1. #1

    Best Legendaries for Resto?

    Help! I abruptly got 2 new legendaries drop for me in a single day and I'm suddenly overwhelmed by choices! Struggling between which are the best legendaries for my spec and which provide the biggest stat increase while maintaining my 4pc set bonus. Without saying what legendaries I have I just wanted to see if there was consensus on what the best two legendaries for resto shaman raiding are.

  2. #2
    Jonat and Velen's worked best for me in terms of throughput, and hps performance.

    Recently picked up tidecallers, which I am trying out. Works well with Echo for HST uptime, HTT extra heal is often overheal in current fights, SLT uptime is nice though.

    Overall I prefer the ring and trinket, seems to fit my playstyle, but ultimately it's up to you. Depends massively on your talent choice, the fight, your role within the healing team etc

    Currently 8/10 mythic

  3. #3
    Dreadlord ItsTiddles's Avatar
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    Depends on the fight.

    Overall the ring is generally go-to BiS if, assuming you can weave your HW/CH.
    The legs are extremely good for longer fights and there is a little extra for your CBT if you run it. (bonus points to stats)
    Gloves have really good synergy with the tier, but it also is a pretty big buff to HT/SLT. Our trait for HT increasing every tick makes the last couple seconds super powerful. The benefit it gives to SLT can vary on the fight, depending on how long you actually need it.
    Trinket is extremely good if you can get good usage out of it. We have many CDs to line it up. (bonus points to stats)

    Personally I really like the boots, but they're not always mana efficient. They will probably be higher on priority with Tomb tier, though.

    My Shaman Signature by Winter Blossom

  4. #4
    Boots can be really sweet if you can get a high uptime on your healing rain with the majority of the raid in it (Elisande etc.)

  5. #5
    You have to consider two things: stats budget and effect.
    As you may know, slots have a different budget and as legendaries are 940ilvl, having them on big budget slots is better. That is, large amount of throughput stats and if possible, the right ones (mastery/crit). So for stats, Legs, Velen, Prydaz, Helm are very good. Rings don't have main stat and other slots have weak secondary stats.

    Then, valuable effects for raiding:
    - Legs are very good at ~100kHPS. You'll never target yourself again with them.
    - Velen is very good as 15% healing on a short CD can be lined up with AG/HTT and shaman healing is very CD dependant.
    - Prydaz is good on progress and absorbs count as healing
    - Gloves are good and synergize (weakly) with T19. Cumulative upkeep trait makes them a solid boost for HTT, so consider wearing them only if you can fit several HTT during the fight (not on farm, and depends on healing CD sync in your raid). Also if you're a troll.
    - Boots doesn't work with Healing Rain itself, so it really depends on the fight. Might become better with T20.
    - Helm: very good on the rare fights where your raid uses BL during a damage intensive phase (Botanist ?)
    - Jonat: only a good analysis of your logs will reveal its true value. You can do something like #(HS+HW)/#CH for the average bonus per CH, then consider the part of CH in your healing. For example on a typical fight I cast 40 HW and 30 CH, making it a 13% bonus, on CH representing 25% of my total healing. So Jonat effect is about 3% of my healing *theoretically*. In practice, it's better if you line up 5 stack casts with CDs and Unleash.
    - Bracers: 50% is still not enough to sustain CH/HS weaving
    - Belt: if your raid is under 40% you need more HPS than Riptide spam
    - Sephuz is not reliable on most boss fights


    So there you go. I have them all and usually wear Legs+Velen.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by TigerTiddles View Post
    Depends on the fight.
    Overall the ring is generally go-to BiS if, assuming you can weave your HW/CH.
    The problem is that, assuming you are aiming for maximum hps in a mythic raid, the bosses where you actually heal in this way are rather rare. Most of the time you would want to run the full chainheal build and weave to little in order for jonat to become bis. Other times you are going the ascendance build and heal to little with chainheal. Combined with the rather pityfull stat upgrade it offeres compared to other legendaries, it just is not bis on many bosses. (If i had it I would wear it on spellblade and tichondrius only)

    And this more or less brings us to the same argument that most of the posters already had. Legs, jonats, gloves and velens can all be bis according to whichever fight you are looking at.

    In very fringe scenarios the helmet can also be bis, but you'd need either a really, really short fight or a phase of healing which is insanely more intense than the rest of the bossfight coupled with the fact that ht is active...not very likely. This can however help you in progress, if your healing team is struggling in a particular phase where ht is active (Botanist comes to mind)

    Boots are not bis at all. It is simply not possible to have an hr uptime of more than 60-70% while not gimping your healing. Since the other legendaries all do around 4-7%, coupled with the fact that the boots do not affect healing rain healing itself, you would basically need the whole raid aka all 20 people to be standing in it the whole fight, just to have a chance at competing with the other bis legendaries. Theoretically possible but there is not a single nighthold boss where they are truely bis.

    A special mention goes to prydaz, which is basically never bis but does not fluctuate much from boss to boss, meaning it is very very good (but not bis) on any bossfight in current nighthold. If you don't have the bis legendaries for any given boss, or are to lazy to swap, prydaz is a solid choice not trailing much behind the bis stuff. It also often helps with fails on progress fights, especially when maximum hps is not much of an issue.

    It is also necessary to mention that, if you are running an ascendance build, velens becomes the bis legendary by default. Usually you are using the trinket for the increased healing and the stats, not for the overheal proc. The overheal you do during ascendance however pushes that proc by a solid 1.5-3% of your total healing.

    All of the above is only applicable for a mythic raid healing scenario in which you want to do the maximum hps. If you are struggling with a specific encounter part or your healing team is lacking in specific areas, different legendaries can be the "more correct" choice if you want to kill the boss.
    And the legendary choice in a mythic+ or a small 10 man raid is different alltogether.

    Edit: Please, whatever content a resto shaman is doing, the bracers are always garbage
    Last edited by Themi; 2017-05-17 at 03:37 PM.

  7. #7
    I run prydaz/jonats most of the time for raids. Prydaz/Legs for M+

  8. #8
    The boots are really good for like Skorpyron, Krosus, Elisande and Gul'dan.

  9. #9
    Keyboard Turner Ren009's Avatar
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    From the Resto Shaman Discord channel (Credit to Seksixeny)

    This list is pretty agreed upon for Raiding purposes as of 7.2. Things are more flexible in Mythic+ with the most popular options Neck+Legs for max Survivability. Sephuz haste boost is quite strong with good stun utilization, Gloves/Helm are useful as well.

    Top Tier:

    Legs - They usually show up as ~5% HPS in a fight, are 100k HPS per second when they are working which feeds into AG/CBT and have the best stats out of all legendary items in 7.2.

    --
    Velens - 1:15 min cd allows for it to be used on cooldown with HTT and AG combos giving +15% and the overheal effect to our main lifesavers, plus amazing stats.

    ---

    Prydaz - The absorb shield can save your life against one shots and does ~5% HPS in a fight taking pressure off healing and it has amazing stats.

    ----

    Gloves - Due to cumulative upkeep the extra 2 seconds will make your HTT much stronger than the baseline extra 20% duration implies and it improves spells we use a lot, the stats are good but not stellar.

    ---
    Jonat - If you rely on CH a lot / high tide this is one of the best legendaries as it allows your CH to hit that much harder as long as you use your tidal waves in between casts, this effect is powerful enough that Jonat is a top legendary even after nerf to 10% CH boost per stack and considering its bad stats by comparison with the rest.
    --


    MIDDLE TIER:
    Head - amazing or terrible depending on fight, but mostly hero is used for dps purposes at the start, when there is no dmg, good stats.
    ---
    Boots - +10% hps isn't applied to rain itself and many spells wont hit the ppl in rain, low item budget.
    ---
    Belt - can be good but if ppl are so low that u can spam riptide u usually want to use raid cooldowns or chain heal/healing surge, also it has bad stats.
    ---
    Sephuz - hard to proc but the baseline 2% haste and 10% move speed are very strong in 7.2 even without mastery.
    Bracers - Upgraded from 30% to 50% mana reduction on surge is a nice boost but the healing benefit it offers you against just using a normal wave after using CH does not justify a top spot, also has low item budge

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Ren009 View Post
    From the Resto Shaman Discord channel (Credit to Seksixeny)

    This list is pretty agreed upon for Raiding purposes as of 7.2. Things are more flexible in Mythic+ with the most popular options Neck+Legs for max Survivability. Sephuz haste boost is quite strong with good stun utilization, Gloves/Helm are useful as well.

    Top Tier:

    Legs - They usually show up as ~5% HPS in a fight, are 100k HPS per second when they are working which feeds into AG/CBT and have the best stats out of all legendary items in 7.2.

    --
    Velens - 1:15 min cd allows for it to be used on cooldown with HTT and AG combos giving +15% and the overheal effect to our main lifesavers, plus amazing stats.

    ---

    Prydaz - The absorb shield can save your life against one shots and does ~5% HPS in a fight taking pressure off healing and it has amazing stats.

    ----

    Gloves - Due to cumulative upkeep the extra 2 seconds will make your HTT much stronger than the baseline extra 20% duration implies and it improves spells we use a lot, the stats are good but not stellar.

    ---
    Jonat - If you rely on CH a lot / high tide this is one of the best legendaries as it allows your CH to hit that much harder as long as you use your tidal waves in between casts, this effect is powerful enough that Jonat is a top legendary even after nerf to 10% CH boost per stack and considering its bad stats by comparison with the rest.
    --


    MIDDLE TIER:
    Head - amazing or terrible depending on fight, but mostly hero is used for dps purposes at the start, when there is no dmg, good stats.
    ---
    Boots - +10% hps isn't applied to rain itself and many spells wont hit the ppl in rain, low item budget.
    ---
    Belt - can be good but if ppl are so low that u can spam riptide u usually want to use raid cooldowns or chain heal/healing surge, also it has bad stats.
    ---
    Sephuz - hard to proc but the baseline 2% haste and 10% move speed are very strong in 7.2 even without mastery.
    Bracers - Upgraded from 30% to 50% mana reduction on surge is a nice boost but the healing benefit it offers you against just using a normal wave after using CH does not justify a top spot, also has low item budge
    personally i disagree. legs are dogshit and the hps increase is only your self healing unless you take cbt, even then i very much doubt it is 5% increase hps increase. Velens on the other hand is amazing for the reasons above. boots are top tier for me espesically on stacking fights, just as an example: healing rain, Gotq =10% more healing then gotq procs again for another 10% healing so thats a 20% for 1 spell if you have the newer trait talents.

    Imo i normally combo trinket as a must with either head/feet/gloves depending on the fight (progressing mythic elisande currently)

    Currently have every resto shammy legendary. and have tried them all.

    Overall however it depends on individual play style: U want to go purely on HPS even though some heals you perform arent useful? take legs and CBT and do 40% overhealing.

    Want your heals to count? dont bother with cbt + legs unless u are on a constant ticking damage fight with alot of stacking. any questions on my views or want some resto shammy advice? feel free to PM me

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Suo View Post
    personally i disagree. legs are dogshit and the hps increase is only your self healing unless you take cbt, even then i very much doubt it is 5% increase hps increase. Velens on the other hand is amazing for the reasons above. boots are top tier for me espesically on stacking fights, just as an example: healing rain, Gotq =10% more healing then gotq procs again for another 10% healing so thats a 20% for 1 spell if you have the newer trait talents.

    Imo i normally combo trinket as a must with either head/feet/gloves depending on the fight (progressing mythic elisande currently)

    Currently have every resto shammy legendary. and have tried them all.

    Overall however it depends on individual play style: U want to go purely on HPS even though some heals you perform arent useful? take legs and CBT and do 40% overhealing.

    Want your heals to count? dont bother with cbt + legs unless u are on a constant ticking damage fight with alot of stacking. any questions on my views or want some resto shammy advice? feel free to PM me
    That is some awful logic right there.
    Let's have a look at legs vs. boots. First let's have a look at stats in comparison to a 905 piece for each slot. For the sake of simplicity we'll assume a character with ~50000 int (around 910-915 itemlvl) and look at the 2nd stats as if they were all versatility, for the sake of a rough estimation.

    Compared to a 905 item the legs give you 877 int and 894 2nd stats.
    The boots give you 657 int and 177 2nd stats.

    So a net gain from the legs vs. boots of 220 int and 717 2nd stats. In versatility (So the worst stat, in fact you will gain better stats) this would thus translate to 0.44% from the int and 1.51% from the 2nd stats. That means without even taking the effect into account AT ALL, the legs are already leading by 1.95% in healing.
    A normal healing rain uptime would be something between 50-65%, maximum 70%. But let's say you have it down when it counts, so let's go with 80% uptime during the healing in order to offset the fact that more of your healing is done in phases where hr is down (as you have it down when it counts). Your hr itself should then be doing around 10-15% of your healing(which does not get buffed by the boots). Let's go with 12.5. This would then mean the boots would push your healing by (0.8*0.875)*0.1*peopleinside/20. Let's say it is a stackable fight, so on average 18 out of 20 people are inside. That gives us a healing increase of 5.6% in a fringe healing scenario which totally caters to healing rain. Basically the more or less best scenario possible.
    Quite honestly if your raid manages to have 18 people standing in your hr at all times then i really envy you. On most boss fights our raid would maybe manage like 10-12.

    If we substract the 1.95% healing from the stats, the legs need to do 3.65% of your healing in order to be better.
    Edit: The 3.65% I had before are not correct since the logs show healing including legendaries. Basically, if the base healing is x, then boots do 1.056*x= new overall healing. The logs would thus need to show (1-y)*1.056=1.0195 -> y=0.0346 or 3.46% healing in order for the legs to be better.

    This means I just need to show you a log which shows the legs at 3.46% of overall shaman healing. (And I'm omitting cloudburst healing in this calculation)

    So let's go with the current elisande toplog for a fight with nealry always incoming damag pattern
    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ing&source=101
    Or the current #4 skorpyron log
    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...aling&source=6

    As for a fight with less consistent incoming damage, there are even top trilliax logs which go above 3.45% healing:
    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ing&source=101


    Now your argument remains, that this is "useless" healing or overhealing. The thing however is that if you need the healing (aka you are not at 100%), then it is not wasted and does not need to be healed by other means. If there is persistant or semi-persistant damage, so basically any scenario where you are healing 100% of the time, it is flat out useful healing.
    The only scenario in which this would be the case would be extremely short burst windows followed by a really long time to heal up again.
    The thing is however, that the trinket, jonat's, prydaz and the gloves perform better in those scenarios without the need of 18 people being able to stand in your hr. The legs also give you a retarded 120k hps (assuming 4 mil life) on yourself during those short phases. That means we are always talking about burst windows where you have >2.14mill hps.

    Have I even mentioned that the leg effect(not the part you get from stats) does not cost any mana while maintaining the boot effect does? Or the fact that that if you take earthen shield, the effect of the boots drops yet again? Or the fact that the leg effect itself(not the part you get from stats) scales only with your health and incoming damage, allowing a not as good as those logs above player to gain an even greater edge when using the legs?

    Yes, there are some boss fights where the legs are certainly not the best. But the scenario where boots are best is a very very specif one, not present in any nighthold encounters
    Last edited by Themi; 2017-05-20 at 12:58 AM.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Themi View Post
    That is some awful logic right there.
    Let's have a look at legs vs. boots. First let's have a look at stats in comparison to a 905 piece for each slot. For the sake of simplicity we'll assume a character with ~50000 int (around 910-915 itemlvl) and look at the 2nd stats as if they were all versatility, for the sake of a rough estimation.

    Compared to a 905 item the legs give you 877 int and 894 2nd stats.
    The boots give you 657 int and 177 2nd stats.

    So a net gain from the legs vs. boots of 220 int and 717 2nd stats. In versatility (So the worst stat, in fact you will gain better stats) this would thus translate to 0.44% from the int and 1.51% from the 2nd stats. That means without even taking the effect into account AT ALL, the legs are already leading by 1.95% in healing.
    A normal healing rain uptime would be something between 50-65%, maximum 70%. But let's say you have it down when it counts, so let's go with 80% uptime during the healing in order to offset the fact that more of your healing is done in phases where hr is down (as you have it down when it counts). Your hr itself should then be doing around 10-15% of your healing(which does not get buffed by the boots). Let's go with 12.5. This would then mean the boots would push your healing by (0.8*0.875)*0.1*peopleinside/20. Let's say it is a stackable fight, so on average 18 out of 20 people are inside. That gives us a healing increase of 5.6% in a fringe healing scenario which totally caters to healing rain. Basically the more or less best scenario possible.
    Quite honestly if your raid manages to have 18 people standing in your hr at all times then i really envy you. On most boss fights our raid would maybe manage like 10-12.

    If we substract the 1.95% healing from the stats, the legs need to do 3.65% of your healing in order to be better.
    Edit: The 3.65% I had before are not correct since the logs show healing including legendaries. Basically, if the base healing is x, then boots do 1.056*x= new overall healing. The logs would thus need to show (1-y)*1.056=1.0195 -> y=0.0346 or 3.46% healing in order for the legs to be better.

    This means I just need to show you a log which shows the legs at 3.46% of overall shaman healing. (And I'm omitting cloudburst healing in this calculation)

    So let's go with the current elisande toplog for a fight with nealry always incoming damag pattern
    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ing&source=101
    Or the current #4 skorpyron log
    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...aling&source=6

    As for a fight with less consistent incoming damage, there are even top trilliax logs which go above 3.45% healing:
    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ing&source=101


    Now your argument remains, that this is "useless" healing or overhealing. The thing however is that if you need the healing (aka you are not at 100%), then it is not wasted and does not need to be healed by other means. If there is persistant or semi-persistant damage, so basically any scenario where you are healing 100% of the time, it is flat out useful healing.
    The only scenario in which this would be the case would be extremely short burst windows followed by a really long time to heal up again.
    The thing is however, that the trinket, jonat's, prydaz and the gloves perform better in those scenarios without the need of 18 people being able to stand in your hr. The legs also give you a retarded 120k hps (assuming 4 mil life) on yourself during those short phases. That means we are always talking about burst windows where you have >2.14mill hps.

    Have I even mentioned that the leg effect(not the part you get from stats) does not cost any mana while maintaining the boot effect does? Or the fact that that if you take earthen shield, the effect of the boots drops yet again? Or the fact that the leg effect itself(not the part you get from stats) scales only with your health and incoming damage, allowing a not as good as those logs above player to gain an even greater edge when using the legs?

    Yes, there are some boss fights where the legs are certainly not the best. But the scenario where boots are best is a very very specif one, not present in any nighthold encounters
    well thanks for your opinion. i will consider this theory craft.. although these are just rough ideas, on progress fights all this theory means nothing when most of the time it cannot be put to practice 100% because we are human - we make mistakes.. legs are just not for me, they are a boring passive which has no real immediate or interesting effects on playstyle. also the resto shaman log on mythic elisande you've just given an example of is being 2 healed, currently we are 3/4 healing it

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Suo View Post
    just as an example: healing rain, Gotq =10% more healing then gotq procs again for another 10% healing so thats a 20% for 1 spell if you have the newer trait talents.
    i just died

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Suo View Post
    well thanks for your opinion. i will consider this theory craft.. although these are just rough ideas, on progress fights all this theory means nothing when most of the time it cannot be put to practice 100% because we are human - we make mistakes.. legs are just not for me, they are a boring passive which has no real immediate or interesting effects on playstyle. also the resto shaman log on mythic elisande you've just given an example of is being 2 healed, currently we are 3/4 healing it
    But that's just the thing...and please don't take this as a personal affront, I myself am not able to push out as much hps as the guys in the logs i posted and make MANY mistakes during actual play....the worse you and/or your teammates play, the more errors you do, the better a passive legendary like the legs become.
    The calculation for boots is done in a way which needs you to perfectly have healing rain down at all times and all of your teammates reacting aka standing in it. This especially rings through for a fight like elisande where you can potentially often stand in in but are not stacked enough most of the fight for the players to automatically stand in it. E.g. during the ability with arrows- forgot its name- it is theoretically possible for most of the raid to be standing in hr, but the positioning is rather hard to do.
    The incoming damage is -apart from avoidable stuff- fixed and thus the leg healing is more or less fixed. Unless you are instantly always the first person to be spamhealed during any situation. It is easy to say to your druid "give the rejuv to somebody else first" and let the legs to some work. If you know you'll get healed automatically you can easily prioritize someone else first.

    Here is an elisande log which is 4 healed (it's korean or something but you can guess from the symbol which line is the legs)
    https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...ling&source=18

    Now all that being said, we are talking in the range of 2-3% healing output difference. Having to sneeze twice during a raid encounter may cost you the same amount of hps....
    So if you personally cannot stand the legs at all, then feel free to use whatever else legendary, it will probably not make much of a difference in your ability to kill bosses.
    But if somebody askes which is the best legendary, boots is not the answer in 98 out of a 100 fights.

  15. #15
    Yep,
    I personally love the Legs, the mix of stats and output is great!

    Here's my logs for our 1st M-Elisande kill:

    1st kills always a little extra hectic, and a lot of extra/unnecessary movement etc.
    Still managed to end up being 4.39% of total output.
    And M-Elisande is one of the most movement heavy fights, with Rings, baiting Singularities etc.

  16. #16
    Legs are top tier. Why you would even contest the ~5% hps they provide, as every log having them proves it ?

    Besides, Legs also effect your playstyle and make you a better player. You should mostly stop healing yourself and position better to avoid useless moving (which is a very common flaw). The healing it provides is real healing, feeding CBT being only a very minor part of it.

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