (4%) and SI (63%) seems to be enough to soak every hammer if topped, and it's possible to add Barkskin or RotS to every single one just to be safe.

    Haven't seen enough of the fight to know if SI is up for every one, though. Would love some advice from those who've got a bit further than myself
    I highly doubt it. Given a 6 minute maiden fight there are 14 hammers. 7 to soak. First one is either 10 or 30 seconds in. Then there's a 1m30 gap. Then 2 with a 45s-1m interval. Then back to 1m30.

    10-30s: 1
    1m30: 2
    2m15: 3
    3m30: 4
    4m00: 5
    5m15: 6
    6m00: 7

    This is just taken from a random 6 minute log.
    With the ring and the talent I think you'll be able to cover 5 with SI's.

    EDIT: Just checked SI cooldown with talent and ring and it's on a 135s for me.
    This gives me the following rotation (IF SI is enough to survive the hit).

    10-30s: SI
    1m30: Bark+ROTS+Trinkets
    2m15: SI
    3m30: Bark+ROTS+Trinkets
    4m00: SI
    5m15: Bark+ROTS+Trinkets
    6m00: SI

    If you have to cycle Bark or ROTS to survive with SI:

    10-30s: SI + Bark + ROTS
    1m30: SI + Bark
    2m15: SI + Bark? + ROTS
    3m30: Something else? + Bark
    4m00: SI + Bark? + ROTS
    5m15: SI + Bark
    6m00: Something else + Bark? + ROTS

    I'm using ? on bark because it depends if you're holy or fel. If you go from holy to fel, the timing between the hammers is enough to get bark back up. It's from fel to holy you won't have enough time. If it's from holy to holy or fel to fel it's going to be close.

    EDIT2: I think you want to kill it at around 6 minutes at least, so you can actually just suicide the last one.
    Last edited by CenariusTheForestLord; 2017-08-04 at 02:05 AM.

  8. #1788
    Quote Originally Posted by CenariusTheForestLord View Post
    snip*
    Or you could just wait for someone that has done the fight to answer with actual knowledge.

    SI+KJ Trinket+Survival of the Fittest will mean you always have SI up for Maiden Hammer.

    Combine SI with Bark or RoTS. Add a trinket to be extra safe, but not required.
    Last edited by Emancptr; 2017-08-04 at 03:01 AM.

  9. #1789
    Quote Originally Posted by Emancptr View Post
    Or you could just wait for someone that has done the fight to answer with actual knowledge.

    SI+KJ Trinket+Survival of the Fittest will mean you always have SI up for Maiden Hammer.

    Combine SI with Bark or RoTS. Add a trinket to be extra safe, but not required.
    Didn't see the KJ part. I was doing the math without it. You don't need to have done the fight to figure this rotation out. I'm only trying to help.

  10. #1790
    Cheers both for the help

    Yeah the KJ trinket is what I couldn't math out quickly for myself. I've NEVER used it before now, so I thought I'd better ask.

  11. #1791
    We managed Maiden FK yesterday i used SI ring + Trash wrists. For trinkets i had UaC and Scorpyron trinket. I use combo Bark +SI+ Rage or Bark+SI+trinket for survival. for fifth i use Guardian spirit + Rage + Priest barier. If you dont have some CD so DH with netherwalk can split some dmg for you if same Infusion.

    Here log with buffs what i got on hammer hits
    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...auras&source=9
    Jurman - Guardian Druid <Embody>

  12. #1792
    Quote Originally Posted by Jurman View Post
    We managed Maiden FK yesterday i used SI ring + Trash wrists. For trinkets i had UaC and Scorpyron trinket. I use combo Bark +SI+ Rage or Bark+SI+trinket for survival. for fifth i use Guardian spirit + Rage + Priest barier. If you dont have some CD so DH with netherwalk can split some dmg for you if same Infusion.

    Here log with buffs what i got on hammer hits
    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...auras&source=9
    Awesome thx! Interesting to see it done without trinket.

  13. #1793
    I am new to tanking this expansion and I'm looking for a bit of help with trinkets. I was offtanking during Nighthold but now in ToS I DPS (Balance). I mostly use my Guardian spec when doing world quests and the occasional dungeon (Heroics/Timewalking/FFA PVP)

    I am running Elize's and Skysec's for legendaries (with Rend & Tear) although I do have Ekowraith, Cindaria, and KBW

    As far as trinkets go I have:

    970 KBW
    910 Shifting Cosmic Sliver
    905 Leviathan's Hunger
    900 Infernal Bloodstone Shard (Stat stick Agi/Vers + Socket)
    895 Infernal Contract
    890 Anshe's Token of Guile (Stat stick Agi/Mastery)
    885 Majordomo's Dinner Bell (+ Leech)
    885 Animated Exoskeleton
    885 Chrono Shard (+Socket)
    885 Royal Dagger Haft
    880 Impenetreble Nerubian Husk
    880 Writhing Heart of Darkness
    865 Stormsinger Fulmination Charge (+Speed)
    860 Unstable Arcanocrystal
    860 Devilsaur's Bite (+Socket)
    845 Inescapable Dread
    840 Grotesque Statuette
    840 Unbridled Fury

    Mostly I'm having trouble figuring out what to keep and what to get rid of. The last thing I want to do is vendor a trinket that I thought was terrible and turned out might be useful (Fang ?). But this trinket collection is getting out of control.

    Help!
    Last edited by Herself; 2017-08-09 at 03:34 PM.

  14. #1794
    Quote Originally Posted by Herself View Post
    I am new to tanking this expansion and I'm looking for a bit of help with trinkets. I was offtanking during Nighthold but now in ToS I DPS (Balance). I mostly use my Guardian spec when doing world quests and the occasional dungeon (Heroics/Timewalking/FFA PVP)

    I am running Elize's and Skysec's for legendaries (with Rend & Tear) although I do have Ekowraith, Cindaria, and KBW

    As far as trinkets go I have:

    970 KBW
    910 Shifting Cosmic Sliver
    905 Leviathan's Hunger
    900 Infernal Bloodstone Shard (Stat stick Agi/Vers + Socket)
    895 Infernal Contract
    890 Anshe's Token of Guile (Stat stick Agi/Mastery)
    885 Majordomo's Dinner Bell (+ Leech)
    885 Animated Exoskeleton
    885 Chrono Shard (+Socket)
    885 Royal Dagger Haft
    880 Impenetreble Nerubian Husk
    880 Writhing Heart of Darkness
    865 Stormsinger Fulmination Charge (+Speed)
    860 Unstable Arcanocrystal
    860 Devilsaur's Bite (+Socket)
    845 Inescapable Dread
    840 Grotesque Statuette
    840 Unbridled Fury

    Mostly I'm having trouble figuring out what to keep and what to get rid of. The last thing I want to do is vendor a trinket that I thought was terrible and turned out might be useful (Fang ?). But this trinket collection is getting out of control.

    Help!
    Do you want dps trinkets or surv trinkets? Do you do challenging content as bear? If not:
    Keep the agi vers stat stick and Chrono Shard. Keep Cosmic Sliver and contract for some situations for survival.
    Dump the rest, especially everything below 880

  15. #1795
    Hello from yesterday test, i do with te KJ trinket all soaks alone except one if you are more lucky you can do all alone.
    build : SI Ring, talent, & KJ trinket
    10-30s: SI
    1m30: Bark+ROTS+Trinket (here don't forget to use KJ to reset faster the cd, never use it to gain time on SI)
    2m15: SI
    3m30: Bark+ROTS+Trinkets (here don't forget to use KJ to reset faster the cd, never use it to gain time on SI)
    4m00: SI
    5m15: Bark+ROTS+Trinkets (here don't forget to use KJ to reset faster the cd, never use it to gain time on SI)
    6m00: SI

    But don't forget that you can do Light- fel on one single rotation...and when it happens request an external cd and don't use nothing.

  16. #1796
    Quote Originally Posted by Aldryana View Post
    Hello from yesterday test, i do with te KJ trinket all soaks alone except one if you are more lucky you can do all alone.
    build : SI Ring, talent, & KJ trinket
    10-30s: SI
    1m30: Bark+ROTS+Trinket (here don't forget to use KJ to reset faster the cd, never use it to gain time on SI)
    2m15: SI
    3m30: Bark+ROTS+Trinkets (here don't forget to use KJ to reset faster the cd, never use it to gain time on SI)
    4m00: SI
    5m15: Bark+ROTS+Trinkets (here don't forget to use KJ to reset faster the cd, never use it to gain time on SI)
    6m00: SI

    But don't forget that you can do Light- fel on one single rotation...and when it happens request an external cd and don't use nothing.
    That can't be correct. You're only using 4 si's when you have access to 5 without the trinket. 6 with.

  17. #1797
    ..... stop tell is not correct, i know what i do... i can't have access to 5 or 6 due to the fact the we killed the boss in 6min

  18. #1798
    Quote Originally Posted by Aldryana View Post
    ..... stop tell is not correct, i know what i do... i can't have access to 5 or 6 due to the fact the we killed the boss in 6min
    Just because you killed him with 4 SI uses doesn't mean you wouldn't have more available.

    Simple math -
    Facts: SI Ring + Talent: 3 Charges, 2.27 minute re-charge (136 seconds)
    Fight Length: 6 minutes
    First SI use: 10-30 seconds

    So lets assume 30 seconds for the first, that means at 166 seconds you get the 4th SI, and at 302 seconds the 5th (5 minutes and 2 seconds).
    Clearly in 6 minutes you have *at least* 5 SI charges available with Ring + Talent, without KJ.

    I don't know the exact rates of the KJ trinket to factor it in, but I'm sure you could squeeze one more out over 6 minutes.
    Last edited by Nevcairiel; 2017-08-14 at 03:44 PM.

  19. #1799
    Quote Originally Posted by Nevcairiel View Post
    Just because you killed him with 4 SI uses doesn't mean you wouldn't have more available.

    Simple math -
    Facts: SI Ring + Talent: 3 Charges, 2.27 minute re-charge (136 seconds)
    Fight Length: 6 minutes
    First SI use: 10-30 seconds

    So lets assume 30 seconds for the first, that means at 166 seconds you get the 4th SI, and at 302 seconds the 5th (5 minutes and 2 seconds).
    Clearly in 6 minutes you have *at least* 5 SI charges available with Ring + Talent, without KJ.

    I don't know the exact rates of the KJ trinket to factor it in, but I'm sure you could squeeze one more out over 6 minutes.
    Thx, I was almost going to have to do all the math myself

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Aldryana View Post
    ..... stop tell is not correct, i know what i do... i can't have access to 5 or 6 due to the fact the we killed the boss in 6min
    I'm not particularly saying your rotation was wrong. I'm just saying that isn't the optimal way to do it if you're using KJ trinket. The trinket is basically worthless if you're not using all the SI charges at the end of the fight.

    So when you're not using the KJ trinket, yours is actually pretty good. However you'd need some pretty strong trinkets to cover the gap you'd normally have with an SI. Also a naked SI is cutting it really close. In my experience I usually need about 10-15% extra DR to 100% survive the hit with a possible melee before/after.

  20. #1800
    Guys i'd appreciate your input regarding dps trinkets.

    Currently I have:
    930+Socket Hunger of the Pack
    935 Horn of Valor
    915 Engine of Eradication
    875 Memento
    895 Draught of Souls
    910 Mrrgria's Favor

    Sims show my best combo for pure dmg is Hunger+HoV for both ST and Multi.
    Btw I'm running Incarnation with Luffa/Legs for raids and m+ bosses and Luffa/Cloak for +m trash.
    Does that seem correct to you? Should I consider something else based on my available options? I am obviously trying to get my hands on some better ones but until them I'm trying to figure out my best current option.
    Last edited by Selerian; 2017-08-16 at 09:43 AM.

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