#SoloQueue can it actually save ranked pvp?

[rda]

... in mobas you are free to choose whichever champion you like for whichever role is needed, in wow you cannot and that is the biggest impairment to a soloQ in any mmo.

Yes, you should be able to select the class / spec you are going to play with. They could allow this in WoW.

Items could be either standardized since they are so much into templates anyway, or customized (ie, you can queue with either your specific alt or a standard-geared character provided by the system).

The only objective of "kill the enemy team" is fine, plus who says they can't add arena-sized BGs which do have other objectives? They were talking about that two years ago.

All of these problems with solo queue are imaginary. WoW arenas absolutely can be adopted for solo queues. If done right, that could make arenas immensely popular - hell, that could propel WoW back to its former glory and even surpass that. PVP sells.

The real roadblock here is that we are stuck with the PVP dev team who can't put even 1% of the required effort. All they could do is give content-free interviews from time to time about how they think it's "not so bad" or even good. That's it.

[mmowin]

Close to 50% of people want a ranked solo queue. Thats interesting. I wonder why that is. Is it because of the convenience? Or maybe is it because the LFG tool isn't cutting it? I wonder.

[RelaZ]

(ie, you can queue with either your specific alt or a standard-geared character provided by the system).

This will never happen, stop fooling yourself into believing it will. It is counter intuitive to the entire idea of RPG that you get an entierly pre-set character that you havn't played before at all. Blizzard will never go for this type of implementation.

And the alt idea doesn't work either, what about that guy who only has one alt / is able to play 1 class/spec? Is he supposed to be at a disadvantage? And what about those people who get grouped with him? Either you go all out MOBA-solo queue (select class after grouping) which won't happen in PvP or you go some other route, the alt route simply won't work.

What they could (and should, but wont) do instead is make a solo queue system where you can (on a given logged in character) select which comps you're willing to queue up as (with a minimum of say three comps, for example I could choose PHP, PHDK, Jungle as Hunter) and then you get matched into one of those comps based on your mmr and queue time, as usual.

The only objective of "kill the enemy team" is fine, plus who says they can't add arena-sized BGs which do have other objectives? They were talking about that two years ago.

All of these problems with solo queue are imaginary. WoW arenas absolutely can be adopted for solo queues. If done right, that could make arenas immensely popular - hell, that could propel WoW back to its former glory and even surpass that. PVP sells.

True, PvP solo queue could happen in WoW and can definitely be done in a good way. It can't happen in the way you're describing it, but it can be done in a way that would work for all parties involved, except for whoever has to dole out the cash for the development over at Blizzard.

The real roadblock here is that we are stuck with the PVP dev team who can't put even 1% of the required effort. All they could do is give content-free interviews from time to time about how they think it's "not so bad" or even good. That's it.

You're right about the the real roadblock. The dev team (and I say dev team, not PvP dev team) won't put enough guys (i.e invest enough money) on the PvP dev team to make this a reality. I'll be very surprised if the future proves otherwise. They even brought this up in the last Q&A, Holinka said the Goliath-sized HotS dev team on matchmaking makes the PvP dev team look like David in a comparison.

[wholol]

Yes, you should be able to select the class / spec you are going to play with. They could allow this in WoW.

Items could be either standardized since they are so much into templates anyway, or customized (ie, you can queue with either your specific alt or a standard-geared character provided by the system).

The only objective of "kill the enemy team" is fine, plus who says they can't add arena-sized BGs which do have other objectives? They were talking about that two years ago.

All of these problems with solo queue are imaginary. WoW arenas absolutely can be adopted for solo queues. If done right, that could make arenas immensely popular - hell, that could propel WoW back to its former glory and even surpass that. PVP sells.

The real roadblock here is that we are stuck with the PVP dev team who can't put even 1% of the required effort. All they could do is give content-free interviews from time to time about how they think it's "not so bad" or even good. That's it.

"Could and Should" , wishful thinking of a probability only you think would work, the reality of it being much riskier and often than not, won't be realized due to the scale of said changes.

The changes you speak of are not changes blizzard is willing to invest in, they are too drastic a change to a game that is tailored towards lore and pve, there aren't enough pvpers to warrant such a scale of change, not to mention even if they did it would not alter pvp in the slightest, merely fragment whatever is currently left of the population.

You cling to the hopes of seeing wow pvp become something grand, sadly it would be easier for blizz to simply make a new game tailored towards pvp than invest in altering wow on a massive scale with too big a risk and low ROI.

I would simply hope people would look at it objectively to realize it's faults.

[Deleted]

Arena Tournament tried this, it failed badly.

Rated 3v3 has 0 participation and hardly nobody plays anymore.

It used to have a solid 4k population, that's what solo queue does.

Forget this idea, it's dogshit.

[RelaZ]

Arena Tournament tried this, it failed badly.

Rated 3v3 has 0 participation and hardly nobody plays anymore.

It used to have a solid 4k population, that's what solo queue does.

Forget this idea, it's dogshit.

It was highly popular and worked very well, and they only had a very rudimentary version of solo queue - but AT died overall for other reasons not related to solo queue. Meaning it's almost impossible to find a team, thus solo queue is all you can actually play now.

Don't pin AT's failure on solo queue, it had more to do with the fact that it got stagnant (practically the same patch for 5+ years does that) and Warmane didn't exactly market it aggressively either after they took over either.

[Deleted]

It was highly popular and worked very well, and they only had a very rudimentary version of solo queue - but AT died overall for other reasons not related to solo queue. Meaning it's almost impossible to find a team, thus solo queue is all you can actually play now.

Don't pin AT's failure on solo queue, it had more to do with the fact that it got stagnant (practically the same patch for 5+ years does that) and Warmane didn't exactly market it aggressively either after they took over either.

I played there for nearly 6 years, I know that AT died due to the fact that solo queue made all rated PvP die out. Solo queue then eventually died out because there was nobody with xp playing.

That's why people want solo queue, they're bad at the game and can't find partners but with solo queue, they can just force players to play with them even when they see that they're bad. And if they leave, they lose rating and rewards from it.

It's a selfish idea and shouldn't happen at all.

Warmane is one huge money launderer and everybody who plays or played there knows it. Warmane didn't market it aggressively because they knew that it flopped.

[PuppetShowJustice]

Anyone who wants solo queue ranked arena is a spastic and doesnt actually understand arena.

I like to arena but I don't like to spend half my time convincing people to join me or doing the job application thing where people ask me about what my 3v3 score was three expansions ago. I just want to get in there and do 3v3. And honestly, what do you care? More participation means more hardcore people get end-of-season rewards and I get to have my fun and get a saddle out of it.

[shoegazing]

Solo Queue is a good idea, but it won't save ranked PvP by itself. We need better class design for that. These watered down Legion playstyles are super linear and boring.

[Pawstruck]

No. PVP in this game is a joke.

[Kuja]

The reason I have almost never done rated BGs is because I cba with the hassle to find a group for it manually.

So I wouldn't mind solo queueing, as long as the match making is more strict than in LFR so you don't get donalds from dark legacy into your team. So perhaps you shouldn't even be able to queue if you don't have enough PVP kills for example, or get matched with people that are as bad as you.

[Deleted]

Holinka invented a metric on which according to him Legion looks OK compared to WoD (number of players in the ladder after 12 weeks, that's what was said to be higher than in WoD). The metric is bogus, he should compare ladder sizes at the end of the season and on that metric Legion season 1 is a reduction to 60% that of WoD season 3, even lower if we compare to WoD season 1.

WoD Season Lengths:
S1 - 29 weeks
S2 - 20 weeks
S3 - 35 weeks

Legion S1 was 12 weeks long so comparing at week 12 makes sense, no? If you compare a 29 week season to a 12 week season then it only makes sense that more characters would be over the 1k rating threshold to count as a participating player.

[Ealyssa]

The comp is everything. Solo queue is the same terrible idea socially akward badies want for everything in this game be it raiding, dungeon or now PVP.

Learn to interact with people and to take critics when you are aweful, instead of asking for stupid bandaids that in the end wouldn't help you and that's why blizzard will more likely never introduce it.

[Saverem]

Also you seem to be under this illusion that solo queue would share a bracket with ordinary 3s, which is just absurd. It would be a separate bracket with separate achievements and titles.

So you want to break up arena into 3 parts now? Not gonna happen. The more parts its broken into the least people will be queueing for each one and the higher the queue times.

- - - Updated - - -

If you don't like it, don't use it.

I won't use it and neither will you because it's not going to happen.

[rda]

Legion S1 was 12 weeks long so comparing at week 12 makes sense, no? If you compare a 29 week season to a 12 week season then it only makes sense that more characters would be over the 1k rating threshold to count as a participating player.

No. If the season is 29 weeks old, there is no rush to enter within 12 weeks. If the season is 12 weeks old, you either enter or you are out. That's just one difference. It makes Legion numbers appear way better than they really are. (That's if Holinka actually saw those numbers and they are the way he says they are and he isn't nudging them a bit / interpolating them from some other numbers using his creative powers.)

[RelaZ]

So you want to break up arena into 3 parts now? Not gonna happen. The more parts its broken into the least people will be queueing for each one and the higher the queue times.

- - - Updated - - -)

It probably won't happen, but not because of the reasons you outlined. All other PvP games out there manage to have solo queue and standard game modes without it increasing the queue times to the point where the game is unplayable.

The reason PvP is dying is because Blizzard is putting zero effort it into it, which is also the reason this won't be implemented.

I played there for nearly 6 years, I know that AT died due to the fact that solo queue made all rated PvP die out. Solo queue then eventually died out because there was nobody with xp playing.

That's why people want solo queue, they're bad at the game and can't find partners but with solo queue, they can just force players to play with them even when they see that they're bad. And if they leave, they lose rating and rewards from it.

It's a selfish idea and shouldn't happen at all.

Warmane is one huge money launderer and everybody who plays or played there knows it. Warmane didn't market it aggressively because they knew that it flopped.

Lets agree to disagree, I believe the reason it died out was because it was getting stagnant (3.3.5 for 5+ years and no good marketing) and you think it was because of solo queue.

[Deleted]

This just proves how bad wow pvp actually is. When the rewards have been removed, people don't engage in rated pvp anymore because they don't actually like it and only did it for the rewards to use in wpvp and random bgs. Those who actually enjoy rated pvp, are a very slim minority.

[RelaZ]

This just proves how bad wow pvp actually is. When the rewards have been removed, people don't engage in rated pvp anymore because they don't actually like it and only did it for the rewards to use in wpvp and random bgs. Those who actually enjoy rated pvp, are a very slim minority.

Or it could be because they've destroyed the essence of competitive PvP and taken the fun out of it over the course of these two last expansions. But what do I know...

[Deleted]

It probably won't happen, but not because of the reasons you outlined. All other PvP games out there manage to have solo queue and standard game modes without it increasing the queue times to the point where the game is unplayable.

The reason PvP is dying is because Blizzard is putting zero effort it into it, which is also the reason this won't be implemented.



Lets agree to disagree, I believe the reason it died out was because it was getting stagnant (3.3.5 for 5+ years and no good marketing) and you think it was because of solo queue.

It can't get "stagnant", it's a private server that appeals to people who want to play a previous expansion. They go there knowing it won't change and no new patches will arrive.

And you won't even respond to my remark about it being a selfish idea because you know that it's actually very selfish and the only people it benefits are bad players who want to force others to carry them.

Solo queue is cancer, it'll introduce more autism pandering as it allows people to push rating in arenas without EVER having to communicate AT ALL. It'll be another big step in the direction of a world where nobody types or talks to each other.

That's what you guys want, isn't it? To do arenas without voice, without having to look for friends or talk to them because apparently your "anxiety" also happens online.

Just learn to socialize with other players, go to the duel zone outside Stormwind or Orgrimmar, join BGs and talk to players who are good and do arenas with them, go do World PvP and maybe you'll stumble across some player who's looking to slay some Horde or Alliance. That's how you obtain reliable arena partners to play with.

LFG is also cancerous and is pretty much a manual version of solo queue, believe it or not.

Build friendships that last for years, like we used to in the old days of WoW.

No more of this automatic MOBA crap that we have today.

[RelaZ]

It can't get "stagnant", it's a private server that appeals to people who want to play a previous expansion. They go there knowing it won't change and no new patches will arrive.

And you won't even respond to my remark about it being a selfish idea because you know that it's actually very selfish and the only people it benefits are bad players who want to force others to carry them.

Solo queue is cancer, it'll introduce more autism pandering as it allows people to push rating in arenas without EVER having to communicate AT ALL. It'll be another big step in the direction of a world where nobody types or talks to each other.

That's what you guys want, isn't it? To do arenas without voice, without having to look for friends or talk to them because apparently your "anxiety" also happens online.

Just learn to socialize with other players, go to the duel zone outside Stormwind or Orgrimmar, join BGs and talk to players who are good and do arenas with them, go do World PvP and maybe you'll stumble across some player who's looking to slay some Horde or Alliance. That's how you obtain reliable arena partners to play with.

LFG is also cancerous and is pretty much a manual version of solo queue, believe it or not.

Build friendships that last for years, like we used to in the old days of WoW.

No more of this automatic MOBA crap that we have today.

Yeah that's your opinion, all of it.

I can perfectly fine find partners on my own, otherwise I wouldn't even be playing competitive arena at all. That does not mean that I don't have dry spells where there are no people I'm going to play with (for various reasons) online or times where I want to try out new comps (consisting of classes whom my friends don't play for example) etc.

And no, stop this nonsense about finding people outside SW/Org. If that's where I found my partners I'd never have gotten higher than 2.2K. This is not AT, not everyone will stand in the same area (especially not in Legion). Not even on the most populated PvP realms are there enough people to build a large network of players (of similar skill to you) that way anymore. The only way you get partners in this game currently is by building a good network of partners via LFG and friends of friends, who found eachother via LFG or a long time ago before the PvP decline started.

If you remove LFG at this point arena will just die, probably within months. It's the only tool bringing PvPers of similar skill together, and even then they don't play together because of trust issues (i.e "are you really as good as you say you are, I dont believe you") - that's what solo queue would solve (also lots of new/old PvP players would start playing because of the obvious reasons).

Also what's to say you can't form friendships in Solo queue? I've found multiple players I've started playing "standard" with through solo queue in other games.

Again, I'm 100% convinced AT died out because it was on the same patch for 5+ years. Those who wanted to try it out had already done so (because of no/bad marketing), and grown bored (because it's stagnant). The flow of people in was/is lower than the flow of people out. ATs death was independent of solo queue, solo queue only allowed it to "live" a bit longer.