1. #1
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    Australia opens door to China in push to save TPP

    Source: https://www.yahoo.com/news/australia...032404735.html



    Australia said Tuesday it was working to recast the Trans-Pacific Partnership without the United States and opened the door for China to sign up after President Donald Trump ditched the huge trade pact.

    The deal included a dozen Asia-Pacific nations which together account for 40 percent of the global economy, but Trump declared Monday he had "terminated" it in line with election pledges to scrap the "job killer" pact.

    Canberra is floating a "TPP 12 minus one", with Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull saying his government was in "active discussions" with other signatories including Japan, New Zealand and Singapore on how to salvage the agreement.

    "It is possible that US policy could change over time on this, as it has done on other trade deals," Turnbull told reporters in Canberra, adding that the nominee for US secretary of state Rex Tillerson and Republicans supported the TPP.

    "There is also the opportunity for the TPP to proceed without the United States," he added.

    "Certainly there is the potential for China to join the TPP."

    The agreement, the biggest trade deal in history, was seen as a counter to China's rising economic influence. It was signed last year but has not gone into effect.

    Trade Minister Steven Ciobo said Australia, Canada, Mexico and others had canvassed for a pact without the United States at a World Trade Organisation ministerial meeting in Davos.

    "There would be scope for China if we were able to reformulate it to be a TPP 12 minus one, for countries like Indonesia or China or indeed other countries to consider joining," Ciobo told the Australian Broadcasting Corporation.

    "This is very much a live option and we are pursuing it and it will be the focus of conversations for some time to come."

    New Zealand Prime Minister Bill English noted that Beijing "hasn't been slow to spot the opportunity" to cast itself as a free trade supporter.

    There was a willingness towards "making an effort to find out what we can do with TPP, rather than just dropping it and waiting and hoping to get a call (from Washington) about bilateral agreements sometime", he told reporters in Wellington.

    Trump said he would pursue bilateral deals with TPP signatories to secure terms more favourable to the US. But English said a US-New Zealand pact would be challenging given Trump's insistence that Washington would dictate terms.

    - Chinese interest -

    Alan Oxley, the first Australian to chair the General Agreement on Tariffs and Trade (GATT), the World Trade Organisation's predecessor, said Chinese involvement in the TPP was unlikely at this stage since it had bigger issues to tackle.

    "China's certainly interested in the long run... but the prospect of them tying into the TPP now, given their own domestic economic problems, has got to be considered very low," Oxley, who heads the Australian APEC Study Centre at RMIT University, told AFP.

    The most likely option for TPP nations was "let the dust settle" and wait for possible changes in US attitudes towards multilateral pacts.

    "There was support for the TPP from the leaders of both houses of Congress... and trade policy is settled by Congress and the Administration," Oxley said.

    "It's worth noting that (previous US president Barack) Obama in his first term opposed free-trade agreements, and in his second term switched positions.

    "So US politics on trade policy is more fluid, I think, than some outside the US realise."

    His view was echoed by analysts in Japan, even though Prime Minister Shinzo Abe -- a big supporter of the accord -- has said the TPP would not make sense without the US.

    "Japan thinks it's worth patiently maintaining the (TPP) framework even until the United States possibly comes back to it under the next administration," Yoko Takeda, chief economist at Mitsubishi Research Institute, told AFP.

    "Also, it is still unknown if the Trump administration is really walking away from TPP or if it could be a negotiating bluff. It's too early for Japan to change its stance."

  2. #2
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    Well, yes. They can absolutely move forward without the US.
    But it will be missing the biggest market and economy then.

    Still, I think Australia is kinda depended on these kind of agreements, so it's no surprise they will have to proceed one way or another.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Deruyter View Post
    Well, yes. They can absolutely move forward without the US.
    But it will be missing the biggest market and economy then.

    Still, I think Australia is kinda depended on these kind of agreements, so it's no surprise they will have to proceed one way or another.

    Well, they still got Japan and if they can bring China on board, sheesh that's a lot of money. Is Korea part of TPP? I forget.
    .

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  4. #4
    The Unstoppable Force Mayhem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hubcap View Post
    Well, they still got Japan and if they can bring China on board, sheesh that's a lot of money. Is Korea part of TPP? I forget.
    Original signatories Australia Brunei Canada Chile Japan Malaysia Mexico New Zealand Peru Singapore United States (Withdrawn) Vietnam

    They are on the list of potential members though.
    Quote Originally Posted by ash
    So, look um, I'm not a grief counselor, but if it's any consolation, I have had to kill and bury loved ones before. A bunch of times actually.
    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    I never said I was knowledge-able and I wouldn't even care if I was the least knowledge-able person and the biggest dumb-ass out of all 7.8 billion people on the planet.

  5. #5
    Not worth considering until they drop the part where Corporations have more rights than Countries.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hubcap View Post
    Well, they still got Japan and if they can bring China on board, sheesh that's a lot of money. Is Korea part of TPP? I forget.
    But isnt Japans economy a sinking ship? I mean, it's been sinking for decades now so maybe they can go for another 10 years, but it doesnt seem like a country you want to be tied to

  7. #7
    Firstly, Australia is not dependent on these agreements. Trade is mostly free already.

    Secondly, this is pure politics. Malcolm Turnbull is a Reaganite right-wing hack that was obsessed with shoving TPP through. He has ran an incompetent right-wing government for 2 years that has achieved LITERALLY NOTHING. So now that he doesn't get his wish, he's angry as hell, lashing out at the opposition leader Bill Shorten for TPP's demise rather than Trump (who he would like to suck up to).

    This is just another desperate attempt to save his corporatist agenda, which consists of massive tax cuts for the rich and big business, cutting healthcare and government services for everyone else, killing the fiber broadband network the government was suppose to build, and negotiating these trade deals that benefit big multinational corporations. But there is no chance the TPP will be salvaged.

    He is the worst PM in the history of Australia.
    Last edited by paralleluniverse; 2017-01-24 at 10:02 AM.

  8. #8
    The Unstoppable Force Mayhem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deruyter View Post
    But isnt Japans economy a sinking ship? I mean, it's been sinking for decades now so maybe they can go for another 10 years, but it doesnt seem like a country you want to be tied to
    ... i do wonder where you get your information from. Their GDP is still way above where it was decades ago.
    Quote Originally Posted by ash
    So, look um, I'm not a grief counselor, but if it's any consolation, I have had to kill and bury loved ones before. A bunch of times actually.
    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    I never said I was knowledge-able and I wouldn't even care if I was the least knowledge-able person and the biggest dumb-ass out of all 7.8 billion people on the planet.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mayhem View Post
    ... i do wonder where you get your information from. Their GDP is still way above where it was decades ago.
    http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/201.../#.WIcm53fWDow

  10. #10
    The Unstoppable Force Mayhem's Avatar
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    So it´s not sinking yet, ok.
    Quote Originally Posted by ash
    So, look um, I'm not a grief counselor, but if it's any consolation, I have had to kill and bury loved ones before. A bunch of times actually.
    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    I never said I was knowledge-able and I wouldn't even care if I was the least knowledge-able person and the biggest dumb-ass out of all 7.8 billion people on the planet.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mayhem View Post
    So it´s not sinking yet, ok.
    No, they keep plugging the holes with more printed money

    Kinda like the US does, but Japan doesn't have the resources to eventually float on it's own again.

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