Dh 1v3 versus gladiators.

[Yoshimiko]

DH's are weak as shit in PVP compared to other melees. We are unreliable glass cannons that do ridiculous damage once in a blue moon. Every class with a stun, root, slow, bleed or damage immunity/absorb spell counter Demon hunters. If you're facing competent players 90% of the time you will die, in a stun, during the first minute of an arena. That's how you counter them. CC them to death, there's nothing a DH can do against that. They have no utility to prevent getting trained. If 2 people decide to focus a DH then he's a goner within a few seconds. Meta slam, haha, that's so delusional. If the target is moving that stun will rarely register as it's 0.000000000000001 yard range, a nano meter range. It's not enough that you meta in the vicinity of the target, it needs to be dead on the hitbox for it to have any chance of registering. Furthermore our survival is based on the damage we deal. Got an absorb, bubble, cloak, root, slow, stun, poly? Ye, then no heals for that DH and then he dies within the following 2 seconds. Trust me DH won't be a problem in PVP. One shotting a scrub once every 20 matches doesn't get you rating.

I'd say DH is a very reliable glass cannon. Their damage is all controlled, they line up a shit load of CDs and blow someone up. Not much unreliability to be had. And squishiness doesn't excuse incredibly high damage, especially with the mobility they're rocking. It's not a "nanometer", they have two stuns, both of which are 5 or 8 yards.

These are the same excuses we had for warriors at the start of MoP where ~75% of ranked teams over 2k had a warrior. Unless we're in a WOTLK meta - where everyone can kill someone in under 3 seconds, there's simply no excuse for one class being able to do it. DH do far too much damage.

Also, they have un-dispellable immunity with a huge movement buff. That's MASSIVE. I guarantee the more common high rated teams will be something like healer-pseudo healer - DH or Healer-Control-DH because of how ridiculous their damage is. You *CAN* build entire teams around a single DPS because of how high their burst is. That's not good design.

[Bloodnickel]

Just like the DK, DH's will be stupid in pvp for a while.

[Deleted]

I'd say DH is a very reliable glass cannon. Their damage is all controlled, they line up a shit load of CDs and blow someone up. Not much unreliability to be had. And squishiness doesn't excuse incredibly high damage, especially with the mobility they're rocking. It's not a "nanometer", they have two stuns, both of which are 5 or 8 yards.

But you can't build or get the damage out if you're being controlled properly. If you throw a root on me then I'm gonna stand there like an idiot doing fuck all for the entire duration of that root. Got no root breakers, no defensive or offensive cooldowns that breaks roots and basically the only thing I can do is throw my glaive at you a couple times for a moderate amount of damage. Follow that up with a stun, slow or other control spell. I'm always gonna be resource starved and do bee sting damage. The danger comes in when you ignore me, allowing me to pool 100 rage. At that point I can dump on you and perhaps kill you very quickly if you don't do anything about it. This isn't anything special. You can't just ignore someone who has popped every single CD in the game and is focusing you. Doesn't matter what class you're up against, if you do that you die. You gotta start kiting, using defensive abilities when that happens. And Meta stun isn't 8 yards, the damage from the initial impact is 8 yards. The stun itself is way less and on moving targets it's also buggy and doesn't always register.

These are the same excuses we had for warriors at the start of MoP where ~75% of ranked teams over 2k had a warrior. Unless we're in a WOTLK meta - where everyone can kill someone in under 3 seconds, there's simply no excuse for one class being able to do it. DH do far too much damage.

Come back next week when season has started and tell me how many people want a DH in their team. Trust me, last pick. Who the fuck wants a worse rogue on their team? DH's are an absolute nightmare to have on your team. They require constant babysitting from the healer or they die. They don't have any valuable abilities to bring to a comp. We got slow on glaive for peeling/kiting and then we have a useless defensive ability that eats up one attack MAYBE because it's RNG based. The only thing they got going for them is damage during meta. That's not gonna be winning games. This isn't consistent damage, it's a blow all your CD's and hope something dies. That works in in the 1500 bracket.

Also, they have un-dispellable immunity with a huge movement buff. That's MASSIVE. I guarantee the more common high rated teams will be something like healer-pseudo healer - DH or Healer-Control-DH because of how ridiculous their damage is. You *CAN* build entire teams around a single DPS because of how high their burst is. That's not good design.

But then we don't have self healing through meta because that's the trade-off. Without soul rending we're not able to train during meta, no healer will be able to keep us up. Come on, DH's are very controllable, squishy and brings no defensive/offensive utility to the team. Absolute garbage for arena. Perhaps RBG they'll shine, maybe.

Point is: I'm not defending the damage. But you gotta realize that's the only thing DH got. Once that nerf comes DH will disappear in PVP completely. They have nothing else to bring to the table. Very poorly designed class.

[Yoshimiko]

Come back next week when season has started and tell me how many people want a DH in their team. Trust me, last pick. Who the fuck wants a worse rogue on their team? DH's are an absolute nightmare to have on your team. They require constant babysitting from the healer or they die. They don't have any valuable abilities to bring to a comp. We got slow on glaive for peeling/kiting and then we have a useless defensive ability that eats up one attack MAYBE because it's RNG based. The only thing they got going for them is damage during meta. That's not gonna be winning games. This isn't consistent damage, it's a blow all your CD's and hope something dies. That works in in the 1500 bracket.

Why do people seem to think burst damage is suddenly irrelevant once you get over a certain rating? Comps carry different win conditions. Some via pressure, some via burst, some via counteracting meta teams. Teams like Shadowplay, RLD, LSD, LSD2, etc. are all pressure teams. Teams like RMP, RSpD, Triple DPS RMP, etc. are all control-burst teams. Teams like TSG, KFC, etc. can pivot between the two. Meanwhile, teams like Kanye Cleave only became semi-popular because Shatterplay, aka God Comp was so popular, along with various other caster cleaves.

Does noone remember how popular Man Cleave was? Double Arms warrior? Or Kittycleave/Double feral healer/Feral+rogue+healer were when cat druid got buffed? Or double healer frost DK? Double healer Arms warrior? These were gladiator level teams. Burst damage can most certainly work and you definitely can design a team around it. Many have and many have been successful.

But you can't build or get the damage out if you're being controlled properly. If you throw a root on me then I'm gonna stand there like an idiot doing fuck all for the entire duration of that root.

What garbage healer are you playing with? Seriously, this bugs me. Unless you're seeing double CC, in which case you have pretty big problems anyways, that should almost instantly be dispelled. You should be pooling your resources for blowing up a priority target under double or triple CCs when you trigger their trinkets. That's your goal as a burst class.

[Cainium]

I can't understand how anyone can really think there is a need for discussion here.

No class should be able to kill someone in 3-5 seconds. Fullstop. That's the point and nothing else matters. The "weaknesses" to stop it can be compensated by another class -> Profit. Someone remember Destruction Warlocks two-shotting people with Chaosbolt? "But you can so easily LoS it"... didn't justify it either. So "just root the DH", doesn't justify it too.

Luckily for DHs: Blizzard won't fix it until at least 7.1, 'cause they want as much DH players a possible -> Profit.

[Shibito]

Did you see how many DH players are within the DH class hall compared to other classes?

Its the new FOTM class just like DKs during lich king

Try beeing a dk now after they took away deaths advance ;

[HeiAggra]

Try beeing a dk now after they took away deaths advance ;

Advance to death??? LOL

[Woop Woop]

Advance to death??? LOL

Thats the name of the ability, do you have a point with that comment...?

[Ebalina]

Yeah, those multi rank 1 people are just bad, nothing to do with DH being ridiculous. Is that what you are saying?
You can say he could have done this and that after watching, but even with your amazing (as you implied) wow talent, you wouldnt have done any better in that scenario. You dont expect to have to trinket a 3 second stun vs someone in the 100k hp range, you expect the fight to be over, especially when all 3 is near 100% hp. Even if he had trinket linked, that DH may well have killed all 3 regardless, but we will never know. Anyway, it's a fact that DH is brokenly op, not an opinion, so do us all a favor and stop arguing.

This clip is one in a million i say it again one in a million.
L2p is the issue here not the dh dmg.

[HeiAggra]

Thats the name of the ability, do you have a point with that comment...?

OK! Lack of humor detected. Try to read again the name :P

[Ponkster]

The people defending demon hunters here; will look back in 6 months and think "what was I thinking?"

They are an absolute plague in arena, their mobility along with wind-walker monks makes ranged classes tiresome to play.

Proof is in the pudding, 80% of enemy teams consist of DH/WW. Class representation is always in favour of the strongest because people LIKE winning so they keep queuing. I haven't come up against an ele shaman in arena yet, they probably queue, die within 3 seconds and go "no chance im doing that again"

It's why Shaman and Druid are infesting hearthstone ladder right now also.

[Cempa]

This clip is one in a million i say it again one in a million.
L2p is the issue here not the dh dmg.

Thing is its not one in a million, I see it happen just about every day in BG's .. Any objective based game either with a ball/orb/flag or protecting a node people will be near each other .. Now what happens when a DH or x2 DH tunnel a healer or any DPS for that matter? We should all stand back and watch as they go through what seem like scripted motions?

Havoc is like a rattlesnake you can see it, hear it and know it hurts and will kill you but no one wants to go near it hoping it would just go away .. It won't ..

AE inside PvP needs a HUGE turf for this build
Leech needs a HUGE turf for this build
meta duration is crazy and needs to drop to SINGLE seconds on a 3min CD if it will keep the same power and leech

The build has so little setup and is so close to having a rotation its sad ..

[Snackwiches]

The damage is absurd and it will be nerfed.

You can whine, cry, deny, throw a fit, do whatever, but it WILL be nerfed. If that will make you quit the game or throw a tantrum then just get yourself ready.

[Cempa]

The damage is absurd and it will be nerfed.

You can whine, cry, deny, throw a fit, do whatever, but it WILL be nerfed. If that will make you quit the game or throw a tantrum then just get yourself ready.

Quantify 'absurd'? What to you is an 'absurd' amount of damage?

Moreover; people needs to be aware that artifact power is a HUGE part of damage and stamina ..

If said Affi is AP 2x and you are AP x YOU WILL GET ANNIHILATED .. Its be design man .. Its like during WoD if you go up against a BiS PvP any one and you are in fresh quest greens ..

[Deleted]

Hahaha these DH FOTM players sure are salty but don't worry you won't get a big nerf until 7.1, might as well enjoy it as much as you can and then head to the next broken class, when all know how you people operate

[Deleted]

One of their AoE abilities seems to break any stuns which is pretty ridiculous and nullifies the statement "just cc".

[Ebalina]

Thing is its not one in a million, I see it happen just about every day in BG's .. Any objective based game either with a ball/orb/flag or protecting a node people will be near each other .. Now what happens when a DH or x2 DH tunnel a healer or any DPS for that matter? We should all stand back and watch as they go through what seem like scripted motions?

Havoc is like a rattlesnake you can see it, hear it and know it hurts and will kill you but no one wants to go near it hoping it would just go away .. It won't ..

AE inside PvP needs a HUGE turf for this build
Leech needs a HUGE turf for this build
meta duration is crazy and needs to drop to SINGLE seconds on a 3min CD if it will keep the same power and leech

The build has so little setup and is so close to having a rotation its sad ..

L2p issue don't stay close to each other.
BG's ain't about and never will be about balance lol just the notion of it are you for real?

[Cempa]

L2p issue don't stay close to each other.
BG's ain't about and never will be about balance lol just the notion of it are you for real?

Ignore objective .. don't peel for focused target and run around like a headless chicken because a DH showed up .. COOL!

Ps I awarded you the same short meaningless kind of answer you gave .. put some effort into your post and explain your POV!

BG's are a good place to start seeing how we don't have rated yet and many BG maps are the same as RBG maps ...