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  1. #1
    I am Murloc! Xuvial's Avatar
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    How in gods name do I use Cinderstorm

    ...in a mythic dungeon without fear of aggroing unwanted mob packs? Why couldn't this ability just travel STRAIGHT instead of a ridiculous sideways arc that travels for 40+ yards? Am I doing something wrong, or do I really have to face a specific 20-60 degree angle to the right so I can get it to hit something to the left (or in front) of me? Let alone hit a moving target.

    I've practiced a lot, but have still had some accidental aggros due to how much the flames deviate off-target and how far they travel. There's just no predicting what this ability will hit unless you have a degree in arc geometry.

    Or should I just say "fuck it" and roll with Meteor?
    Last edited by Xuvial; 2016-10-10 at 12:53 AM.
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  2. #2
    Hunters have an ability just like that. I don't know how they do it. Sometimes they pull with it, sometimes they don't.
    "May the way of the Hero lead to the Triforce"

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  3. #3
    Realistic answer? You don't. The vast, vast majority of people use Kindling. I've never seen a mage using Cinderstorm. Kindling does only slightly less damage anyway, is a lot easier to use (Kindling sims higher if you don't hit 5-6 cinders IIRC), and also has more priority target damage (which is important in mythic+ when you need to get rid of, say, a Pelter in NL or a Mystic/Runecarver in HoV ASAP).

    Idealist answer? You just have to position very carefully. What a lot of hunters do with barrage is run between the mob pack so that you're facing the direction you just came from, where hopefully there aren't any mobs. Even then, this isn't foolproof if there's packs behind you that you've skipped, so you still have to pay lots of attention. You just have to make sure there aren't any mobs anywhere even remotely near the back-left of the mobs.

  4. #4
    I am Murloc! Xuvial's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toas View Post
    Realistic answer? You don't. The vast, vast majority of people use Kindling.
    I see. Okay then, I'll use that.

    Will definitely miss that satisfying "bwoof" of numbers from landing all cinders on a target though >_<
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  5. #5
    You use cinderstorm by doing exactly that, pulling the whole dungeon. At the start of the expansion I kept pulling everything but it didn't matter because they were just normals and heroics. After you practice enough you will get a feel for the spell and by then you will know how to position yourself so it doesn't pull extra mobs.

    However if you are really just can't be bothered with that then the easiest way to use it is to blink past everyone and turn around aim the cinderstorm towards your group since you should have cleared anything in the path you came from.

    There is also an addon or WA string some use to show you the range of cinderstorm if you really wanted.

  6. #6
    The Patient arioc's Avatar
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    Its all about positioning, instead of standing behind the tank just move more to the side. The cinders will always go straight forward and curve in an arc to the left so you just have to plan ahead. Once you start thinking about your positioning it because very easy to use it in dungeons and if you're unsure about using it just dont. Also kindling is a much better option than Meteor. Hope this helps!
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  7. #7
    you get used to it the more you use it. it just takes practice. you can absolutely reliably use it on cooldown without ever pulling anything extra.

  8. #8
    Like arioc says, it's pretty easy to use once you get use to it. And there's always the option of going ahead of the pack and firing backwards.

    In most case though, it's about knowing the range.

  9. #9
    Blink behind the mobs and cinderstorm from the direction you came from or shoot them into walls. Sometimes you just can't use it for pulls.
    Hi Sephurik

  10. #10
    Deleted
    It is all about positioning - there are few situations where you can't use it, but in most cases it works perfectly fine. Kindling is not that great in 5m, because when you are not using it on CD, you are loosing so much of it's value (and you want to save Combustion for the bosses) - CiS is much better for trash because of its AoE potential.

  11. #11
    The realistic answer is - you can't maximize its output 100% of the time on every pull, you will either aggro extras, or you will lose globals by trying to position yourself in a safe enough position to get a cast off.
    You also don't use cinder on any meaningful mythic+ content, which is 10 and higher, kindling is simply vastly superior for that.

    What you're seeing on streams is people who outgear the content level they're running, so they basically link 4-5 packs and blast away like mongoloids, a monkey could do that. Watching those same people trying to complete a timer on 10+ is another story tho good times.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by arandan View Post
    The realistic answer is - you can't maximize its output 100% of the time on every pull, you will either aggro extras, or you will lose globals by trying to position yourself in a safe enough position to get a cast off.
    You also don't use cinder on any meaningful mythic+ content, which is 10 and higher, kindling is simply vastly superior for that.

    What you're seeing on streams is people who outgear the content level they're running, so they basically link 4-5 packs and blast away like mongoloids, a monkey could do that. Watching those same people trying to complete a timer on 10+ is another story tho good times.
    There are only 1 dungeon I can think of where the adds are so packed that you risk pulling other packs; certain parts of Halls of Valor. I've managed to use Cinderstorm and not pull in most dungeons and cases.

    As for losing global ... LB -> Ice Floes -> Rop -> PF -> DB -> Cis .... how did I lose global getting into position??

  13. #13
    Legendary! Obelisk Kai's Avatar
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    Moving aside slightly from HOW to use it, does anyone have any idea why in the name of God it is like this to begin with!?

    The only boss I find it useful on is Ursoc and thats because he is so huge I can't ruddy miss him.

  14. #14
    First of all, raid bosses are all HUGE and almost an automatic full hit. No issue at all.

    In dungeons, it's a bit more tricky to get things right. You need practice and awareness to get the most out of Cinderstorm, but with both you can get a lot out of it to be sure. Especially hitting multiple enemies, you can rack up quite some numbers if your aim is good.

    That being said, there do remain times where you either miss, or ninja-pull, or don't cast it because you'd risk either of the two. Positioning helps a lot to be sure, such as standing at the front rather than the back and aiming it back towards where you came from (which is generally free of mobs), or aiming towards the sides/into walls. Still, even with all that, you'll ninjapull occasionally (also because embers sometimes for no apparent reason climb over walls or go right through them and pull the other side).

    If you're doing higher-level M+, chances are you'll fare better using Kindling. The more time you spend actually casting things that proc Kindling (as opposed to, say, just going LB, DB, CiS and the pack is nearly dead, which is how m+2 usually goes with a boost group) the better it becomes. On M+5 and higher it's probably the optimal choice as you can squeeze out a lot of extra Combustions which you can then pair with things like massive LB explosions for lololol numbers.

  15. #15
    I pulled the BRH 2nd boss off the balcony 2 floors up while doing trash at the bottom before. First and last time trying to use cinderstorm in a dungeon.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Fenzha View Post
    I pulled the BRH 2nd boss off the balcony 2 floors up while doing trash at the bottom before. First and last time trying to use cinderstorm in a dungeon.
    So instead of learning from your mistake, you dismiss the skill entirely and don't learn how to use it?

  17. #17
    I am Murloc! Xuvial's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rickdiculous View Post
    So instead of learning from your mistake, you dismiss the skill entirely and don't learn how to use it?
    You have to admit it's a pretty terribly designed and clunky ability.
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  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Fenzha View Post
    I pulled the BRH 2nd boss off the balcony 2 floors up while doing trash at the bottom before. First and last time trying to use cinderstorm in a dungeon.
    you messed up and its the skills fault? lol

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Xuvial View Post
    You have to admit it's a pretty terribly designed and clunky ability.
    its not clunky at all. it works the exact same way every time and its predictable.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Rickdiculous View Post
    So instead of learning from your mistake, you dismiss the skill entirely and don't learn how to use it?
    I was happy using Kindling when a guild member i was running with suggested using it. To this day mage barrage is a guild joke.

  20. #20
    Deleted
    I accidentally used Cinderstorm in a level 8 and I said ok, let's test going back to it and see if it does anything positive this time. Nope, it's still kinda shit for that type of content. It's not so much that it's shit in itself. It's that Kindling is god-like in the durations it gives to the CD of Combustion. It's not even that it's frequent. It's that it's conveniently up at the right times most of the time. 2 minute CDs in this game are eons-long in content of that type. It's similar in raid bosses with multiple and complex phases. The main way I see cinderstorm being unequivocally best is in certain sustained-damage bosses because it basically makes it simpler by combusting less, and in some rare cases where a boss is kinda complex but you hit the rare case that Kindling lines up Combustion badly (but I find that to be rarer and rarer, and 5man full-runs are a main indication to it).

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