So is BrMs getting nerfed next patch?

[SupBrah]

Brm was better than guardian :S

Lies. Bear is a complete OP faceroll this expac. To the point where raids were solo-tanking mythic Gul'dan with bears

To be a great brewmaster takes at least some effort, while you almost just drool on the keyboard and be a great bear.

[Deleted]

Lies. Bear is a complete OP faceroll this expac. To the point where raids were solo-tanking mythic Gul'dan with bears

To be a great brewmaster takes at least some effort, while you almost just drool on the keyboard and be a great bear.

Not to mention that my friend guardian does 800k+ dps in m+

[Grobovshik]

Not to mention that my friend guardian does 800k+ dps in m+

That two thrash legos are retarded. Are they going to change them in 7.2.5?

[ReD-EyeD]

Brm was better than guardian :S

That is simply not true. At all. There is a big difference between being an omnipotent powerhouse and cheesing mechanics on certain bosses.

[Soulwell]

Lies. Bear is a complete OP faceroll this expac. To the point where raids were solo-tanking mythic Gul'dan with bears

To be a great brewmaster takes at least some effort, while you almost just drool on the keyboard and be a great bear.

Guldan wasn't solo tanked, fel-sycthe was solo soaked in p1/2. And being good at brm is just having legendaries and pressing keys as fast as you can but since you clearly don't play either spec idk why you're shit talking.

That is simply not true. At all. There is a big difference between being an omnipotent powerhouse and cheesing mechanics on certain bosses.

Eh, the bosses and mechanics they cheesed made it possible for early kills.

[ReD-EyeD]

Eh, the bosses and mechanics they cheesed made it possible for early kills.

Well, obviously. They wouldn't do it if it wasn't effective, but it is still a cheese and a question to the encounter in general.

[BannedForViews]

But tank dps isn't important right?

It isn't important in that tank should be sacrificng survivability on progression content to do more damage. Yes, one could argue that you only need so much survivability that your healers finish fights oom and you are barely alive, but that ignores all sorts of unpredictable outcomes and will most certainly result in more wipes than necessary. Anyway, I never said tank dps doesn't matter. If you are given the chose of any similar spec and one clearly does more damage, whether it's dps, healer, or tank, you will chose the one that does more damage for obvious reasons. What I did say is that people who sacrifice survivability on progression content specifically to do more damage, ESPECIALLY when that damage isn't necessary for beating an enrage timer, are stupid people who are wasting the time of the other 18-19 raiders in their group with their greed for dps. If you can comfortably tank content while doing more damage, by all means do so, but there are far too many tanks out there who are gearing dps first without giving more consideration to the fact that no one gives a fuck about how much damage you do because it's a pathetic amount compared to actual dps classes.

[Deleted]

wonder how many of those players post in mmo-c, since theres only like what 45 people who are going to be competing for world first this time around?

I still feel BrM are going to be a top tank, if not maybe the top tank with how AA damage is going to be such an dramatic part of the incoming damage for tomb.

but will have to wait and see.

All of them?

[Grobovshik]

no one gives a fuck about how much damage you do because it's a pathetic amount compared to actual dps classes.

Ive seen green/grey logs baddies complained about being outdamaged by 99% tank parselords.

[BannedForViews]

Ive seen green/grey logs baddies complained about being outdamaged by 99% tank parselords.

Those green/grey baddies aren't in raids with 99% tank parselords. The people in the raids with 99% tanks are still mopping the floor with them, and the tank dps is not needed for the manner in which content is being cleared. I'm not going to argue about this anymore. Tank DPS matters, but compared to the job of the tank, which is staying alive, it matters very little. Most groups would rather have a tank that never dies but is a 50% parser than a tank who is causing wipes in his quest for orange. There were only 2 bosses in NH that at any point required tanks to maximize their damage, and they didn't do it at the expensive of their survivability, because both of those bosses hit fucking hard. If you're ever risking death by reducing your survivability just to do 10-20k more dps, you're doing it wrong, and you should reroll to a fucking dps spec.

[Tech614]

Tank DPS matters, but compared to the job of the tank, which is staying alive, it matters very little.

Uhh, there are very few choices anymore that lower your dps for the purpose of survival. Really the only main one would be VDH having CDs that are both offensive and defensive and wasting the defensive portions to do max dps.

Especially for a brewmaster or bear, very little to no sacrifice of survival has to be made to do "parse lord" dps. Your argument is nonsensical, and when I form PUG groups on my alts I will always kick some tank who is doing worthless dps the same as I would a dps. If I invite a tank to my group who can only manage to to half of my dps(my tanks dps) at a similar ilvl he is 100% getting kicked. Attitudes like this just encourage tanks to be lazy and bad at the game.

[Deleted]

At least for brewmasters that is simply wrong. There isn't a single reason to ever run blackout combo with empowered tiger palms outside of DPS. And in comparison to high tolerance it's a significant loss of survivability. Not saying you can't cheese with boc and empowered brews, but 99% of the time that's not the reason this talent is taken.

[Grobovshik]

Playing w/o boc is too boring. I cant imagine playing w/o it.

[TwoWaffles]

If they still plan to go through with only 10 healing spheres per engagement, it makes the recently buffed Gift of The Mists to be completely useless.

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At least for brewmasters that is simply wrong. There isn't a single reason to ever run blackout combo with empowered tiger palms outside of DPS. And in comparison to high tolerance it's a significant loss of survivability. Not saying you can't cheese with boc and empowered brews, but 99% of the time that's not the reason this talent is taken.

Cheese falls into your lap, what do you do?

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That is simply not true. At all. There is a big difference between being an omnipotent powerhouse and cheesing mechanics on certain bosses.

What can Guardian druids do that a BRM can't? 10/10M Brm Here.

[Grobovshik]

What can Guardian druids do that a BRM can't? 10/10M Brm Here.

Retarded aoe. Gear scaling fixed tank balance long ago. Even VDH+BDK can do everything w/o problems.

[TwoWaffles]

Retarded aoe. Gear scaling fixed tank balance long ago. Even VDH+BDK can do everything w/o problems.

You have any logs to post for "Retarded aoe"?

10/10M Monk here, in the AOE situations. I'de argue BRM would out dps a guardian druid, at least I do. In situations like fortified/High M+ where thrash can stack up to 5 ( assuming Luffa Wrappings and Elize's Everlasting Encasement ) would be debatable. I also play Guardian .

[Grobovshik]

You have any logs to post for "Retarded aoe"?

10/10M Monk here, in the AOE situations. I'de argue BRM would out dps a guardian druid, at least I do. In situations like fortified/High M+ where thrash can stack up to 5 ( assuming Luffa Wrappings and Elize's Everlasting Encasement ) would be debatable. I also play Guardian .

Aluriel/Elisande adds cleave. Hell, they even can get crazy aoe damage in short situations (on Krosus adds). As a monk you cant probably only compete with RJW, but your st would be gimped without Special Delivery.

[ReD-EyeD]

What can Guardian druids do that a BRM can't? 10/10M Brm Here.

I would really want to answer that question with something specific, but it is really just "being better at everything". They're easier to heal, they mitigate more, they have more utility, they heal for much more too, they're good at both physical and magical damage and big damage spikes. The only thing that monks are better at is mobility and it's really not that important in most cases. To answer your question you probably would need a healer opinion more than a tank's one.

And as I said above already tanking balance overall is very good right now and there is nothing that one class can do that others can't (not talking about extremes tho like brm tanking botanic or warrior tanking krosus). Some classes are just better at "quality of life".

[Saverem]

Not to mention that my friend guardian does 800k+ dps in m+

Is this ST? Because 800k DPS isn't hard to get on trash packs.

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I would really want to answer that question with something specific, but it is really just "being better at everything". They're easier to heal, they mitigate more, they have more utility, they heal for much more too, they're good at both physical and magical damage and big damage spikes. The only thing that monks are better at is mobility and it's really not that important in most cases. To answer your question you probably would need a healer opinion more than a tank's one.

And as I said above already tanking balance overall is very good right now and there is nothing that one class can do that others can't (not talking about extremes tho like brm tanking botanic or warrior tanking krosus). Some classes are just better at "quality of life".

"utility" is a very general term, to me it means abilities that doesn't only benefit your character, but the entire grp/raid. I think for tanks, mobility is also utility. For instance, fights like Elisande or Gul'dan where Transcendence teleport will let you bypass mechanics and get right back on the boss is pretty useful for the entire raid to have as a tank. The Dave statue that taunts all the bats to one area in Tich is pretty dang useful utility.

[ReD-EyeD]

"utility" is a very general term, to me it means abilities that doesn't only benefit your character, but the entire grp/raid. I think for tanks, mobility is also utility. For instance, fights like Elisande or Gul'dan where Transcendence teleport will let you bypass mechanics and get right back on the boss is pretty useful for the entire raid to have as a tank. The Dave statue that taunts all the bats to one area in Tich is pretty dang useful utility.

I agree, but you can't really compare them directly and savage roar is still one of the best raid utility skills in the game.