Page 1 of 3
1
2
3
LastLast
  1. #1
    Deleted

    The Argus teleporting

    So i was wondering: teleporting big things is kinda a big deal. Dalaran took a bunch of archmages. During war of the ancients it took the well of eternity + demon soul to open a portal for sargeras, a planet sized being. During nighthold it took guldan the nightwell, amantuls eye and weeks/months of work to open a portal to argus strong enough for sargeras soul to come through.

    But then Illidan can just use some fancy stone to teleport an entire planet in an instant, HOW did he manage that? How is that stone so powefull?

    And, since that stone used to be burning legion property untill very recently, why didn't the legion use it against us?

  2. #2
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA-US
    Posts
    39,857
    Quote Originally Posted by Him of Many Faces View Post
    So i was wondering: teleporting big things is kinda a big deal. Dalaran took a bunch of archmages. During war of the ancients it took the well of eternity + demon soul to open a portal for sargeras, a planet sized being. During nighthold it took guldan the nightwell, amantuls eye and weeks/months of work to open a portal to argus strong enough for sargeras soul to come through.

    But then Illidan can just use some fancy stone to teleport an entire planet in an instant, HOW did he manage that? How is that stone so powefull?

    And, since that stone used to be burning legion property untill very recently, why didn't the legion use it against us?
    Illidan doesn't use the Keystone to teleport Argus anywhere - he opened a giant rift-like portal between Azeroth and Argus, essentially creating a massive planet-sized gateway between the two worlds.
    WHAT CAN THE HARVEST HOPE FOR, IF NOT THE CARE OF THE REAPER MAN?. - Terry Pratchett, Reaper Man

  3. #3
    by looking at the trailer my guess is he did not teleport argus but simply open a planet size portal
    The difference beteween genius and stupidity... genius has its limit

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Him of Many Faces View Post
    So i was wondering: teleporting big things is kinda a big deal. Dalaran took a bunch of archmages. During war of the ancients it took the well of eternity + demon soul to open a portal for sargeras, a planet sized being. During nighthold it took guldan the nightwell, amantuls eye and weeks/months of work to open a portal to argus strong enough for sargeras soul to come through.

    But then Illidan can just use some fancy stone to teleport an entire planet in an instant, HOW did he manage that? How is that stone so powefull?

    And, since that stone used to be burning legion property untill very recently, why didn't the legion use it against us?
    Illidan in the novel set up part of the spell involving that keystone, What he did there was essentially use it to form a giant doorstop to keep the portal to Argus open not really "teleporting" argus as much as just having a giant window open to it.

  5. #5
    Deleted
    well the question remains, guldan was making a similar portal in nighthold which took him huge amounts of power. how can illidan/the stone do it so effortlessly?

  6. #6
    Chalk it up to bad writing. They made Illidan and the keystone do what they needed them to do in order to bring Argus into play. Normally, they way WoW magic works, they would have to have used the keystone in conjunction with a ritual much like the one Guldan preformed at the Nighthold.
    World of Warcraft: Level 60 Blood Elf Holy Paladin

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Him of Many Faces View Post
    well the question remains, guldan was making a similar portal in nighthold which took him huge amounts of power. how can illidan/the stone do it so effortlessly?
    because that keystone is meant specifically to do things like this.

    it wasn't illidan, it was the stone. it's a legion construct, made to create portals to any legion controlled world.

  8. #8
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA-US
    Posts
    39,857
    Illidan had done a great deal of preparation prior to his defeat in the Black Temple - setting up portal anchors on Argus, even connecting it to the very citadel of Kil'jaeden at the risk of his own life (before being whisked away by Xe'ra). Likely the groundwork for Illidan's grand casting was already laid, the fight on Kil'jaeden's command-ship and the use of the Keystone was all that was needed to spark the creation of the massive portal. It might sustain itself on the ambient Fel energy leaking from Argus or it may be self-sustaining thanks to the nature of the Keystone and its connection to the Legion portal network.
    WHAT CAN THE HARVEST HOPE FOR, IF NOT THE CARE OF THE REAPER MAN?. - Terry Pratchett, Reaper Man

  9. #9
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by derpkitteh View Post
    because that keystone is meant specifically to do things like this.

    it wasn't illidan, it was the stone. it's a legion construct, made to create portals to any legion controlled world.
    yeah but planet sized portals just like that? did they shove a couple civilizations worth of souls into it or something?

    and obviously the stone can open a portal from argus to azeroth, and the legion had it during the initial invasion, so why not use it then :S. or did the demon hunters steal it during TBC i don't remember.

  10. #10
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA-US
    Posts
    39,857
    Quote Originally Posted by Him of Many Faces View Post
    yeah but planet sized portals just like that? did they shove a couple civilizations worth of souls into it or something?

    and obviously the stone can open a portal from argus to azeroth, and the legion had it during the initial invasion, so why not use it then :S. or did the demon hunters steal it during TBC i don't remember.
    The Demon Hunters stole the Sargerite Keystone from Mardum back in TBC's time period, but on returning to the Black Temple were intercepted by the Wardens and imprisoned, the Keystone taken and held in trust by the Wardens. The corrupted Cordana Felsong then broke back into the Vault of the Wardens and attempted to take the Keystone back to the Legion, but was stopped by the Demon Hunter Order Hall forces.

    The Keystone obviously has some unique properties - it may hold very powerful Fel and soul energies of its own to open vast portals in the hand of a highly competent caster such as Illidan. It's also worth note that the Sargerite Keystone was previously a device of Titan origin from its flavor text on Mardum:

    "The power of Sargeras flows through this fel-corrupted titan device. It's a skeleton key to any and all Legion worlds. It's also your only way back to the Black Temple."
    Last edited by Aucald; 2017-06-22 at 02:32 AM.
    WHAT CAN THE HARVEST HOPE FOR, IF NOT THE CARE OF THE REAPER MAN?. - Terry Pratchett, Reaper Man

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    Illidan doesn't use the Keystone to teleport Argus anywhere - he opened a giant rift-like portal between Azeroth and Argus, essentially creating a massive planet-sized gateway between the two worlds.
    Why isn't this rift shown in-game then?

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Him of Many Faces View Post
    yeah but planet sized portals just like that? did they shove a couple civilizations worth of souls into it or something?

    and obviously the stone can open a portal from argus to azeroth, and the legion had it during the initial invasion, so why not use it then :S. or did the demon hunters steal it during TBC i don't remember.
    well, there is the preparations that illidan made before dying too.

    also, it connects to legion worlds. they would need to get it to azeroth. they never got hte opportunity i guess.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Gravemind View Post
    Why isn't this rift shown in-game then?
    becuase right after it was made the planet orbited through the portal into azeroths orbit.


    its an asspull.

  14. #14
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA-US
    Posts
    39,857
    Quote Originally Posted by Gravemind View Post
    Why isn't this rift shown in-game then?
    It's shown in the cinematic quite clearly from the Argus side:



    The edges of the open rift go beyond the diameters of both Azeroth and Argus, so it wouldn't be visible in the skybox.
    WHAT CAN THE HARVEST HOPE FOR, IF NOT THE CARE OF THE REAPER MAN?. - Terry Pratchett, Reaper Man

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    It's shown in the cinematic quite clearly from the Argus side:

    The edges of the open rift go beyond the diameters of both Azeroth and Argus, so it wouldn't be visible in the skybox.
    That's not really how it works. It would be visible in the skybox unless the rift's edges are moving behind Azeroth. There's no reason you shouldn't be able to see at least part of the rift's edge in all 360 degrees of sky that's visible.

  16. #16
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA-US
    Posts
    39,857
    Quote Originally Posted by Gravemind View Post
    That's not really how it works. It would be visible in the skybox unless the rift's edges are moving behind Azeroth. There's no reason you shouldn't be able to see at least part of the rift's edge in all 360 degrees of sky that's visible.
    You can see the edges of the rift in the final shot of the cinematic from Aszuna (in a panoramic wide-shot of the zone as the camera pulls back). It's just not visible in the skybox textures outside of the cinematic because the skyboxes don't extend that far. I'd imagine they could add it if they like - might be difficult enough to make the modified skybox textures as-is.

    Example:

    Last edited by Aucald; 2017-06-22 at 02:41 AM.
    WHAT CAN THE HARVEST HOPE FOR, IF NOT THE CARE OF THE REAPER MAN?. - Terry Pratchett, Reaper Man

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    You can see the edges of the rift in the final shot of the cinematic from Aszuna (in a panoramic wide-shot of the zone as the camera pulls back). It's just not visible in the skybox textures outside of the cinematic because the skyboxes don't extend that far. I'd imagine they could add it if they like - might be difficult enough to make the modified skybox textures as-is.
    Yes I've seen the cinematic just like everyone else, but in the actual world there is no rift. There is nothing in the sky to obstruct the entirety of the rift. The only way the rift could be hidden is if the rift's edges passed below the horizon in all 360 degrees around you, at which point, for all intents and purposes, that would just be Azeroth passing through the rift which is a whole nother issue entirely (i.e. goodbye Lady and Child).

    If it's simply a technical issue of not being able to show it in the skybox, then okay, I'll accept that. But there's a big difference between a planet teleporting to another planet versus a giant window between the two that I think remains unexplained right now.

  18. #18
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA-US
    Posts
    39,857
    Quote Originally Posted by Gravemind View Post
    Yes I've seen the cinematic just like everyone else, but in the actual world there is no rift. There is nothing in the sky to obstruct the entirety of the rift. The only way the rift could be hidden is if the rift's edges passed below the horizon in all 360 degrees around you, at which point, for all intents and purposes, that would just be Azeroth passing through the rift which is a whole nother issue entirely (i.e. goodbye Lady and Child).

    If it's simply a technical issue of not being able to show it in the skybox, then okay, I'll accept that. But there's a big difference between a planet teleporting to another planet versus a giant window between the two that I think remains unexplained right now.
    I think seeing Argus in the in-game sky is more meant to be a "rule of cool" style addition than it is a testament to the lore. The cinematic itself shows what is happening much more clearly, I believe. Given that the Sargarite Keystone's purpose is the opening of portals within the Legion's portal network also lends itself to it being a massive portal rift and not the teleportation of Argus to the skies above Azeroth. But I suppose we'll see one way or the other when 7.3 hits.
    WHAT CAN THE HARVEST HOPE FOR, IF NOT THE CARE OF THE REAPER MAN?. - Terry Pratchett, Reaper Man

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    I think seeing Argus in the in-game sky is more meant to be a "rule of cool" style addition than it is a testament to the lore. The cinematic itself shows what is happening much more clearly, I believe. Given that the Sargarite Keystone's purpose is the opening of portals within the Legion's portal network also lends itself to it being a massive portal rift and not the teleportation of Argus to the skies above Azeroth. But I suppose we'll see one way or the other when 7.3 hits.
    Maybe. I'm of the belief it's the cinematics that are meant to be more for entertainment rather than concrete lore. For instance, Archimonde's death cinematic he dies on Draenor - not the nether (a la mythic difficulty). Does that mean he's still alive? I think regardless of the cinematic's implications we won't be seeing him again.

  20. #20
    The Keystone was made by Sargeras (hense the Sargerite Keystone). It's got way more power than anything Gul'dan had. Compare it more to the Scepter of Sargeras, as that is a more appropriate artifact, power wise. Both have extreme portal based powers. One created a (for now) permanent portal between worlds, one created so many portals that they ripped a planet apart.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •