Battle for Azeroth Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Hitei]

Gone are the days when we used to receive THREE new dungeons as part of an end of expansion patch. Remember the replay-ability the ICC patch had? That was 5+ years ago.

They ARE being lazy. All they are doing is adding RNG on top of RNG with a sprinkle of RNG. That's their "content" now. That's the only way they add replay-ability. It's not about quality anymore it's about keeping you on the treadmill. Do any of you not wonder why there wasn't a legendary catch up added?

No, I don't remember the replayability the ICC patch had. Because it had almost zero outside of farming for hilt drops.

When you say "the days", do you mean the same days when an entire tier and its associated art was rehashed instead of a new raid and tier sets being made? The same days when the entire tier before ICC took place in two rooms (and one of those rooms AND an entire fight were rehashed for the dungeon) and where they couldn't even be bothered to give each class a tier set?

But no, let's pretend that Wrath was the high point of large amounts of high quality, replayable content. Let's also pretend the ICC dungeon set was "THREE new dungeons" while ignoring that Forge of Souls was some platforms and then a room with only two bosses, Halls was a long hallway with a wave encounter and then a gauntlet encounter; and all three of them were almost entirely made from repeated assets taken from ICC and Icecrown itself.

After all, it was such a """quality"" expansion.

[rda]

^^ You are comparing 2017 with 2009. It got a bit easier to do content in the 8 years. Just saying.

You also are totally forgetting big swaths of content which were made possible in WotLK by fundamental changes in it. Achievements, changes to gearing which made raiding alts possible for 95% instead of 5%, LFG.

What Legion did? Mythic+? That's like a fifth iteration of the same. It was interesting the first one-two times. Now people just go there for the rewards, and if they could get these rewards by clicking a chest without going they wouldn't go. Compare to raiding alts in WoW - people would do them even if leveling / initial gearing was just a single click away. Because the appeal is in trying a different role / class. Longevity.

Big picture:

Progress in development in 2017 makes numeric iterations nearly free to do. One would expect Blizzard to then deliver plenty of these numeric iterations *AND* more unique content than before. Because they don't have to work nearly as hard for numeric iterations and a wealth of other necessary / expected, but utterly trivial stuff (like new tiers of profession recipes), so there's quite a bit of time freed. Plus it's easier to do unique content than before now as well. Plus - oh, hey, almost forgot - plus they have a BIGGER dev team, right??! Right? But noooooooooo. Instead of doing MORE unique content, they are now doing MUCH LESS of it. And they try to sell you numeric iterations - which are, I repeat, nearly free to do now - INSTEAD of unique content. Gee, what a progress...

[Hitei]

You also are totally forgetting big swaths of content which were made possible in WotLK by fundamental changes in it. Achievements, changes to gearing which made raiding alts possible for 95% instead of 5%, LFG.

What Legion did? Mythic+? That's like a fifth iteration of the same. It was interesting the first one-two times. Now people just go there for the rewards, and if they could get these rewards by clicking a chest without going they wouldn't go.

Honor talents and associated prestige levels.
World Quests.
PvP Brawls.
Pet Battle Dungeons.
Timewalking Raids.
Micro-Holidays.


Also, lol. "It was interesting the first one-two times. Now people just go there for the rewards", yet you are citing easier access to raiding, and group finding tools as "content" systems. Being able to find groups for dungeons, and it being easier to gear for raids are not more content. Those are tools that let more people access the existing content. Whether you did Utgarde Pinnacle by sitting in Dalaran and looking for a group in chat, or you hit a button and got auto-matched with people, it was the same instance. Not a new one.

Progress in development in 2017 makes numeric iterations nearly free to do. One would expect Blizzard to then deliver plenty of these numeric iterations *AND* more unique content than before. Because they don't have to work nearly as hard for numeric iterations and a wealth of other necessary / expected, but utterly trivial stuff (like new tiers of profession recipes), so there's quite a bit of time freed. Plus it's easier to do unique content than before now as well. Plus - oh, hey, almost forgot - plus they have a BIGGER dev team, right??! Right? But noooooooooo. Instead of doing MORE unique content, they are now doing MUCH LESS of it. And they try to sell you numeric iterations - which are, I repeat, nearly free to do now - INSTEAD of unique content. Gee, what a progress...

Yeah, why don't they do unique content, like massive 3-section zones added to the expansion after launch with new unique enemies, or large max level story zones, or solo class challenges, or some sort of system that mixes up PvP with weird rules and maps, or small holidays and solo experiences like unique scenarios.

Man, Blizzard keeps dropping the ball. Why can't we go back to the days of real content like another daily hub only this time there's even more incredibly lackluster vehicle combat?

[rda]

Honor talents and associated prestige levels.
World Quests.
PvP Brawls.
Pet Battle Dungeons.
Timewalking Raids.
Micro-Holidays.

Half of the above are utterly trivial reworks of existing pieces of content.

Honor talents, seriously? Did you somehow miss the ability pruning / the removal of glyphs / the removal of entire stats, etc, etc, etc? You are celebrating that some of these things have been moved to a different place instead of being deleted. What on earth is this doing in the list of new things, I don't even know. This is about half of several removed old things.

World quests? Lighting up different dailies on different days??? That innovation? Oh, I get it, you are talking about a huge addition in the form of auto-scaling drops for your ilvl. Such a huge, huge thing, especially in code. Must have taken months to implement.

Etc.

The other half is new content, but it is just very small. I will make it straight, the other half is this: PVP Brawls, Pet Battle Dungeons and Micro-Holidays. This is new content, thanks for it. But all of it is just tiny. Really tiny. The pet tournament on the Timeless Isle that I mentioned is at least 2-3x the content of all pet battle dungeons released to date. And it was a small part of what was thought as a not terribly big patch.

I honestly can't tell if you are trolling me. It's like when you write your list you don't even think about what the items are.

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Also, lol. "It was interesting the first one-two times. Now people just go there for the rewards", yet you are citing easier access to raiding, and group finding tools as "content" systems. Being able to find groups for dungeons, and it being easier to gear for raids are not more content. Those are tools that let more people access the existing content. Whether you did Utgarde Pinnacle by sitting in Dalaran and looking for a group in chat, or you hit a button and got auto-matched with people, it was the same instance. Not a new one.

You aren't thinking.

Here is what alts did: do same raids, yes, but as a NEW ROLE. Yes, this isn't a new instance, but it is a big addition of gameplay made available for every player. Find me what Legion did like this. You can't.

Here is what LFG did: do instances every day, do multiple instances per day if you want, without requiring a big guild / tons of time to compose a group (since we were talking about bad memory in this thread I will remind that it was completely normal to spend an hour just trying to build a group). Yes, this isn't a new instance, but it is again, a big addition of gameplay for every player. Find me what Legion did like this. You can't. I know you are just dying to mention Mythic+, but as I said, when you enable the same thing for the fifth time the impact is somewhat smaller than when you do this for the first time. Find me a similar thing *in another area, a new one* that Legion enabled. You can't.

I will refrain from making general points here, both because I made a couple already and also because it seems we have to stop at the specifics to make the point awfully clear. Find me things that Legion enabled in the way similar to achievements / alts / LFG in WoD. You can't. The end.

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Screw it. Here are several examples of things they could do that wouldn't be an instance, yet widen gameplay for players:

* Allow switching factions / do quests for the opposite faction. This could be built upon with the game growing to have more than two sides, custom sides, etc.

* Allow switching professions. Just plain switch professions like you do talent specs with all recipes remembered. They have a tiny portion of it for Legion portion of the professions, but that's only a tiny portion. A real feature would provide some supporting UI and keep all recipes / specializations. This could be built upon as well.

And I only mention things that are completely easy and straightforward to implement, and are off the top of my head. And only as examples.

They are so damn lazy, uncreative and unwilling to do anything at all except what is nearly free to code, it is mind boggling.

[rda]

The list of big new features for the next expansion, inspired by the list of big new features of Legion (ROFL) provided by Hitei:

Hyper-prestige: you get to reset ALL your prestige ranks to 0 and start anew for EPIC rewards.

Pet battle raids: you go to Onyxia Lair and fight five legendary dragonkin pets. With a 1% chance to get a sixth fight, if it spawns.

Timewalking mythic+ instances for Legion: not just timewalking and not just mythic+, a completely new game mode where you get both. Epic rewards again.

Nano holidays: you log in and NPCs of your race greet you with race-appropriate greetings. Blood and honor!

And it's not just about what is there at release! We are going to be adding more in patches! For example, one of the features we are considering is Pathfinder 3.0 where, in addition to completing loremaster / exploration / reputations / bla bla bla, you have to do 500 timewalking mythic+ instances to get your flying back. Totally cool!

[Deleted]

Literally everything you just listed is an iteration of BASE SYSTEMS already in the game.

PvP Brawls - wow we're adding a minor twist on the SAME FUCKING BGS YOU'VE BEEN PLAYING FOR 12 YEARS. Where's the new BGs with INTERESTING MECHANICS? Where is the Dota inspired BG that was scrapped a few expansions ago?

World Quests - are once again an iteration of the daily quest mechanic. Except now you don't get to WORK TOWARDS something with rep or points. Now you just do 4 of the same shitty WQs you've been doing for 12 months and you get an RNG loot box to pull the slot machine again.

Pet Battle Dungeons - You bring up re-used rooms and dungeons alot champ. This is all these are - re-used dungeons with the mobs stripped out and pet battles thrown in.

Timewalking Raids - Re-hashed content, AGAIN. With literally no balance tuning done on them. Did you even try TW Black Temple? The trash took years to kill because it wasn't tuned properly. LAZY.

Micro Holidays - hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha. breathe. hahahahahahaha.


Literally everything you listed is the LAZIEST shit they've ever conceived. We now have 4 different difficulties of the same raids. You morons feel inclined to run them because you need to pull that legendary slot machine! Mythic+, LAZY.


Wake up and smell the roses you little White Knight. Quality and Quantity has taken a massive nosedive. This game is in sub retention mode now. Make as little as content as possible to please them but keep them on the treadmill indefinitely.

Smells like someone got benched from is guild during normal progression

[Drekmar]

Wake up and smell the roses you little White Knight. Quality and Quantity has taken a massive nosedive. This game is in sub retention mode now. Make as little as content as possible to please them but keep them on the treadmill indefinitely.

Game is loosing subs since the introduction of community destroying features: LFD/LFR/CRZ.

[Hitei]

You aren't thinking.

Here is what alts did: do same raids, yes, but as a NEW ROLE. Yes, this isn't a new instance, but it is a big addition of gameplay made available for every player. Find me what Legion did like this. You can't.

Here is what LFG did: do instances every day, do multiple instances per day if you want, without requiring a big guild / tons of time to compose a group (since we were talking about bad memory in this thread I will remind that it was completely normal to spend an hour just trying to build a group). Yes, this isn't a new instance, but it is again, a big addition of gameplay for every player. Find me what Legion did like this. You can't. I know you are just dying to mention Mythic+, but as I said, when you enable the same thing for the fifth time the impact is somewhat smaller than when you do this for the first time. Find me a similar thing *in another area, a new one* that Legion enabled. You can't.

I will refrain from making general points here, both because I made a couple already and also because it seems we have to stop at the specifics to make the point awfully clear. Find me things that Legion enabled in the way similar to achievements / alts / LFG in WoD. You can't. The end.

lol, what? Your argument is that old expansions have more content because you can raid on multiple alts? You know, that thing that is easier today than ever before? Alts weren't something wrath invented, and they aren't something it did better than any expansion besides BC. You act like wow before LFG wasn't the exact same case of doing instances every day.

Find you a similar system Legion enabled? Patch scaled dungeons that keep gear drops in instances actually relevant throughout the expansion instead of reducing them to point farming. Scaling AP that means dailies are relevant long after you would have very easily hit exalted and completely outgeared faction rewards in previous expansions. Prestiged honor levels that reward you continuing to PvP long after you've got the gear you want.

I know you're just dying to pretend Mythic+ is just a heroic, but affixes changing how you approach and deal with instance mobs and the fact that it can continually increase in difficulty mean that you are wrong.

Screw it. Here are several examples of things they could do that wouldn't be an instance, yet widen gameplay for players:

Exactly. You have no idea what could be added as new content, so your two solutions are "let me do existing content without making a new character". Wow, so creative.

Literally everything you just listed is an iteration of BASE SYSTEMS already in the game.

PvP Brawls - wow we're adding a minor twist on the SAME FUCKING BGS YOU'VE BEEN PLAYING FOR 12 YEARS. Where's the new BGs with INTERESTING MECHANICS? Where is the Dota inspired BG that was scrapped a few expansions ago?

World Quests - are once again an iteration of the daily quest mechanic. Except now you don't get to WORK TOWARDS something with rep or points. Now you just do 4 of the same shitty WQs you've been doing for 12 months and you get an RNG loot box to pull the slot machine again.

Pet Battle Dungeons - You bring up re-used rooms and dungeons alot champ. This is all these are - re-used dungeons with the mobs stripped out and pet battles thrown in.

Timewalking Raids - Re-hashed content, AGAIN. With literally no balance tuning done on them. Did you even try TW Black Temple? The trash took years to kill because it wasn't tuned properly. LAZY.

Micro Holidays - hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha. breathe. hahahahahahaha.


Literally everything you listed is the LAZIEST shit they've ever conceived. We now have 4 different difficulties of the same raids. You morons feel inclined to run them because you need to pull that legendary slot machine! Mythic+, LAZY.


Wake up and smell the roses you little White Knight. Quality and Quantity has taken a massive nosedive. This game is in sub retention mode now. Make as little as content as possible to please them but keep them on the treadmill indefinitely.

Every system is an iteration of base systems already in the game, because it is the same game, smart guy. Do you think new raids, new dungeons, new races, new anything aren't just alterations of the existing systems in new ways? Do you think scenarios aren't just tiny, easymode 3-person dungeons? That LFR is somehow not just a raid instance tuned down? That Flying isn't just a toggleable, mount and spell specific version of swimming that existed in the game from day one in GM commands?

The point is Legion added a large number of those iterations, unlike an expansion like Wrath, or BC, or Cata. Arathi Blizzard is a version of an existing BG that's terrain alterations make it play quite differently, and that makes use of a system new to BGs, very limited sight and targeting. World quests are a continually rolling selection of dailies that mean that, unlike MoP, the king of daily expansions, you can do all the WQs you want, go have lunch and come back to some more.

I brought up re-used rooms and dungeons because you yourself tried to overstate the content featured in Wrath by pretending that the ICC patch actually had 3 new dungeons, when what it really had was one quick dungeon and two, two-room mini dungeons. Pet dungeons are simply an example of content that was added to Legion where content wasn't added to other expansions. If you want to argue that it's a small amount of content, go for it. But it's still something Legion has that every expansions sans MoP doesn't.

Timewalking raids were one of the most requested forms of content around.

"I don't have a counter-argument, so I'll just type 'haha' a bunch as if it somehow proves anything."

Of course, a post where I very obviously pointed out how Wrath was a shitty expansion lacking in unique content is "white knighting" for Blizzard. If you're going to just vomit out buzzwords, please at least understand what they mean and when it is appropriate to use them.

[rda]

Find you a similar system Legion enabled? Patch scaled dungeons that keep gear drops in instances actually relevant throughout the expansion instead of reducing them to point farming. Scaling AP that means dailies are relevant long after you would have very easily hit exalted and completely outgeared faction rewards in previous expansions. Prestiged honor levels that reward you continuing to PvP long after you've got the gear you want.

Scaling, scaling, scaling in order to reuse same content over and over (and over and over and over). And be selling those piles of scaling and reuse that take nearly no time to implement for the same price as before, while spending a small portion of previous effort.

That's the addition of Legion, yes. Exactly like was said.

For some reason you think this is a good addition.

Keep running timewalking mythic+ tier 118 then.

[Hitei]

Scaling, scaling, scaling in order to reuse same content over and over (and over and over and over). And be selling those piles of scaling and reuse that take nearly no time to implement for the same price as before, while spending a small portion of previous effort.

That's the addition of Legion, yes. Exactly like was said.

For some reason you think this is a good addition.

Yep, you're right. Legion only uses scaling and didn't add any of the aforementioned systems or Cathedral, Seat of the Triumvirate, and Karazhan with completely altered/new bosses and new areas alongside that scaling, along with a myriad of other random pieces of content that along the way unlike other expansions.

I'd better go unsub in response to this unprecedented content drought and just hope 8.0 returns to the glorious days of farming herbs while I wait for heroic queue pops because I've already raided that week and literally nothing else in the entire expansion is relevant. Man scaling sucks, where did it all go wrong?

[Nyel]

Game is loosing subs since the introduction of community destroying features: LFD/LFR/CRZ.

Agree. LFD is somewhat okay as a tool but LFR and XRealm were one of the worst additions to the game. LFR with a few tweaks would be okay as well but cross realm killed nearly all server communities especially the ones of smaller servers.
_______

I think some see Legion with rose-colored glasses. Until 7.2 the expansion has been great but with 7.2 and now 7.3 the "downfall" of Legion started. Future won't be very nice to Legion and in retrospective the later stages of Legion will be as hated as Timeless Isle/Tanaan if not more. The longevity of Legion is very short compared to any expansion before WoD. 7.2 and 7.3 did no good to the overall expansion with the even bigger AP and ILVL grind. Getting AP and maxing your weapon was fine as well but the Crucible on top of it is just too much of the same but even worse.

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Not to mention we will be on that shithole for about 11 months.

I really hope not but I'm sure we will.

[rda]

Yep, you're right. Legion only uses scaling and didn't add any of the aforementioned systems or Cathedral, Seat of the Triumvirate, and Karazhan with completely altered/new bosses and new areas alongside that scaling, along with a myriad of other random pieces of content that along the way unlike other expansions.

I'd better go unsub in response to this unprecedented content drought and just hope 8.0 returns to the glorious days of farming herbs while I wait for heroic queue pops because I've already raided that week and literally nothing else in the entire expansion is relevant. Man scaling sucks, where did it all go wrong?

Look, I will try to get through one last time.

You keep arguing as if the choice is between what we used to have and this sorry state of a lot of numeric iterations and then only a little original content. Because in your mind a lot of numeric iterations somehow use up resources for original content AND is otherwise interchangeable with it for players. You are wrong on both counts.

Count 1: A lot of numeric iterations do NOT use almost any development resources, they are nearly free to do as I said. A single developer can do all Legion did here without much sweat. Yes, really.

Count 2: Numeric iterations are NOT interchangeable with original content for players. Players need original content, when they don't have enough of it, they get bored, unsub, everything goes down - like it continues to do in Legion. Numeric iterations are welcome, but only as an augment of original content, as filler for players who want to relax a bit / have something not very important to do.

Now please listen carefully.

Nobody is against scaling and reuse. Nobody is against numeric iterations. It is GOOD to have filler content. The issue is that NEARLY ALL OF LEGION is this filler content brought to you by scaling, scaling, scaling and more scaling. The issue is that Legion does NEARLY NOTHING ELSE. The amount of original content it adds is something you have to use a microscope to see.

You are defending laziness and greed. I don't know how you can be so myopic. You don't know what takes time to implement and what doesn't, fine, it is clear as day. But then ask instead of stating. And certainly stop arguing from the position of ignorance when it is explained to you with such abundant detail.

[Drekmar]

Agree. LFD is somewhat okay as a tool but LFR and XRealm were one of the worst additions to the game. LFR with a few tweaks would be okay as well but cross realm killed nearly all server communities especially the ones of smaller servers.
_______

I think some see Legion with rose-colored glasses. Until 7.2 the expansion has been great but with 7.2 and now 7.3 the "downfall" of Legion started. Future won't be very nice to Legion and in retrospective the later stages of Legion will be as hated as Timeless Isle/Tanaan if not more. The longevity of Legion is very short compared to any expansion before WoD. 7.2 and 7.3 did no good to the overall expansion with the even bigger AP and ILVL grind. Getting AP and maxing your weapon was fine as well but the Crucible on top of it is just too much of the same but even worse.

7.2 was terribad, even 7.2.5 was better. I like 7.3 though, did the whole thing on PTR several times, and will do it several times on live too.

[Hitei]

Look, I will try to get through one last time.

You keep arguing as if the choice is between what we used to have and this sorry state of a lot of numeric iterations and then only a little original content. Because in your mind a lot of numeric iterations somehow use up resources for original content AND is otherwise interchangeable with it for players. You are wrong on both counts.

Count 1: A lot of numeric iterations do NOT use almost any development resources, they are nearly free to do as I said. A single developer can do all Legion did here without much sweat. Yes, really.

Count 2: Numeric iterations are NOT interchangeable with original content for players. Players need original content, when they don't have enough of it, they get bored, unsub, everything goes down - like it continues to do in Legion. Numeric iterations are welcome, but only as an augment of original content, as filler for players who want to relax a bit / have something not very important to do.

Now please listen carefully.

Nobody is against scaling and reuse. Nobody is against numeric iterations. It is GOOD to have filler content. The issue is that NEARLY ALL OF LEGION is this filler content brought to you by scaling, scaling, scaling and more scaling. The issue is that Legion does NEARLY NOTHING ELSE. The amount of original content it adds is something you have to use a microscope to see.

You are defending laziness and greed. I don't know how you can be so myopic. You don't know what takes time to implement and what doesn't, fine, it is clear as day. But then ask instead of stating. And certainly stop arguing from the position of ignorance when it is explained to you with such abundant detail.

No, it's okay. I get it it. Nearly every patch in Legion has had no content besides "numeric iterations".

The devs are all super lazy and Legion absolutely didn't have any new dungeons added after release, or any events, or any new quest lines or large areas, or solo challenges, or factions to rep up, or single player scenarios, three person scenarios or invasion point scenarios, or profession updates, or PvP Brawls, or class animations, or dozens of mounts, or hidden puzzle challenges, or pet/toy/mount kill farms, or Darkmoon Faire stuff, or new Brawler's guild fights.

Every patch has just been increased item level for dungeons and a couple world quests, and there's nothing to do. Wowee, Legion sure is bad. Let's all unsub and meet back here in five.

Frankly I probably won't resub until they add in some sort of system that lets you do the quests of the opposite faction and also profession quests for other professions. Because, for some reason every time I go to hit the create character button, I end up clicking next to it instead of on it. Typical Blizzard, not fixing bugs or making content while they reel in the money from making new dungeon difficulties.

[deviantcultist]

Can we get a N'Zoth expansion with new races being Ethereals for Alliance and Naga for Horde in addition to more in-depth customization for existing races?

[rda]

No, it's okay. I get it it. Nearly every patch in Legion has had no content besides "numeric iterations".

The devs are all super lazy and Legion absolutely didn't have any new dungeons added after release, or any events, or any new quest lines or large areas, or solo challenges, or factions to rep up, or single player scenarios, three person scenarios or invasion point scenarios, or profession updates, or PvP Brawls, or class animations, or dozens of mounts, or hidden puzzle challenges, or pet/toy/mount kill farms, or Darkmoon Faire stuff, or new Brawler's guild fights.

Every patch has just been increased item level for dungeons and a couple world quests, and there's nothing to do. Wowee, Legion sure is bad. Let's all unsub and meet back here in five.

Frankly I probably won't resub until they add in some sort of system that lets you do the quests of the opposite faction and also profession quests for other professions. Because, for some reason every time I go to hit the create character button, I end up clicking next to it instead of on it. Typical Blizzard, not fixing bugs or making content while they reel in the money from making new dungeon difficulties.

Do you really think that by sarcastically exaggerating and saying "noooo, they didn't do any original content" you are somehow refuting "they do much less of original content than before and this is bad"?

When your supposed arguments reduce to a silly absolute, I think you realize yourself that you don't have much ground to stand on.

Really, saying "well, you have something" or "I have to think about it" or maybe even "OK, guys, you seem to be right" is fine. Try it sometimes instead of playing a child.

PS: BTW, people who will read your pompous list of all features added by Legion can now wipe their tears and observe how all of this amounts to maybe one big patch. When you have to mention things like "PVP Brawls" (tiny changes to existing BGs, expressed in one line each), "class animations" (silently done all the time, and not even mentioned before) and "new Brawler's guild fights" (about a third of what the first season had and when they had the first season they had to create all of the surrounding gameplay) - and we are through like half of the list already - it simply becomes more obvious how little they are now doing.

[Hitei]

Do you really think that by sarcastically exaggerating and saying "noooo, they didn't do any original content" you are somehow refuting "they do much less of original content than before and this is bad"?

When your supposed arguments reduce to a silly absolute, I think you realize yourself that you don't have much ground to stand on.

Really, saying "well, you have something" or "I have to think about it" or maybe even "OK, guys, you seem to be right" is fine. Try it sometimes instead of playing a child.

Guy, I already said you were right. There's no way all the stuff Legion added mentioned above, in combination with typical raids, is more than Wrath, the greatest expansion of all time where one of the four raid tiers wasn't even new content and another was a dungeon. If only we could go back to this mythical "before" where so much content was heaped on us instead of today where there's no content at all (remember the argent tournament? Man, you could ride a horse! Every day!).

Wow, I'm sorry for coming across as sarcastic and not being able to prepare you a clearly legible list of content that Legion has added that old expansions didn't even come close to. It totally wasn't my intent, I was just so busy unsubbing because I'm so bummed out about all those listed features that don't exist because someone wants to pretend they don't count for some reason.

and we are through like half of the list already - it is patently obvious how little they are now doing.

Now, you'll have to excuse me because: I didn't go to college; but are you sure 3 is "like half" of 16? Because I feel like it's more like 75%.

[Gegecocu]

Why are you guys arguing wheter legion has content or not in a patch 8.0 speculation patch? How is it relevant to the thread?

[rda]

Why are you guys arguing wheter legion has content or not in a patch 8.0 speculation patch? How is it relevant to the thread?

Because when 8.0 comes, it will kind of look like 7.4, and so arguing what 7.x is and isn't helps shed the light onto what 8.0 is going to be.

TLDR: Expect artifact 2.0 / mythic timewarped ulti-flex re-Onyxia in spirit and not much else.

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Now, you'll have to excuse me because: I didn't go to college; but are you sure 3 is "like half" of 16? Because I feel like it's more like 75%.

Wow, you sure got me here. That 3/16 is some distance from half totally shows that I just couldn't say anything regarding the rest of the mighty list. Although maybe I just wanted to save everyone time from not replying point by point *again*.

[Hitei]

Wow, you sure got me here. That 3/16 is some distance from half totally shows that I just couldn't say anything regarding the rest of the mighty list. Although maybe I just had no leg to stand on and wanted to try and pretend 80% of the content you mentioned doesn't exist because it helps my narrative that the amount of content has gone down, even though, without any of that extra content, Legion would still have more original content put into it than WotLK.

If you say so, friend. Hopefully Blizzard will step it up and give us some vrykul on a small island to do dailies about. That's what I call a content update.