Cinidaria, Raddons and Sephuz

[Deleted]

Hey guys,

I've done a lot of simming but really haven't been actively raiding enough this expansion to truly judge the 3 legendaries I currently have, Raddon's Cascading Eyes, Sephuz's Secret and Ciandaria the Symbiote.

I've been thinking the following:
M+: Raddons and Sephuz
Single Target without interrupts: Raddons (for stats) and Cinidaria
Single Target with interrupts: Cinidaria, Sephuz
AoE heavy with interrupts: Sephuz, Raddons
AoE heavy without interrupts: Raddons, Cinidaria

Could you guys let me know if I'm judging this right? Or is one of the 3 significally worse for said situations?

Cheers

[Killface1]

You're overrating the value of Sephuz. Fights with interrupts don't always line up with with cd's where you'd want your haste buff. Getting 25% haste is awesome, but its significantly less so if you're sitting on no CD's, nemesis isn't up, etc. Cindaria is Always good - AoE or single target. With AoE you have to be pretty good about quick target swaps and pooling your resources so you can burst hard But a Cindaria buffed eyebeam is massive (assuming you're playing memebuild for AoE heavy). Sephuz is a great legendary if you dont have any others besides the chest, but its too unreliable to be truely useful and good everywhere.

Pretty much the only time I can see taking it is single target with interrupts over the helm, and even then the sheer stats on the helm are probably more worth it.

[Shirofune]

I'm going to say exactly the opposite from the post above me :P

Sephuz, even if its a shit as a legendary, its a great stat stick, at least for Demon Hunters. That crit is very juicy.

Saying that, seeing you've 2 legendaries that are great for for M+, I'd go like this:

- Mythic +: Raddons and Cinidaria, specially on high level M+. In lower ones, I'd take Sephuz.
- Raiding: Sephuz + Cinidaria. The only real reason you would take Raddons over Sephuz in raiding would probably be a boss like Skorpyron, in which you wouldn't be using the ST spec anyway.

Remember this, our ST build spec (222x311) is NOT good at cleaving. In fact, we're shit at cleaving if we can't get Nemesis in a low health target of the same race and kill it before. Getting an EB off might be good if it hits a lot of targets, but there's no point in raiding in which you're going to spam EB non-stop other than Skorpyron. Other than that, EB is not used in Single Target. What I really mean is: focus on Single Target damage.

If anything of what I said really suits you, then your final answer is simming yourself, check what gives you the most output, at least for ST (AoE and M+ is obvious)

[Dimzum]

M+ Sephuz and Raddon's hand down if you're running demonic. With Raddon's Demonic is just too strong. Couple that with the rest of the build and you're chaos nova is up almost every 30secs for a sephuz proc.

Raids: Cindaria is extremely strong for single target and AoE adds since you get that added bonus for them as well.
Raddon's is again strong for the fights if you are using demonic (botanist, spell blade, skorp, tichondrius). For single target, it would depend on what your replacing with each legendary. Sim to be sure.

[Extremity]

For single target raiding encounters, you want to run the belt for sure. As you should really never be casting Eye Beam in ST outside of doing ST as Demonic for whatever reason, the go-to choice would seem to be the ring. In your situation, however, you first need to look at both the ring and helm as stat sticks.

Equip your best non-legendary helm and ring, whatever you'd use in place of either, then see how much of an upgrade each legendary is. I'm assuming you sim and have proper weights, if not do that first. If the helm is a 22% upgrade and the ring is only a 6%, go with the hem. If the helm is 5% and the ring is 14%, go with the ring. Take whaever is the bigger upgrade stat-wise.

The only exception to this rule would be if you're *sure* you can not only proc the ring on the ST boss encounter, but somewhat reliably so. If that's the case, it will take a little more math to properly determine which is best for that fight. Try and guess how many times you'd proc the ring on the encounter; if you're interrupting or stunning adds, base it on how often they spawn, etc. Say there are 5 adds in the fight and they're going to be at least 30 seconds apart. That's 5 times you can gain 25% more haste for 10 seconds, giving the ring a substantial bonus over the helm.

In that case, you would lean towards the ring if it and the helm were close in value (the extra stats each one gives by using it over your best for that slot). Depending on how often you could reliably use the ring, you could lean more towards it even if the helm offered a higher stat gain. You'd have to do the math to find out, determining how much haste it would give (a quarter of your baseline), and the average duration of the fight. If it's a 10 minute fight and you have 4,000 haste, that means you're going to have an extra 1,000 haste for 50 out of 600 seconds, so for 8.33% of the fight. That averages to having about 83.3 extra flat haste over the fight's duration. 1,000 haste for 10 seconds 5 times throughout the fight sounds like a lot, but when you do the math the overall value isn't always super high.

It is more complicated than this, though; a proc during meta or chaos blades is going to be much more valuable, you'll generate more Fury on average during the higher haste periods, etc. Looking at it as an average gain overall is an easy way to try to compare gear with procs, just keep in mind how situational it can be. Use the average just as a guideline. Just the same, if the fight were half the length then it'd be twice the average haste value. You'll have to give it a little thought.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

...it would depend on what your replacing with each legendary. Sim to be sure.

This is what I was thinking.

[ravell]

IRemember this, our ST build spec (222x311) is NOT good at cleaving. In fact, we're shit at cleaving if we can't get Nemesis in a low health target of the same race and kill it before. Getting an EB off might be good if it hits a lot of targets, but there's no point in raiding in which you're going to spam EB non-stop other than Skorpyron. Other than that, EB is not used in Single Target. What I really mean is: focus on Single Target damage.

Just to know, what would be the cleave build for felblade/demonblades/firstblood spec?

[Shirofune]

Just to know, what would be the cleave build for felblade/demonblades/firstblood spec?

Bloodlet instead of First Blood, for 3 constant targets AND with legendary Bracers.

Also probably Momentum instead of Nemesis unless you can get Nemesis on a little add that dies fast of the same race of the other 3 main targets.

If there's no constant 3 target cleave, FB pulls ahead just because of the ST bonus, but the damage to secondary targets is laughable.

[Deleted]

Bloodlet instead of First Blood, for 3 constant targets AND with legendary Bracers.

Also probably Momentum instead of Nemesis unless you can get Nemesis on a little add that dies fast of the same race of the other 3 main targets.

If there's no constant 3 target cleave, FB pulls ahead just because of the ST bonus, but the damage to secondary targets is laughable.

What aboutstandard single build but with Fel Cleave?

[Shirofune]

What aboutstandard single build but with Fel Cleave?

Chaos Cleave got butchered before it got to live.

Being 10% damage makes it so it won't overtake FB in Single Target ever. It won't even do it on cleave, making it the weakest in the tier. (Don't forget Blade Dance damage scales with the number of targets).

[Deleted]

Chaos Cleave got butchered before it got to live.

Being 10% damage makes it so it won't overtake FB in Single Target ever. It won't even do it on cleave, making it the weakest in the tier. (Don't forget Blade Dance damage scales with the number of targets).

It can't overtake first blood not even on 3 - 5 target fight? Why then demonic builds pick fel cleave?

They should change it a bit, put 10 % more damage to primary target while 25 % damage to secondary targets, or something like that.

[Mineral4r7s]

demonic builds dont take fel cleave.

It can't overtake first blood not even on 3 - 5 target fight? Why then demonic builds pick fel cleave?

They should change it a bit, put 10 % more damage to primary target while 25 % damage to secondary targets, or something like that.

[Deleted]

I would never use sephuz though you don't have so much choice. So stick with it for raids and use raddons in m+ with demonic build.