Frost DK + Koltira's Newfound Will (Legendary - 15% chance on rune refund for Oblit.)

[Vycaus]

Capping RP doesn't matter at all. Damage per RP and Damage per Rune aren't even on the same planet. Dump runes always, keep IT up, FS on free globals. Always keep OBing.

[Calathiel]

Since a week a have a belt as well and I felt it's not working as good as I would like it to do, but I had not enough time to look for an answer. Finally today I've got enough time to actually check forum and followed some of sugestions. Here are some results from slaping dummie for 5 min:
IT/FP/RA: in both runs I've ended at somewhere under 350k
MF/FF/GS: both runs close to regular setup but a bit under, 345k+
IT/FF/RA: +/- 380k in both runs
Last setup seems to be working best for me, keep in mind that I might be doing some mistakes as Im mostly playing as a blood. But for ppl that know what they are doing I guess it's worth to spend some more time on testing FF instead of FP (with a belt ofc).

[Cosmic Janitor]

What relics do you have in your weapon? Seeing how we can theoretically buff HB with them I guess it could matter.

[Calathiel]

What relics do you have in your weapon? Seeing how we can theoretically buff HB with them I guess it could matter.

1 Blast Radius (HB)
1 Cold as Ice (1% frost dmg)
1 Dead of Winter (RW)

My weapon is just at lvl28 as I've switched back to fueling my blood weapon. With next 3 points going into Blast Radius that dmg would go up even more.
Here's my armory:
http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...traks/advanced

[Deleted]

Hello,

finally I picked up my 1st Legendary : Koltira's Newfound Will (15% chance on rune refund for Oblit.)
http://www.wowhead.com/item=132366/k...-newfound-will

So I'm playing with RA-Ob spec and with this new legendary I've got the problem of having sometimes to much runes.

During the normal rotation (after some proccs of the belt) the runes are piling up much faster than I can spent them. Then after spamming Ob (and FrostStrike for IT) I'm full of runic power.
So main problem is that due the legendary I have times with to much runes:

- therefore Frozen Pulse isn't running
- dumping all runes fast for Frozen Pulse results in capping runic Power
- trying to spend runic power before reaching the cap results means delaying Frozen Pulse.

After 10-15sec the situation all runes are spent and the "normal" rotation sets in - until the next rune-overflow.

So my questions are what should I set as my priorities ?

1. IC and Frostfever at all costs

2a) Frozen Pulse (resulting in runic power capping and wasting)
2b) not capping runic power (resulting in delaying Frozen Pulse)


For AoE/cleave I thing 2a) is the way to go
but for Single Target?

Maybe even Breath of Sindragosa maybe viable for dumping runic power (but I think this is not the case)

What are other "belt-owners" thinking/doing ?

It's actually 15% chance on oblit to refund runes, not chance on rune refund for oblit ;p

#1 means when using oblit you have a chance to get back 2 runes #2 means that when you refund runes you have a chance to obliterate

[Cosmic Janitor]

1 Blast Radius (HB)
1 Cold as Ice (1% frost dmg)
1 Dead of Winter (RW)

My weapon is just at lvl28 as I've switched back to fueling my blood weapon. With next 3 points going into Blast Radius that dmg would go up even more.
Here's my armory:
http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...traks/advanced

Nah, okay, I can't reproduce that then, since I have a combined level of 3 already in Blast Radius (2 from points, 1 from a relic).

Edit: Also in regards to my 20 : 6.5 HB+FF:FP ratio, that was in encounters where I totally fucked up, favoring it massively. In normal tries I'm still seeing consistently better numbers from FP of at least 8%, so no clue how it could be better.. maybe if they buffed it 35-40%.

[KoRnDaddy]

Well,

I have the belt and I'm still doing 8-9% of FP damage, I don't see FF replacing the FP yet. Not in a ST at least.

[Schizoide]

right below it.

Sorry, I guess I was unclear. What you're saying is contrary to all testing, parses, and simulation. You need to prove it with numbers so other people can try to duplicate. Are you saying that build works only with the legendary belt?

[Deleted]

Well,

I have the belt and I'm still doing 8-9% of FP damage, I don't see FF replacing the FP yet. Not in a ST at least.

They'd have to bring it to pre nerf levels so 40% and not 25%.

Personally I dislike Frozen Pulse and would pref FF over it but oh well.

[KoRnDaddy]

They'd have to bring it to pre nerf levels so 40% and not 25%.

Personally I dislike Frozen Pulse and would pref FF over it but oh well.

I understand, but as @Schizoide said, we need numbers and not superficial percentages. As I said I have the belt and I cannot keep up my FP all the time, but 8-9% of damage it is pretty much imho. And 25% more for HB and Frost Fever do not compensate using FF instead of FP.

But you guys should have more experience than me and different gear I dont know, but only the belt really worth use FF than FP? I don't see it in numbers, again, at least not in a ST or +2 targets.

Correct me if I'm wrong please.

Have a good day.

KoRn

[Schizoide]

As far as the sim is concerned, it definitely is not. FF is an extremely undertuned talent that nobody should take until it's buffed.

GS with the leg belt is potentially more interesting.

[KoRnDaddy]

As far as the sim is concerned, it definitely is not. FF is an extremely undertuned talent that nobody should take until it's buffed.

Do you think maybe Shoulders Legendary + Relics Blast Radius would change it? Becoming FF better than FP. Btw, having both, belt + shoulders legendary.

Regards,
KoRn

[Schizoide]

Just checked out GS with the belt and the answer is no, it still sucks rocks. In fact, it's only a 1.2% gain compared to no talent in that tier at all. Getting the legendary helm does not make GS worth taking either.

RA is worth ~7% DPS on its own; GS is only worth 1.2%. That disparity cannot be overcome.

T19H 2210003 talents, w/leg belt: 356.3k
T19H 2210023 talents, w/leg belt: 382.2k
T19H 2210033 talents, w/leg belt: 360.7k

T19H 2210003 talents, w/leg belt & helm: 362.7k
T19H 2210023 talents, w/leg belt & helm: 389.1k
T19H 2210033 talents, w/leg belt & helm: 367.2k

[nathrizarri]

Just checked out GS with the belt and the answer is no, it still sucks rocks. In fact, it's only a 1.2% gain compared to no talent in that tier at all. Getting the legendary helm does not make GS worth taking either.

T19H 2210003 talents, w/leg belt: 356.3k
T19H 2210023 talents, w/leg belt: 382.2k
T19H 2210033 talents, w/leg belt: 360.7k

T19H 2210003 talents, w/leg belt & helm: 362.7k
T19H 2210023 talents, w/leg belt & helm: 389.1k
T19H 2210033 talents, w/leg belt & helm: 367.2k

that is absolutely bullshit, sorry. 1.2%? hell no. Your simcraft ig wrong. I do have live data, pure numbers taken from ingame.

Taking F.scythe and not using it: RW deals 3-4% of my damage.

Taking Gathering Storm: RW deals 10-11% of my damage. Not to mention with my Legendary helm, howling blast deals more so RW participation in % gets squished a bit.

268 ST no GS

290 ST w/ GS

3 minute combat time. I staggered couple RW along the way but wouldnt effect that much.

[Schizoide]

that is absolutely bullshit, sorry. 1.2%? hell no. Your simcraft ig wrong.

Hi again, nathrizarri. Please provide more detail than "that's bullshit", so I can check it.

[Deleted]

that is absolutely bullshit, sorry. 1.2%? hell no. Your simcraft ig wrong. I do have live data, pure numbers taken from ingame.

Taking F.scythe and not using it: RW deals 3-4% of my damage.

Taking Gathering Storm: RW deals 10-11% of my damage. Not to mention with my Legendary helm, howling blast deals more so RW participation in % gets squished a bit.

268 ST no GS

290 ST w/ GS

3 minute combat time. I staggered couple RW along the way but wouldnt effect that much.

So what's your DPS with the "cookie-cutter" build (using RA instead of GS or FrostScythe) ?
@Schizoide
I've got 3 Blast Radius Relics - even with this setup FF is still not worth taking according to sims, right ?
It's hard to get 3 Ambidexterity Relics with better ilvl :-(

[Schizoide]

That's correct. It makes essentially no difference whatsoever-- but with the helm and waist, blast radius relics aren't a DPS loss, so you got that.

T19H 2210003 talents, w/leg belt & helm: 362.7k
T19H 2210023 talents, w/leg belt & helm: 389.1k
T19H 2210033 talents, w/leg belt & helm: 367.2k

T19H 2210003 talents, w/leg belt & helm, 3*bradius: 363.1k
T19H 2210023 talents, w/leg belt & helm, 3*bradius: 389.3k
T19H 2210033 talents, w/leg belt & helm, 3*bradius: 367.5k

[nathrizarri]

So what's your DPS with the "cookie-cutter" build (using RA instead of GS or FrostScythe) ?
@Schizoide

I used 3110021 and I did 282k on ST dummy over 3 min combat. Got the helm.

I am quite suprised. RA not only boosted my Fstrike damage but also made my HB the top damaging ability with %16 of my damage. Frost Fever dealt %5. I think main reason being more runes coming from the RP spent and lower Pillar CD due to more FS hits.

Changed FF to FP, lost about 20k dps. Low uptime due to resource flow and not taking IT should explain it.

--

To make it short, If you consider Freezing Fog, you must have talents that keep the rune flow. Just like IT-FP has an insane synergy, you need ME-FF synergy to make FF work. You should'nt have any extra ability that fights over runes If you want to boost Freezing Fog's damage, Like Fscythe, GA.


But..

Switching to RA made me a sustained damage dealer whereas with GS I was more burst. Well dont let that burst fool you, I was still nothing compared to big burst dealers like DHs but still, was more "bursty" than RA.

[Deleted]

If you seriously have an issue with too much RP, just dump RA and go Gathering Storm.

If you're overcapping on RP, why take a talent that gives you more of it? Get Gathering storm and play to the strength of your legendaries, instead of trying to force a playstyle you did not get the correct pieces for.

If RA still sims higher than GS with your current setup, you have to look to your own performance, because you might be overcapping, not due to excessive inflow, but rather due to poor planning/execution.

[Deleted]

If you seriously have an issue with too much RP, just dump RA and go Gathering Storm.

If you're overcapping on RP, why take a talent that gives you more of it? Get Gathering storm and play to the strength of your legendaries, instead of trying to force a playstyle you did not get the correct pieces for.

If RA still sims higher than GS with your current setup, you have to look to your own performance, because you might be overcapping, not due to excessive inflow, but rather due to poor planning/execution.

I'm only overcapping on RP when trying to dump all "legendary procced runes" fast for frozen pulse running.
Right now I'm "ignoring" Frozen Pulse - i.e. not trying to cap RP and therefore Frozen Pulse is a bit delayed until all excess runes are spent.