When to switch to MP AP for M+ if ever?

[ScrubRouge]

So here is the break down of how M+ "should" be run for a sin rogue.

Stack mast where you can but you also want around 25-35% crit. (personally like 30% and higher).
Most M+ you will run the MP / Alacrity build since it will produced a much higher overall dmg done in dugeons until you hit something like where the bosses you are trying to kill take upwards of 3-4min in tyranical. (I can't give you what + lvl that would be since that depends on your gear / team dps level)
Alacrity obviously works best if you are making sure the stack doesnt drop off. Always try to kill the last trash between pulls with a 5 point finisher to refresh stack

In fort afix, run MP/Alacrity 100% of the time
In Tyrancical Afix, run MP/AP when the boss kill time starts getting to 3.5 - 4min. Until MP/Alacrity

If you are running AP for the higher M+, be sure to apply deadly poison for trash (switch to AP for any single target mini boss. E.g. 1st mini boss in Vault). Getting use to this will help you max out your dmg out put as best as possible.

For legendary the 3 best are #1 shoulders, #2 / 3 are Wrist and Boots. I say boost for the reduced Vendetta CD. being able to just burn vendetta every 2-3 trash is actually quite nice. The wrist becomes more effective the higher you go in the M+ due the the longer duration of trash staying alive at the execute phase.

MP/AP also really only starts out dmging in M+ for overall when you have high enough Mastery and Agi. around ilvl of 885? maybe 880... I do MP/AP with ilvl of 895+ for Tyranical +15> and come out around 680-750K dps in overall for the dungeon.

As much as MP/AP gives you better dmg on boss fights... M+ is all about that overall dmg output. Try running both and see which one performs better for whatever you are pushing for

Exsang as lost too much value now. Rip. MP too strong.

[Chemii]

You should run mp/subterfuge/alacrity for m+ , it the best sin build for them imo, it provides very strong AoE and cleave and also very decent ST. Make sure you stealth between every pack to get 3x Garotte Everytime.

AP can be okay I'm some Mythic + when tyrannical is up and you rly need strong ST but you need good amount of Mastery for it... Probably 100% +

Exsang is strong at low level of gear but as soon as you start having decent amount alacrity and AP are going to be stronger

I tried this MP/SF/AL build in anger last night in a +14 and +16 and found it to be very lack luster. You lose so much damage from dropping AP on bosses that the very minimal gain on trash is overshadowed.

Swapping between poisons and sticking to the main build nets the same results on trash and better results on bosses.

I also tried Outlaw again in a +14 and have no idea how people think it is better for M+

It may be that both this Subterfuge build and Outlaw only become reasonable choices when you have the shoulders.

[Deleted]

Crit shoulders + legendary cloak, mp/ap, swapping poisons for any big 1-2 adds and Bosses to AP, dp for trash. This is how I like myt+, have 7-12 m dps on big trash pulls with start from stealth 30 stacks and pot. My aoe build now have 167% mastery (using different legenarys and trickets depending on pull)

Dont have bracers btw but the cloak + shoulders is sooooooo strong

[Kalador]

I tried this MP/SF/AL build in anger last night in a +14 and +16 and found it to be very lack luster. You lose so much damage from dropping AP on bosses that the very minimal gain on trash is overshadowed.

Swapping between poisons and sticking to the main build nets the same results on trash and better results on bosses.

I also tried Outlaw again in a +14 and have no idea how people think it is better for M+

It may be that both this Subterfuge build and Outlaw only become reasonable choices when you have the shoulders.

I'm having way better result with alacrity than with AP in almost every m+ situation now, i only switch to AP for 15+ and higher tyrannical. So much of your damage come from poison in AoE / 3+ target i really think alacrity gives a meaningful increase. If you are getting better result overall in dungeon with AP switching to DP for trash i'm no one to judge XD. I also think it might depend a lot on your group comp, if you are running with 2 other AoE burst dps you might see less of an impact.

Generally i think alacrity is a very underrated talent in all situation, i mean in pure ST AP will always be better but every time there is a bit of switching to do or some AoE / cleave i think alacrity is something we should always think about. in NH for example i played with alacrity on skorp, spellblade, bota and Gul'dan (it might be good for elisandre). My dps to boss and overall was a bit lower but my dps to prio adds was much better. For sure when its farm i go AP all the way and tunnel boss but on progression i always think about it. Again i don't think alacrity should be play on those boss without any thought given but i think to many rogue are not even thinking about switching, all 3 exorsus rogue were playing alacrity on 1st Gul'dan.

Finally, i tried outlaw in a +12 and +14 2 weeks ago but it's hard for me to judge as i was like 54 trait in sin and 40 in outlaw. Also my outlaw weapon is a good 15 ilvl behind. i think you need the good legendary to make outlaw work in high M+, I've seen some outlaw with shoulder/wrist do amazing damage in M+ but i just cannot get the same result XD...