1. #7601
    Please wait Temp name's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    Since bioware isn't a standalone developer - EA's CEO (it's hilarious how you jumped right to the EA CEOs bypassing bioware CEO, but it doesn't matter for argument sake) are definitely responsible for Bioware making a shit game, because they are, you know, in charge of things. You do remember, that because of Söderlund bioware had to use Frostbite engine, and the game became what it is, because Bioware tried to appeal to Söderlund, because they were afraid that the game will be scrapped if he won't like it.

    Yeah, just cut Söderlunds salary in half and call it a day (except, he left the sinking ship iirc), "lower level staff" shouldn't get cuts, like, ever in game development
    Maybe if they unionized they wouldn't be treated like shit, but, you know.. Unions are evil, or something

  2. #7602
    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    Since bioware isn't a standalone developer - EA's CEO (it's hilarious how you jumped right to the EA CEOs bypassing bioware CEO, but it doesn't matter for argument sake) are definitely responsible for Bioware making a shit game, because they are, you know, in charge of things. You do remember, that because of Söderlund bioware had to use Frostbite engine, and the game became what it is, because Bioware tried to appeal to Söderlund, because they were afraid that the game will be scrapped if he won't like it.

    Yeah, just cut Söderlunds salary in half and call it a day (except, he left the sinking ship iirc), "lower level staff" shouldn't get cuts, like, ever in game development
    I jumped to EA's CEO because it was about cuts for EA personal. Bioware's CEO doesn't deserve any bonus at all.

    From what we know Bioware was given a lot of freedom in making Anthem. They chose to use Frostbite as per their own statement.
    Bioware made the loot ect.

    I don't blame EA for Bioware fucking up Anthem if they were pretty hands off, which by all the accounts I have seen they were.
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  3. #7603
    Quote Originally Posted by Lythelia View Post
    Haven't been keeping too close an eye on Anthem, just what Bellular has been talking about it. Just from that alone I am so glad I never invested any amount of time or money in it.
    I used to be ok with bells vids, hes always been kinda crap at game review but was alright at industry stuff. Thought the news channel would be a better fit but the way he covered anthem and other games was pretty much just him regurgitating every over hyped issue and letting whatever the current controversy was create his opinion. I would not use him as an objective source of info.

    Game offers a unique experience, just not a lot of it. Whether or not thats good enough is up to you, I got 200hrs out of the game before I stopped and will definitely pop back in when they drop something more substantial. Enjoyed my time got my moneys worth, moved on and waiting for the next bit like a stable human being.
    "I've carefully played this game to an endless despair"

  4. #7604
    Quote Originally Posted by Baconeggcheese View Post
    I used to be ok with bells vids, hes always been kinda crap at game review but was alright at industry stuff. Thought the news channel would be a better fit but the way he covered anthem and other games was pretty much just him regurgitating every over hyped issue and letting whatever the current controversy was create his opinion. I would not use him as an objective source of info.

    Game offers a unique experience, just not a lot of it. Whether or not thats good enough is up to you, I got 200hrs out of the game before I stopped and will definitely pop back in when they drop something more substantial. Enjoyed my time got my moneys worth, moved on and waiting for the next bit like a stable human being.
    Genuine question, have you basically spent 180 hours doing the same 3 dungeons/strongholds over and over? Assuming 10-20 hours to completely wipe out all main content/story, etc.

  5. #7605
    Quote Originally Posted by Shinzai View Post
    Genuine question, have you basically spent 180 hours doing the same 3 dungeons/strongholds over and over? Assuming 10-20 hours to completely wipe out all main content/story, etc.
    I'm only 135 hours in, about 30 hours I spent on the main campaign (including all side mission and little stories around Fort Tarsis) and most of the rest of that time has been spent doing the Contracts. Typically I'd do the three elite contracts every night, usually I'd do one of the Strongholds (sadly had to stop doing Heart of Rage because of people quitting out before the last boss) and then either another Stronghold or mess around with Freeplay.

  6. #7606
    Quote Originally Posted by Dhrizzle View Post
    I'm only 135 hours in, about 30 hours I spent on the main campaign (including all side mission and little stories around Fort Tarsis) and most of the rest of that time has been spent doing the Contracts. Typically I'd do the three elite contracts every night, usually I'd do one of the Strongholds (sadly had to stop doing Heart of Rage because of people quitting out before the last boss) and then either another Stronghold or mess around with Freeplay.
    Less people are quitting out at monitor on heart of rage now. They tweaked his health so its a lot less of a brutal slog it used to be and with reasonable drops and elysium chests people mostly have been sticking with it which has been nice. I still log in for an hour or two almost every night and still find the game enjoyable but the loot system is beyond fucked up. For a week or so I was getting legendary drops almost every stronghold so there was progression and it felt good. Then they did a minor patch and since then it is just blues and purples. Even master works are basically not even worth looking at for me these days.

  7. #7607
    Quote Originally Posted by Baconeggcheese View Post
    As far as we've seen its just that they lack leadership, and lord knows that's one of the hardest things to get since the people in those prominent positions aren't going to see themselves as the issue and step aside / down or likely even change meaningfully until its too late.

    This right here has given me a tiny bit of hope back: https://twitter.com/Darokaz/status/1121515693592150016

    I appreciate that he's being candid, I also had the tinfoil hat that maybe they're working on stuff a bit more intently right now as that's usually when these devs go silent and that was even the case with Anthem with prior patches where they were communicating literally all day every day then would go silent for 1-2 days and the community would lose their shit and then we'd find out it was right before they were about to deploy something and so they didn't want to talk at all until they had the answer.

    I guess we've just reached that point where the main issues aren't going to have a timely fix and they likely don't have that answer hence the silence. Still, I really appreciate that tweet where he is very human and owns it.
    Lack of leadership is no doubt just one of bioware current major issues and seems to have been for a rather long time and something that doesn't seem to be fixed enough to make any real difference but you are right. People in leadership roles rarely if ever want to take the heat and be the ones wrong and I get that very vibe from that tweet.

    He refers back to that awful reddit post. Not counting that horribly worded opening line about early access release, the whole thing just comes across as stringing the players along. Like I said above, the line of, "While we have delivered many of the Act 1 features on time..." is just complete garbage and untrue and the rest is just carrot on a stick garbage with no time or date for anything, pretending to have the "oh we are listening" common phrase every "F"ed up game company makes after teh shit hit the fans. Makes me think that management is still "F"ed up there. Meaning to me it's very likely jesse anderson is just placating the community. giving them what they want to hear as community managers do. A poor attempt to calm things down because damn I didn't think it could get any uglier around anthem and just how bad this whole train wreck has been.

    If it turns out he was just being candid and can actually put words to actions thats a good thing but I didn't get any semblance of hope from his tweet. Wasn't it just cute normal anderson behind closed doors would just laugh and joke about the shitty loot but he spared us because apparently only the community hates it. To him it's just funny. Ugh....

    Of course at this point it's a time will tell kinda thing but I really think the damage has been so bad to the anthem IP and it will take much longer than gamers care to wait that anthem will not make a solid recovery. Even if they get it fixed and content is there months to a year down the road, it will never have the players they initially thought would happen and will likely always be a joke and meme to gamers.
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  8. #7608
    Quote Originally Posted by Shinzai View Post
    Genuine question, have you basically spent 180 hours doing the same 3 dungeons/strongholds over and over? Assuming 10-20 hours to completely wipe out all main content/story, etc.
    I spent around 30 hrs on the campaign and still havent had all the convos in town which will likely add a few more hours.

    Outside of that i mostly just did my dailies every day and then logged off. Maybe popping in for some stuff on the side here and there cause the combats still fun.
    "I've carefully played this game to an endless despair"

  9. #7609
    This game will never recover, no attempt to turn around and very little good faith put into actions. Better to move on to the next project and hopefully learn from mistakes. A mistake can be forgiven, bad faith cannot.

  10. #7610
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    Quote Originally Posted by minteK917 View Post
    This game will never recover, no attempt to turn around and very little good faith put into actions. Better to move on to the next project and hopefully learn from mistakes. A mistake can be forgiven, bad faith cannot.
    I just wish people stoped defending this game, as it just missleads others and they found out later that is problematic (they dont read news and stuff).

    Yesterday when i was shopping in store for tehnical stuff i seen a father buying this for a 10 year old kid. Lucky some guy who worked there, stoped them and show them something better to purchase (yeh they are for 5 euro per box). 20-30 games just trown up on pile.

    There is a way to fix this game however, but its gona cost money and time. If they go the Final Fantasy 14 way.
    This would mean to shut down the game 100% and go full work on it. (bioware magic --- however workers will just suffer more)

  11. #7611
    Quote Originally Posted by Yunru View Post
    I just wish people stoped defending this game, as it just missleads others and they found out later that is problematic (they dont read news and stuff).

    Yesterday when i was shopping in store for tehnical stuff i seen a father buying this for a 10 year old kid. Lucky some guy who worked there, stoped them and show them something better to purchase (yeh they are for 5 euro per box). 20-30 games just trown up on pile.

    There is a way to fix this game however, but its gona cost money and time. If they go the Final Fantasy 14 way.
    This would mean to shut down the game 100% and go full work on it. (bioware magic --- however workers will just suffer more)
    I thought FF14 had fundamental problems that meant the game had to basically be completely remade? Anthem has bugs and some people aren't happy with the loot-acquisition but gameplay is solid for people who want to have fun flying around and shooting stuff.

  12. #7612
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yunru View Post
    I just wish people stoped defending this game, as it just missleads others and they found out later that is problematic
    Why can't people defend a game that they like?
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  13. #7613
    Anthem wasn’t just killed, it was aborted.

  14. #7614
    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    Why can't people defend a game that they like?
    Because liking a game and defending it is two different things.

    You can like it but still agree that its a mess, Most when they defend it ignore the mess.
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  15. #7615
    Quote Originally Posted by Shinzai View Post
    Genuine question, have you basically spent 180 hours doing the same 3 dungeons/strongholds over and over? Assuming 10-20 hours to completely wipe out all main content/story, etc.
    Why don't you hop over to the wow raids&dungeons forum and ask how many hours the people there spent in the last raid dungeon?
    I think thats the genre, you grind for loot at max level. Anthem doesn't have that many dungeons but on the other hand most people only run the most efficient anyways. People were already complaining that even though the new dungeon is probably (and in my opinion to 100%) the best dungeon of all of them, most will still continue to run heart of rage simply because it's the fastest and has 3 bosses+2 chests.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhrizzle View Post
    (sadly had to stop doing Heart of Rage because of people quitting out before the last boss)
    I barely see that, the last time someone left before the monitor was weeks ago and i've never had a group disband. Maybe i was lucky but i think it's not so bad as people make it out to be.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yunru View Post
    I just wish people stoped defending this game, as it just missleads others and they found out later that is problematic (they dont read news and stuff).
    But maybe the game is not as bad as some people make it seem like.
    I said it multiple times, it really needs max level content and a few small things like markers for events on the free roam map but aside from that it's quite solid imo. Not the best game ever made but for me at least the best looter shooter i played. I tried Destiny 2 and it was okay-ish, i didn't really like Division 1. Anthem at least is fun enough to do my dailies most days.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhrizzle View Post
    Anthem has bugs and some people aren't happy with the loot-acquisition but gameplay is solid for people who want to have fun flying around and shooting stuff.
    I don't really know what people expect regarding to loot. Legendaries are the best gear availible right now. If they'd shower everyone in legendaries people would complain that there is nothing left to grind for. Isn't it normal for those kind if games to give out the best loot on a rare basis?
    There i two things regarding loot i don't like but they are minor points i think... I have maybe 15-20 legendaries across all suits and i got probably double that number total but half of them were items i already had. Thats annoying, especially if you consider that there are like 120 possible legendaries, that i get so much doubles with such a small number is bad. And that they mostly drop from normal mobs and not from bosses is strange, but if you know that you can play accordingly.

  16. #7616
    Quote Originally Posted by Yriel View Post
    Isn't it normal for those kind if games to give out the best loot on a rare basis?
    No, most of these kinds of game shower you in loot but the trick is getting the right stats.

    Anthem on the other hand doesn't shower you, but most of it is still bad.

  17. #7617
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    No, most of these kinds of game shower you in loot but the trick is getting the right stats.

    Anthem on the other hand doesn't shower you, but most of it is still bad.
    Well as i said i only played Destiny 2 and Division 1 and Destiny 2 didn't really shower me in anything at max level, it was a very slow grind to get better gear, in fact i couldn't even get the best weapon types at all.
    Division gave me a metric ton of orange (i think) stuff but from what i read getting items with the best item level is quite a grind, too.
    So i'm not so sure about that.
    And thats what i know from MMOs, too, that the best loot is really rare. And strangely people complain that in WoW every noob gets epic loot while in anthem people complain that not every noob gets legendary loot.

    But i agree Anthem could, maybe, give one guaranteed legendary per boss in the GM levels or at gm2 and gm3 or something like that.

  18. #7618
    Quote Originally Posted by quras View Post
    Lack of leadership is no doubt just one of bioware current major issues and seems to have been for a rather long time and something that doesn't seem to be fixed enough to make any real difference but you are right. People in leadership roles rarely if ever want to take the heat and be the ones wrong and I get that very vibe from that tweet.

    He refers back to that awful reddit post... Meaning to me it's very likely jesse anderson is just placating the community.
    So, the post Jesse referred to was a post written by leadership (Ben and Chad) so he likely had absolutely no say in what it said. He also likely had no ability to say anything else, which is why he referred to said post.

    This is me playing devils advocate, but I can easily imagine myself being in his position and being beyond frustrated not having any agency on that situation but still needing to be the face of this as all of the leadership steps back and hangs me out to dry full well knowing how this update would be received. I could easily see me saying something similar to what he did as an attempt to try and throw it back on leadership just pointing to the message that the people above his head wrote that they said was what was allowed to be said.

    From a PR standpoint I imagine its better for him to just regurgitate what the post says instead of telling people to go look at it, but I could see how a frustrated person who doesn't know how to handle that situation would end up saying that after a long and stressful week.


    @Yriel The misstep Anthem did is they tried to combine high RNG inscriptions with high RNG rarities. Destiny 2 got away with a low drop rate because the items had static stats and just increased in Ilvl as you progressed. The division has more stats RNG as I understand it so they shower you with more loot (more importantly, upgrade opportunities).

    Anthem ended up putting all the negatives of each system together with no positives. So you progress via power level by rarity, and the higher the power level the rarer the gear is, and then you have massive power differences depending on inscription rolls. That means the opportunity to get an upgrade in Anthem is infinitely smaller than in destiny 2, I never played the division but I'm sure there as well. And this only gets exponentially worse as your gear gets better.

    For instance my Jav is full lemons, which means only other lemons are potential upgrades. Literally everything that drops MW and below is just a waste of my time because I need to spend time scrapping it and I can't use those materials for crafting because I can't craft lemons.

    Its actually incredible just how bad this loot system is and how no one in leadership saw this coming. I'm sure the lower tier devs that don't have a say were internally screaming about it, but what can they do if leadership doesn't listen?
    "I've carefully played this game to an endless despair"

  19. #7619
    @Baconeggcheese Good points, i agree. Probably because none of my suits are even near full yellow i haven't noticed it yet.

  20. #7620
    Quote Originally Posted by Yriel View Post
    @Baconeggcheese Good points, i agree. Probably because none of my suits are even near full yellow i haven't noticed it yet.
    I should add, the game also sort of has 2 completely different loot systems in it while you're leveling vs once you hit 30.

    While you're leveling the game does a more destiny-esque feeding you higher ilvl (rarity) gear continuously and since ilvl is more important than inscriptions you just wear your highest stuff and keep on trucking with steady progression. Once you're fully in a specific rarity the game stops feeding you lower rarities and almost exclusively feeds you your current one.

    This stops at 30, and the game switches over to the new system where purples are still your base drop but gives you guaranteed ways of getting MW enough so that you can very rapidly end up in full MW items within a few days of casual play. At which point your progression grinds to a halt, since your only upgrades are trying to RNG in the really horribly designed inscription system or the tiny drop chance of a legendary. Which only gets worse as you continue to get more legendaries.

    Imo they have an "easy" way out of this by just continuing the initial system while leveling into MW and legendary items. Unfortunately I think its tied to level right now but they could potentially tie it to difficulty for the MW and legendary items. Pretty much they need to push us at an incremental rate into being full legendary and then have all drops be legendaries so that inscriptions can be our next proper upgrade path. At that point they need to overhaul the inscriptions to something less terrible, but I think getting us to that point can be done in a much more timely manner and would do a ton for people wanting to continue playing the game.
    "I've carefully played this game to an endless despair"

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