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  1. #1
    Mind if I roll need? xskarma's Avatar
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    2017-2018 NBA thread





    Welcome everyone to the 2017-2018 NBA Thread


    Where we discuss the 2017-2018 NBA season from the July Moratorium days of Free Agency, all the way to the NBA Finals of this season in June 2018, with all the news and all the games that go on in between.


    Thread Rules:

    There aren't many specific rules in this thread other than the normal forum rules that apply everywhere. We expect people to follow the spirit of the thread and the forum, mostly by respecting that every one has a favorite team and is entitled to cheer for them. Some banter is fine, insulting and trolling is not.

    We also ask to keep the discussion largely centered around the current season and to leave in depth discussions about which team or player from yesteryear was better than which other team/player to threads made to discuss such a topic.



    Links to Previous Threads:

    2011-2014 NBA thread: Link
    2014-2015 NBA thread: Link
    2015-2017 NBA thread: Link


    Interesting things about the 2017-2018 season:


    This season will be the 72nd season of the National Basketball Association.


    This season will be the Detroit Pistons' 70th season in the NBA.

    This season will be the Milwaukee Bucks' 50th season in the NBA.

    This season will be the Miami Heat's 30th season in the NBA.

    This season will be the Los Angeles Lakers' 70th season in the NBA.

    This season will be the Phoenix Suns' 50th season in the NBA.



    This season will be the Atlanta Hawks' 50th season in Atlanta.

    This season will be the Washington Wizards' 45th season in the Washington, D.C. area.

    This season will be the Oklahoma City Thunder's 10th season in Oklahoma City.

    This season will be the Los Angeles Clippers' 40th season in Southern California.

    This season will be the San Antonio Spurs' 45th season in the San Antonio area.



    This season will be the Detroit Pistons' first season at Little Caesars Arena.

    This season will be the Milwaukee Bucks' final season at the Bradley Center.

    This season will be the Phoenix Suns' 25th season in the Talking Stick Resort Arena.


    Christmas Day games will be played on Monday, December 25, 2017.



    2017-2018 NBA Finals winner odds:


    Golden State Warriors 2/3
    Cleveland Cavaliers 3/1
    Boston Celtics 12/1
    San Antonio Spurs 12/1
    Houston Rockets 20/1
    Los Angeles Clippers 33/1
    Toronto Raptors 50/1
    Washington Wizards 50/1
    Oklahoma City Thunder 66/1
    Memphis Grizzlies 75/1
    Milwaukee Bucks 75/1
    Chicago Bulls 100/1
    Dallas Mavericks 100/1
    Denver Nuggets 100/1
    Indiana Pacers 100/1
    Los Angeles Lakers 100/1
    Miami Heat 100/1
    Minnesota Timberwolves 100/1
    New Orleans Pelicans 100/1
    New York Knicks 100/1
    Philadelphia 76ers 100/1
    Portland Trail Blazers 100/1
    Utah Jazz 100/1
    Atlanta Hawks 200/1
    Charlotte Hornets 300/1
    Detroit Pistons 300/1
    Brooklyn Nets 500/1
    Orlando Magic 500/1
    Phoenix Suns 500/1
    Sacramento Kings 500/1



    So what can we expect for the 2017-2018 season:


    June 29 — Last day for decisions on player, team and early termination options, unless individual contracts specify otherwise.

    June 30 — Last official day of 2016/17 league year; last day for teams to make qualifying offers to players eligible for restricted free agency.

    July 1 — Official start of 2017/18 league year; July moratorium begins. Free agents can begin reaching verbal agreements with teams.

    July 6 — July moratorium ends (11:00am CT); teams can begin officially signing players and making trades.

    July 13 — Last day for teams to unilaterally withdraw qualifying offers to restricted free agents.

    July 15 — Last day for teams to issue required tenders to unsigned first-round picks; those players become free agents on July 16 if not tendered.

    August 31 — Last day teams may waive players and apply the stretch provision to their 2017/18 salaries.

    September 5 — Last day for teams to issue required tenders to unsigned second-round picks; those players become free agents on September 6 if not tendered.


    Late September (specific dates TBA) — Training camps open.


    October 5 through October 16 - Pre-season games.


    October 20, 2017 - Regular Season starts.


    Wednesday, April 11, 2018 - Regular season ends.



    Playoff Predictions tournament:


    Will link spreadsheet here when it gets time for the playoffs and Blueobelisk starts it again.



    Some of the last posts in the previous thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by xskarma View Post
    "J.J. Redick won't be re-signing with the L.A. Clippers. (Via Brian Windhorst - ESPN)"

    https://twitter.com/ClevisMurray/sta...99413473058816


    I think this came out after you posted, so I understand your feeling it might turn around, but this just has every bit the feeling like the Clippers are blowing things up and going for the young rebuild.

    Remember they brought in Jerry West this week too, who was an influential advisor on the Warriors during their build up to what they are now. I don't think it's coincedence that he's brought in and the team goes into rebuild mode. I think they brought him in specifically cause they knew they would start committing to a rebuild and wanted his advice while in that process.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tonus View Post
    There are two things I will say for Phil: he didn't trade away future draft picks, and he drafted Porzingis. The Knicks traded their first round pick away in 1993, 1995, 1998, 2000, 2001, 2002 (they traded Nene right after the draft), 2004, 2006, 2007, 2010, 2012, 2014, and 2016. That's 13 times in 24 drafts. A few of those picks turned into guys like LaMarcus Aldridge, Gordon Heyward, Nene, Joakim Noah, and Dario Saric. Once the Knicks got bad in 2001, it was a horrendous strategy that almost always backfired.

    There's a rule that you're only allowed to trade your pick every other year (in a couple cases they circumvented that by trading it away right after the draft - 2000, 2002, or by swapping picks instead of trading outright). If the Knicks don't trade their 2018 first round pick, it'll be the first time they kept their pick for 2 consecutive years since 2008-09.

    So if you're a GM thinking of coming to the Knicks, there's two scenarios:

    1. You've got Porzingis and the french guy as potential core members of a future contending team. You've got bad contracts clogging up cap space so you can tank pretty painlessly (playing the french guy a lot will surely cost you games next year and at some point Carmelo turns into late career Kobe Bryant). You get three more lottery picks, extend Porzingis (taking Carmelo's cap space), and use the cap space currently occupied by Courtney Lee and what remains of Joakim Noah to sign a free agent. If it's 2020, you're the GM in New York, you have a young interesting team, and you have cap space, there's a good shot you can get someone good to fill out a contending roster.

    2. Knicks' business as usual. Sign Derrick Rose and pretend he's still an MVP caliber point guard. When Carmelo comes off the books, spend the money on whoever is willing to come to the Knicks in 2019. You end up with mediocre picks in the late lottery. Maybe you luck into a first round playoff appearance one year, get excited and trade more first rounders. Porzingis leaves in 2020.

    If I'm interviewing with Dolan, I push scenario 1. Unfortunately I suspect he's going to go with scenario 2.

    - - - Updated - - -



    With that lineup against the Warriors, you end up with Rondo (-.5 defensive real plus minus) guarding Curry, Redick (-2.11) guarding Klay Thompson, Melo (-1.75) guarding Iguodala, Griffin (+.76) totally mismatched trying to guard Durant, and Jordan guarding Green, who drags him out to the three point line.

    Woof. The Warriors might score 150 points a game. And that team is around the same age as the Warriors so it's not like you can wait them out.
    Quote Originally Posted by ItachiZaku View Post
    He gets zero credit for Porzingis, he didn't want him at all as mentioned by every sports radio and TV show this week. Phil is washed, but without Phil there is no "Bron vs Mike" argument and I wonder how many Kobe and Shaq get.


    Lastly,


    We hope everyone that likes basketball will join us as we go on the journey to learn who will eventually follow last year's winners the Golden State Warriors as the 2017-2018 NBA Finals winners.

    Have at it, ladies and gentlemen!

    signed, the mods.

  2. #2
    Here becketh Golden State vs The League.
    Quote Originally Posted by THE Bigzoman View Post
    Meant Wetback. That's what the guy from Home Depot called it anyway.
    ==================================
    If you say pls because it is shorter than please,
    I'll say no because it is shorter than yes.
    ==================================

  3. #3
    The Lightbringer
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    Quote Originally Posted by Packers01 View Post
    I'm excited for FA to start. I kind of hope the rockets and Celtics land guys so we have some more "super" teams.

    I guess Melo wants to be traded to the Rockets or will except a buyout of less money to go to the Cavs.
    Not sure how that would work? Cavs can literally only sign people at Vet minimum, so in order for Melo to agree to play for that he would have be paid over $20MM from the Knicks to just go away.

  4. #4
    Mind if I roll need? xskarma's Avatar
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    "Update: Utah acquires Ricky Rubio in deal with Minnesota"

    https://twitter.com/TheVertical/stat...08944373362692


    The trade is for a future first it says in the article linked in the tweet.

  5. #5
    Fluffy Kitten Pendulous's Avatar
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    If I recall, Rubio never lived up to his hype, so I'm not sure what to think of this.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Pendulous View Post
    If I recall, Rubio never lived up to his hype, so I'm not sure what to think of this.
    Be disappointed. Your team is going to regress.

  7. #7
    Fluffy Kitten Pendulous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blueobelisk View Post
    Be disappointed. Your team is going to regress.
    Eh. Assuming everyone stays, he's gonna be pretty far down on the bench. He could be above Dante Exum, but Rodney Hood, Iso Joe (please don't retire), and even Neto would end up with more minutes than him.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Edit: Everyone seems to be saying this means George Hill is gone. So yes, downgrade probably. And that's assuming Hayward stays.
    Last edited by Pendulous; 2017-07-01 at 12:35 AM.

  8. #8
    Oooo to OKC? I wonder who they gave up for him. He'll be gone the year after for sure though.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Packers01 View Post
    Paul George has been traded to OKC, per sources
    Damn yo. I wonder if he wanted to go, or if Indiana was like "fuck this guy, if he doesn't wanna stay let's just trade him now and get shit while we can".

  10. #10
    Can I make one request to the teams in the NBA

    Stop trading all your good players to the Western Conference!

    The East is boring and easy enough for Cleveland. My god

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Packers01 View Post
    Blake Griffin to sign 5-year, $173M deal with Clippers
    He's still young, and LAC is willing to $pay$ him. Seems like a good deal for him.

  12. #12
    Lakers01 if you keep posting those absurd numbers, I'm gonna kill myself out of jealousy.

  13. #13
    Over 9000! PhaelixWW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Packers01 View Post
    Stephen Curry has agreed to a 5-year, $201M deal with Golden State.
    Supermax, yup.

    Just consider: he's set to average over $40 mil a year over the next five years. His last contract? $44 mil... for four years.

    Honestly, I'll just think of it as a 9-year contract for $245 mil.


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  14. #14
    Old God -aiko-'s Avatar
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    Ricky Rubio to the Jazz, which means we will lose Hill. I'm not too confident we will keep Hayward but if we do things could get interesting.

    Or we could lose him and have another year with very little offensive firepower.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Dang, PG13 to OKC for Oladipo and Domantas Sabonis. I will be surprised if he stays though, so I'm not sure how I feel about this trade overall. I'm interested to see what the Celtics do now about Hayward.

  15. #15
    Mind if I roll need? xskarma's Avatar
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    Dang, I thought nothing much would happen the first night, BOY was I wrong.

    This makes it all but certain that Paul George is going to hit free agency next year and go to the Lakers, possibly with other Superstars.

    Stephen Curry getting paid is good news for everyone that hopes the Warriors will be beatable eventually. If he had taken a friendly deal it would have been hard.

    Blake Griffen getting paid is stupid. He'll never finish that contract healthy and this will be a millstone round the Clippers neck sooner rather than later.




    Quote Originally Posted by Packers01 View Post
    Boston fucked up again and is going to end up with no one. Its getting comical at this point.
    This was always a possibility. Frankly most of the hype about Boston involvement is purely media driven. They have the best assets and everyone is well aware of this, so it makes for an easy story to hype up that the Celtics are in on players, even multiple players, ALL THE PLAYERS.

    For instance: Yesterday's story was that the Pacers wanted the Brooklyn pick AND the Lakers/etc. pick AND Jae Crowder for Paul George and that the Celtics had balked. Now the Pacers are trading him for 2 bit players to OKC?

    Something in that equation doesn't add up. If Pacers were honestly asking for such a price and then settled for what OKC sent them then the Pacers are stupid. The more likely story is that the Pacers never asked for that and the Celtics never made any serious offers better than what OKC coughed up. I'm starting to learn that "League sources" means jack shit in the NBA.

    I mean, this whole "THEY WANT TO ADD HAYWARD AND GEORGE IN A COMPLEX SERIES OF EVENTS" was kind of preposterous from the start. Even if things had worked out to make it happen, the Celtics would have been maxed out and would have had to give up most of their quality bench. And then next year Isiah Thomas wants a contract, a big one. How are they going to pay him? There's no money. So they would bring in this free agent bonanza for 1 year, and then let the most popular current Celtic (and most popular Celtic in a good while) just walk without compensation and continue with a dirt cheap free agent or a rookie at PG?

    Something there doesn't exactly add up.

    IT/rookie or cheap veteran SG or maybe Jaylen Brown/Hayward/Paul George playing as the 4 which he doesn't like/Horford. Does that even stand a chance against the Cavs or the Warriors? And you'd have to blow up the team from this year to get there, getting rid of Crowder, Bradley and Smart and Olynyk, meaning you have no bench except some rookies and perhaps Jaylen Brown if he's not starting in place of Bradley. And you have that for one year and then it's gone. I'm not buying it.


    Even if the Celtics sign no one on the big ticket free agents/trade list (Butler, George, Hayward, Griffin) they'd still have the same roster that did well in the East last year and added a top 3 pick in the Draft AND added more ammunition for future drafts. Seems like the Celtics are still doing fine, especially since the East is apparently getting weaker by the day with Butler and George gone. Raptors are potentially losing one of their main players, Wizards are stuck in no man's land, Cavs are the Cavs and getting older. The Bucks worry me if they keep developing, but that's it. I think the Celtics will do fine with the roster they have with nothing added.


    We'll see what happens, but I'm honestly not that worried about what's going on. It was always a smarter plan to build around Jaylen Brown and the draft picks then to blow things up for the short term. If they can get Hayward they become more competitive than if they stand pat obviously but I don't think that changes anything about the current path of building around the draftpicks.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by xskarma View Post
    Stephen Curry getting paid is good news for everyone that hopes the Warriors will be beatable eventually. If he had taken a friendly deal it would have been hard.

    Blake Griffen getting paid is stupid. He'll never finish that contract healthy and this will be a millstone round the Clippers neck sooner rather than later..
    >When Steph Curry makes $201 mil over 5 years.
    >When that extra million over the $200m mark seems insignificant, but you realize it's an extra $200,000 a year, more than 90% of people will make a year.

    I'm actually okay with Steph earning that much. He's the hottest guy in the NBA right now. But.....

    Quote Originally Posted by xskarma View Post
    Blake Griffen getting paid is stupid. He'll never finish that contract healthy and this will be a millstone round the Clippers neck sooner rather than later..
    Blake Griffin earning $157 mil a year is depressing. He's not even good anymore, injuries or not.

  17. #17
    Over 9000! PhaelixWW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xskarma View Post
    Stephen Curry getting paid is good news for everyone that hopes the Warriors will be beatable eventually. If he had taken a friendly deal it would have been hard.
    Not sure what you mean. The Warriors have already stated that they're planning to be heavily into the luxury tax for years, which means they're planning to pay heavily to keep this squad together, regardless of a supermax contract for Steph.


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  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Packers01 View Post
    Boston fucked up again and is going to end up with no one. Its getting comical at this point.
    I firmly believe that Ainge and the management in Boston believe that they still wouldnt win vs Cleveland even with Paul George or Jimmy Butler. So they arent going for a win now mentality but a lets win in a few years when Lebron starts getting old and falls off.

  19. #19
    Mind if I roll need? xskarma's Avatar
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    "Restricted free agent Joe Ingles is finalizing a deal to return to the Utah Jazz, Ingles tells ESPN"

    "Ingles deal: 4 years, $52M, source says."

    "Ingles is one of Gordon Hayward's closest friends on team, and shares Mark Bartelstein of Priority Sports as an agent."


    Woj on twitter (weird to see him post for ESPN now)



    Big get for the Jazz. If they can get Haywards BFF back to the team it gets increasingly likely that Hayward will return and sign a fat deal as well. Would also not surprise me if their agent told the Jazz in a roundabout way that if they scratched his back with Ingles, that he'd scratch theirs by getting Hayward back to them.

  20. #20
    Fluffy Kitten Pendulous's Avatar
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    He's also a highly accurate three-point shooter, and a starter. Already plan on losing Hill, also a starter, so at least good to keep one.

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