1. #3201
    The Insane Daemos daemonium's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Land of moose and goose.
    Posts
    15,562
    Complaining about abby’s muscle mass or pretending it doesn’t fit the setting is Mabye the stupidest complaint any one could have.

    I mean the wolf’s are shown to
    Have Work out gear,
    Have Live stock,
    Grow there own food,
    Give there soldiers extra food and let them cut in line.
    Compile all of this with Abby going out of her way to train as a solider and being one of top ranking ones her having a good amount of muscle mass makes sense and the fact that other community’s don’t have as much food isn’t at all a counter to the wolf’s an Abby being better off.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Rennadrel View Post
    And yet, no woman who is a body builder looks like Christine Focht without steroids, which I can 100% guarantee she does, like most body builders do.
    You don’t know a lot or body builders do you? Abby isn’t out of the realm of possibility without steroids as long as she has food to support her gains and proper work out equipment she wouldn’t have a problem getting to her mass if she was really dedicated to it and the game shows the wolf’s to have every thing she would need.

  2. #3202
    The Lightbringer Darththeo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away
    Posts
    3,816
    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    Complaining about abby’s muscle mass or pretending it doesn’t fit the setting is Mabye the stupidest complaint any one could have.

    I mean the wolf’s are shown to
    Have Work out gear,
    Have Live stock,
    Grow there own food,
    Give there soldiers extra food and let them cut in line.
    Compile all of this with Abby going out of her way to train as a solider and being one of top ranking ones her having a good amount of muscle mass makes sense and the fact that other community’s don’t have as much food isn’t at all a counter to the wolf’s an Abby being better off.
    The bolded one isn't true. There is no evidence soldiers are given extra food or allowed to cut in line, Manny (the soldier who did it) is shown to be an asshole and acting on his own as shown by the person calling him out of it. Abby was going to wait her turn. And they didn't take extra food besides an additional burrito for Mel, so it wasn't even for them. The seen very much shows soldiers AREN'T permitted to cut in line, just certain choose to abuse their rank and Abby is not shown to be one of them.

    And have livestock and grow their own foot is one point really, why did you list it as two?
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  3. #3203
    The Insane Daemos daemonium's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Land of moose and goose.
    Posts
    15,562
    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    The bolded one isn't true. There is no evidence soldiers are given extra food or allowed to cut in line, Manny (the soldier who did it) is shown to be an asshole and acting on his own as shown by the person calling him out of it. Abby was going to wait her turn. And they didn't take extra food besides an additional burrito for Mel, so it wasn't even for them. The seen very much shows soldiers AREN'T permitted to cut in line, just certain choose to abuse their rank and Abby is not shown to be one of them.

    And have livestock and grow their own foot is one point really, why did you list it as two?
    being called an asshole doesn't show they aren't allowed to cut in line it only shows that the civ's don't like that they can, If they weren't allowed they wouldn't have been given the food first or would have been reprimanded by any one with rank instead of of just being met with some grumbling by people they out rank. and as far as taking some for mel manny never tells the server such he just takes extra without a word which even abby points out which is why he has to tell her it's for mel.

  4. #3204
    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    being called an asshole doesn't show they aren't allowed to cut in line it only shows that the civ's don't like that they can, If they weren't allowed they wouldn't have been given the food first or would have been reprimanded by any one with rank instead of of just being met with some grumbling by people they out rank. and as far as taking some for mel manny never tells the server such he just takes extra without a word which even abby points out which is why he has to tell her it's for mel.
    So a soldier points out to a soldier that they are not allowed to do that.
    All right, gentlemen, let's review. The year is 2020 - that's two-zero-two-zero, as in the 21st Century's perfect vision - and I am sorry to say the world has become a pussy-whipped, Brady Bunch version of itself, run by a bunch of robed sissies.

  5. #3205
    The Lightbringer Darththeo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away
    Posts
    3,816
    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    being called an asshole doesn't show they aren't allowed to cut in line it only shows that the civ's don't like that they can, If they weren't allowed they wouldn't have been given the food first or would have been reprimanded by any one with rank instead of of just being met with some grumbling by people they out rank. and as far as taking some for mel manny never tells the server such he just takes extra without a word which even abby points out which is why he has to tell her it's for mel.
    There are many other possibilities on why Manny was allowed to cut in line. Like the fact he gets the burritos from a woman and he has ... well, a certain history with women. Also, the person IN FRONT of Abby in line is listed as WLF Soldier when told burritos, and Abby said Manny's actions were "embarassing."

    All of this is strong evidence you are wrong. Also, he orders in Spanish three burritos, you are just factually wrong on the scene.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ve_Ki89Dxf0

    Scene starts at around 16:50
    Last edited by Darththeo; 2020-08-11 at 06:05 PM.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  6. #3206
    The Insane Daemos daemonium's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Land of moose and goose.
    Posts
    15,562
    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    So a soldier points out to a soldier that they are not allowed to do that.
    not at all she says its embarrassing and ask why he took an extra while manny acts as if it's normal and is surprised abby is waiting in line.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    There are many other possibilities on why Manny was allowed to cut in line. Like the fact he gets the burritos from a woman and he has ... well, a certain history with women. Also, the person IN FRONT of Abby in line is listed as WLF Soldier when told burritos, and Abby said Manny's actions were "embarassing."

    All of this is strong evidence you are wrong. Also, he orders in Spanish three burritos, you are just factually wrong on the scene.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ve_Ki89Dxf0

    Scene starts at around 16:50
    your right the sub's do list them as soldiers so it could be a ranked based thing as Manny and Abby are given squad command by Issac or it could be that it's some one manny has banged, who knows.

  7. #3207
    The Lightbringer Darththeo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away
    Posts
    3,816
    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    not at all she says its embarrassing and ask why he took an extra while manny acts as if it's normal and is surprised abby is waiting in line.

    your right the sub's do list them as soldiers so it could be a ranked based thing as Manny and Abby are given squad command by Issac or it could be that it's some one manny has banged, who knows.
    There are many ways that Manny's behavior could be explained in that scene. And given Abby's willingness to wait and Manny's lack there of, we get nothing on what is considered normal behavior for soldiers in the scenario. Abby could be being nice, or Manny could be being just an asshole and using the excuse they are going to the front lines as the reason for being an asshole.

    The main issue of why I responded to you was that you cannot state as a fact that WLF Soldiers are permitted to cut in line for food. We have one soldier (Manny) who cut in line. And you can't use he was given three burritos as evidence soldiers get to take more food as we don't know Manny took more food than permitted for anyone else.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  8. #3208
    The Insane Daemos daemonium's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Land of moose and goose.
    Posts
    15,562
    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    There are many ways that Manny's behavior could be explained in that scene. And given Abby's willingness to wait and Manny's lack there of, we get nothing on what is considered normal behavior for soldiers in the scenario. Abby could be being nice, or Manny could be being just an asshole and using the excuse they are going to the front lines as the reason for being an asshole.

    The main issue of why I responded to you was that you cannot state as a fact that WLF Soldiers are permitted to cut in line for food. We have one soldier (Manny) who cut in line. And you can't use he was given three burritos as evidence soldiers get to take more food as we don't know Manny took more food than permitted for anyone else.
    your right given that the sub's point to them all being soldier's there's no real way to know if manny got away with it from being manny or if there's another reason so abby may be limited to the same rations as every one else and we don't really have a way to know other wise or even if abby was just being nice and they can normally take more.

  9. #3209
    The Lightbringer Darththeo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away
    Posts
    3,816
    Quote Originally Posted by Belize View Post
    Yeah, uh, no.
    Only because zombies in general are unrealistic, but the fungus they describe does zombify insects, most people know about the one that affects ants. Therefor, their explanation for the zombies is realistic because it is built upon a real world fungus.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  10. #3210
    The Insane Belize's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Gen-OT College of Shitposting
    Posts
    19,485
    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    Only because zombies in general are unrealistic, but the fungus they describe does zombify insects, most people know about the one that affects ants. Therefor, their explanation for the zombies is realistic because it is built upon a real world fungus.
    Fungus infected insect don't roam around charging other insects. They clumsily climb up whatever they can find and die.

    Calling them "based on real life" is a massive stretch. We might as well say Halo Spartans are realistic because performance enhancing drugs are real, so it's really close to genetic enhancement implanted at age 14.

  11. #3211
    The Lightbringer Darththeo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away
    Posts
    3,816
    Quote Originally Posted by Belize View Post
    Fungus infected insect don't roam around charging other insects. They clumsily climb up whatever they can find and die.

    Calling them "based on real life" is a massive stretch. We might as well say Halo Spartans are realistic because performance enhancing drugs are real, so it's really close to genetic enhancement implanted at age 14.
    Well, it would be right because they are. Just because you go "it's a massive stretch" doesn't mean it is. Hell, if you looked into some of the research such as genetic engineering, exosuits, etc ... all are very possible tech we could have. The Spartans aren't the stretch in Halo.

    I don't think you understand what based on real life means. It doesn't mean 100% accurate to reality, it means that it is something that could be potentially real. A fungal infection that changes behavior is possible. A fungal infection that affects the brain is possible. Fungal infections that zombify animals is possible. It isn't a stretch by any measure to say it is based on real life. You can only say that out of ignorance or personal bias, not any factual argument.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  12. #3212
    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    Well, it would be right because they are. Just because you go "it's a massive stretch" doesn't mean it is. Hell, if you looked into some of the research such as genetic engineering, exosuits, etc ... all are very possible tech we could have. The Spartans aren't the stretch in Halo.

    I don't think you understand what based on real life means. It doesn't mean 100% accurate to reality, it means that it is something that could be potentially real. A fungal infection that changes behavior is possible. A fungal infection that affects the brain is possible. Fungal infections that zombify animals is possible. It isn't a stretch by any measure to say it is based on real life. You can only say that out of ignorance or personal bias, not any factual argument.
    Fungal infections that turn people into the Rat King are totally possible!

    TLOU is as out there as Resident Evil is when you start factoring in Clickers, Shamblers, Stalkers, Bloaters and The Rat King. If it was just runners you would have a tiny argument here, but it's not.

  13. #3213
    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    Well, it would be right because they are. Just because you go "it's a massive stretch" doesn't mean it is. Hell, if you looked into some of the research such as genetic engineering, exosuits, etc ... all are very possible tech we could have. The Spartans aren't the stretch in Halo.

    I don't think you understand what based on real life means. It doesn't mean 100% accurate to reality, it means that it is something that could be potentially real. A fungal infection that changes behavior is possible. A fungal infection that affects the brain is possible. Fungal infections that zombify animals is possible. It isn't a stretch by any measure to say it is based on real life. You can only say that out of ignorance or personal bias, not any factual argument.
    Just to further back your statements:

    While viral and not a fungus, Rabies is already proven to be behavior altering

    If we're sticking to the topic of fungus specifically, I'll present Massospora cicadina:
    The infected male cicadas put on a ruse, much like the Sirens of Greek myths; they flick their wings like a female, and lure in healthy unsuspecting males, who get close enough to be exposed to the spores, leading to their doom. The diseased males will also attempt to copulate with the uninfected females, exposing them to even more spores.
    https://www.dw.com/en/five-freaky-co...ior/a-18043053 also list a few other behavior altering viruses / bacteria.

    https://www.researchgate.net/publica...ior_and_Beyond offers more

    From an article on Scientific America:
    he mix of art design and plausibility gives the choice to model an apocalypse on Cordyceps both scientific rigor and beauty.

    I doubt the zombie apocalypse will ever actually happen even it were scientifically plausible. Despite my skepticism, plausibility obviously has nothing to do with why zombies are so popular. They are a fascinating metaphor for our own fear of both death and predators (and who doesn’t like gore-porn?). Scientific plausibility is just icing on the cake.

  14. #3214
    The Insane Belize's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Gen-OT College of Shitposting
    Posts
    19,485
    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    Well, it would be right because they are. Just because you go "it's a massive stretch" doesn't mean it is. Hell, if you looked into some of the research such as genetic engineering, exosuits, etc ... all are very possible tech we could have. The Spartans aren't the stretch in Halo.

    I don't think you understand what based on real life means. It doesn't mean 100% accurate to reality, it means that it is something that could be potentially real. A fungal infection that changes behavior is possible. A fungal infection that affects the brain is possible. Fungal infections that zombify animals is possible. It isn't a stretch by any measure to say it is based on real life. You can only say that out of ignorance or personal bias, not any factual argument.
    I'm just going to go ahead and be on the side of "Girl who trains at compound that clearly does not have any food supply problems from all the agriculture we see, is more realistic than mushroom zombies".

    Because it's about ten billion times more based on real life than mushroom zombies. You can keep whinging about "this fictional woman's physique breaks the realism in muh video game" all you want though.

  15. #3215
    The Lightbringer Darththeo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away
    Posts
    3,816
    Quote Originally Posted by Tech614 View Post
    Fungal infections that turn people into the Rat King are totally possible!

    TLOU is as out there as Resident Evil is when you start factoring in Clickers, Shamblers, Stalkers, Bloaters and The Rat King. If it was just runners you would have a tiny argument here, but it's not.
    That is where the suspension of disbelief comes in. They are the next step beyond what happens in nature, therefor yes, it is possible. There is a point you just have to accept something, it is based on what it is built off of. A weak base makes it unrealistic, a strong base built on real things make something believably possible.

    Given your current track record in this topic, is there anything you actually understand? Please go back to ignoring me, I liked it better that way.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Belize View Post
    I'm just going to go ahead and be on the side of "Girl who trains at compound that clearly does not have any food supply problems from all the agriculture we see, is more realistic than mushroom zombies".

    Because it's about ten billion times more based on real life than mushroom zombies. You can keep whinging about "this fictional woman's physique breaks the realism in muh video game" all you want though.
    Because it is a bodybuilder physique of a woman who is currently part of a faction at war who is somehow give the hours needed to train to not just keep the muscle mass, but build it ... while at the same time being the Number 1 Scar killer of her faction ... seriously, you ignore big problems with her physique that don't add up in the story they are trying to tell.

    It is 10 trillion times less believable because of how the story is built. We don't see Abby working out, it is implied very loosely. We don't see her consuming anything more than a single burrito, the entire game. Again, I said yes, a woman could have that physique in the real world ... a woman is extremely unlikely to have that physique in the world of TLoU.
    Last edited by Darththeo; 2020-08-11 at 08:25 PM.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  16. #3216
    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    Because it is a bodybuilder physique of a woman who is currently part of a faction at war who is somehow give the hours needed to train to not just keep the muscle mass, but build it ... while at the same time being the Number 1 Scar killer of her faction ... seriously, you ignore big problems with her physique that don't add up in the story they are trying to tell.
    I mean...being the #1 killer would generally mean she's engaged in a lot of heavy physical activity to like...you know, kill the fuck outta the seraphites, no?

    And that she works out in addition to that? I mean, it's not as if she's just naturally jacked as fuck from sitting on her ass all day.

    Why the fuck is a menagerie of spore zombies believable but Abby being jacked as fuck is a bridge too far?

  17. #3217
    Quote Originally Posted by Shiny212 View Post
    Any fiction requires suspension of disbelief, but it also needs internal consistency. In a world of great resource scarcity where a major plotpoint is lack of food, forcing people into cannibalism, a bodybuilder seems pretty stupid.

    For the record, imo Abby's physique is a minor flaw in TLOU2, but it is a flaw.
    That's my view as well. It's hardly important, but it damages the credibility of a setting that otherwise works quite hard to maintain it. I feel that they could have made Abby a big, strong woman without going to the extreme of giving her the physique of a modern bodybuilder who has access to a very specific training regiment, diet, personal coaches and sundry supplements. Make her look like Brienne in Game of Thrones and call it a day, no need for the extra ripped muscles.
    It is all that is left unsaid upon which tragedies are built -Kreia

  18. #3218
    The Lightbringer Darththeo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away
    Posts
    3,816
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    I mean...being the #1 killer would generally mean she's engaged in a lot of heavy physical activity to like...you know, kill the fuck outta the seraphites, no?

    And that she works out in addition to that? I mean, it's not as if she's just naturally jacked as fuck from sitting on her ass all day.

    Why the fuck is a menagerie of spore zombies believable but Abby being jacked as fuck is a bridge too far?
    No, I can fully believe she could have a muscular physique ... I cannot believe she would be more jacked than pretty much everyone else in her faction.
    Hell, the only people more jacked than her in the game are some of the Seraphites that I can recall.



    If she looked like that, I wouldn't have a problem hell, even if she had larger muscles than the woman above, but not to the size they gave her, I would have less of a problem. The problem isn't the fact she has muscles, it is how she seem to have devoted herself to body building and yet somehow is in combat enough to be the #1 Scar Killer.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    That's my view as well. It's hardly important, but it damages the credibility of a setting that otherwise works quite hard to maintain it. I feel that they could have made Abby a big, strong woman without going to the extreme of giving her the physique of a modern bodybuilder who has access to a very specific training regiment, diet, personal coaches and sundry supplements. Make her look like Brienne in Game of Thrones and call it a day, no need for the extra ripped muscles.
    Other points for Brienne ... she is seen training, she talks about what she does and why she does it. It is part of the character and the world that GRRM and later Game of Thrones built.
    Last edited by Darththeo; 2020-08-11 at 08:39 PM.
    Peace is a lie. There is only passion. Through passion I gain strength. Through strength I gain power.
    Through power I gain victory. Through victory my chains are broken. The Force shall set me free.
    –The Sith Code

  19. #3219
    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    Nice strawman.

    A good story game must have one of these (preferably both):
    1. Gameplay and Story are in sync
    2. Player agency in the story

    Last of us 2 is none of those. It's just a movie with regular interruptions for an interactive ad for some mildly related game in the same universe.
    The lone voice of sanity on this thread.

    People seem to handwave the fact that the game is tonally inconsistent, disrespectful to the predecessor, and horribly paced. Have fun spending an hour plugging in some generators because Ellie apparently can't climb. Have fun watching a pregnant woman go into combat, die, and then try and make you feel like you're to blame for her actions.

    Oh and enjoy playing as an irredeemable character. It's like Yong said in his review, Abby's butchering of Joel in front of, as far as she knows, his daughter is psychopathic levels of evil. If you felt anything for Abby after that, you're delusional and simply wanted to like the game because you're emotionally invested in the first one (and there is nothing wrong with disliking the sequel if it was genuinely shit).

    I feel like this game was intended to have choices in it, but they were removed during development because Naughty Dog knew it would make writing a sequel harder.

  20. #3220
    Quote Originally Posted by Darththeo View Post
    That is where the suspension of disbelief comes in. They are the next step beyond what happens in nature, therefor yes, it is possible. There is a point you just have to accept something, it is based on what it is built off of. A weak base makes it unrealistic, a strong base built on real things make something believably possible.
    Sure show me the insect rat king based off current known fungal infections. It's possible so link the scientific basis for it huh? Should be so easy right?

    Imagine being worried about the size of muscles in a world that literally has a fucking rat king, brock lesnar sized bloaters throwing acid grenades at you, stalkers that are as nimble and quick as an AC protag etc.

    Suspension of disbelief for all this crazy ass non sense going on, but you're worried about the size of muscles from a woman who trains in the Seahawks training facility and has a community self sufficient on food supply is an issue. You really can't make this shit up.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •