1. #1541
    Titan Arbs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jokubas View Post
    Blizzard said that Warlords of Draenor had issues because they hired a larger team and it took longer to get them up to speed than they had planned. The rest can easily be read between the lines. The expansion also had the new player models, the stat squish, and a file system overhaul. Essentially, Warlords of Draenor took up most of Blizzard's resources revamping backend stuff for the game, and it was probably worth it in the long run, but coupled with their training ending up taking longer than they expected, the content of the expansion took a massive hit.

    This actually delayed the release of the expansion in relation to the average timing, but everything else was more or less on schedule. In other words, Warlords of Draenor was only short because it was late and they wanted to get back on schedule, not because it was bad and they wanted to hurry and get us out of it.
    Hasn't the WoW team also transitioned to a new system from the old one they were using. I remember a interview where they were the only team in Blizzard using that old system. I can't think of the name. I'm sure Marla may remember if he wants to chime in.
    Last edited by Arbs; 2017-07-12 at 11:12 PM.
    I don't always hunt things, But when I do, It's because they're things & I'm a Bear.


  2. #1542
    The Lightbringer Fahrad Wagner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marlamin View Post
    Don't forget about 7.3.5.



    ...somewhat implies that a 7.3.5 is coming eventually, but not anytime soon.
    Fair point! It might give us clues for the next expansion though.

  3. #1543
    I think the main thing is that the quality of Warlords of Draenor isn't even that relevant. By the end of the expansion, they were more or less back on track, so the only damage control was to go back to business as normal. The announcement was more or less on schedule.
    Quote Originally Posted by Corroc View Post
    Well this is the important part. Just because you can play it on ptr doesn't mean its published out there. They wont go on and say "we wont talk about argus since you all have been on ptr already and now the whole storyline". We wont have experienced Argus before gamescom. The only thing we really know about it before the patch is released is the kill cinematic of KJ.

    But Nighthold was released before Blizzcon and ToS was the next big thing.

    Well I'll come back to this post in about 2 months and tell "told you so". Because logic.
    I'm not saying they can't announce the next expansion at BlizzCon, but if you look at the history, it would be a late announcement, and there's no particular reason to avoid Gamescom. Burning Crusade, Wrath of the Lich King, Cataclysm, and Mists of Pandaria were all announced before the previous expansion's final patch had been experienced on live servers.

    Now, with all the time gating they've done this expansion, it's definitely possible that they will take a little bit longer to talk about things because they have more to fill that time with, but there's also no reason they can't still fill that time while the expansion is known. If they can make Antorus open relatively close to the next expansion's pre-patch, they might finally close that gap people hate. At the same time, however, that time gating has been pretty controversial and is arguably something to do damage control on itself.
    Last edited by Jokubas; 2017-07-12 at 11:20 PM.

  4. #1544
    The Undying Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arbs View Post
    Hasn't the WoW team also transitioned to a new system from the old one they were using. I remember a interview where they were the only team in Blizzard using that old system. I can't think of the name. I'm sure Marla may remember if he wants to chime in.
    I believe a new file system was changed but I assumed that was under the hood stuff, not something that was a resource eater. WoD may have been a very flawed expansion but some of the things we got out of it(Like new character models) were a boon for the game.
    #TeamLegion

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  5. #1545
    Quote Originally Posted by DelusionalBear View Post
    thats just your assumption and admittedly there is more people who thinks the same, but there is no actual proof of them doing damage control this way. Me for example, I've never considered WoD to be a failure in anyway. Lorewise it was a mess, but not something I concern about myself with. If we start to dissect WoW lore from the beginning its just one big facepalm since the day one.
    Look. I think you may be quite deluded as to how valuable your own opinion is. WoD was a failure. An outside party who has no investment in MMOs or games in general would look at WoD and label it a complete and utter failure in terms of - content, story, gameplay, setting etc. Just about every category it failed.

    WoW/Warcraft storytelling is actually one of the better ones out there in terms of accessibility and peoples ability to relate to it. The story has only started to become bat shit bad in recent years after... You guessed it - WoD. Let's have a time travelling dragon create a portal to an alternate universe so players can travel back in time and fight on Draenor for no reason! Then Gul'Dan comes back to our universe. Wait that Gul'Dan? No, this Gul'Dan. Not the other Gul'Dan.

    Get my point yet?

    Do you forget Blizzard stopped reporting on sub numbers entirely during WoD? I mean, if you were looking for proof?

  6. #1546
    Quote Originally Posted by Jokubas View Post
    Well, even another expansion is a couple more years, and if next expansion deals with N'Zoth, they could do the Void Lords for the following one and get two more years. That still gives World of Warcraft a decently long life (outside of the classic MMOs that are still around, but those have mostly been on life support for years anyway). It's all about the Chronicle though, which painted the Void as the ultimate final villain and as a battle we simply cannot avoid at this point.
    We took 6 expansion to seal Sargeras (but not kill him)... and in this moment no one on Azeroth is aware about N'zoth or even the Void Lord existens... So, even IF we kill N'zoth in the next expansion, doesn't mean we leave Azeroth again to face a Void Lord that no one knows what and where is.

    Blizzard need some times to develope Void Lord figure as a great menace, bigger that Sargeras and the Burning Lergion. With that was easy, thank to Warcraft eritage but this, is something totally new...
    Argus in 2018 My prediction failed in part... But I'm still a Spacegoat

  7. #1547
    Quote Originally Posted by scarecrowz View Post
    Look. I think you may be quite deluded as to how valuable your own opinion is.
    Me being delusional is implied, but I've never said my opinion worth something. Its a discussion board, we're discussing things.

    Quote Originally Posted by scarecrowz View Post
    WoD was a failure. An outside party who has no investment in MMOs or games in general would look at WoD and label it a complete and utter failure in terms of - content, story, gameplay, setting etc. Just about every category it failed.
    Right, people who have nothing to do with MMOs somehow credible to judge it?

    Quote Originally Posted by scarecrowz View Post
    Get my point yet?
    No I don't really. In the first 24 hours WoD has sold 3.3 million copies with number of subscriptions going up above 10 millions. Oh well, if only all failures in the world were that good. Comparing WoD sales and following subscription numbers to WoW earliest days is like the most retarded thing to do ever.

    Quote Originally Posted by scarecrowz View Post
    Do you forget Blizzard stopped reporting on sub numbers entirely during WoD? I mean, if you were looking for proof?
    Because subscription numbers is the first thing you check before playing new game? Them stopping reporting their subscription numbers have more to do with stock markets than with average Joe playing their game. It doesn't prove that they had to urgently announce something to remedy their 'failure'.

  8. #1548
    Fluffy Parrot Marlamin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arbs View Post
    Hasn't the WoW team also transitioned to a new system from the old one they were using. I remember a interview where they were the only team in Blizzard using that old system. I can't think of the name. I'm sure Marla may remember if he wants to chime in.
    There's several things you can be referring to, but you probably mean the CASC filesystem. Pretty huge change indeed, biggest backend change WoW has ever seen. I'm expecting some changes in 8.0 relating to other systems, but we'll see if any more hints pop up before I speculate more on those.

    8.0 will also challenge dataminers a bit more as they've been taking out more and more filenames every major patch which makes it a bit harder for us, 8.0 will probably continue with this trend. For example, we wouldn't have found those Kul Tiras items if it weren't for the icons still having filenames. If those filenames were to go away (which is unlikely, but still) we wouldn't have known it was even Kul Tiras related and might not have picked up on it at all. The datamining community is coming together in this regard though (even rivals!), sharing filenames with each other and developing tools to guess filenames. It's pretty neat and I can ramble on for years but I should probably go sleep.

  9. #1549
    Quote Originally Posted by DelusionalBear View Post
    Me being delusional is implied, but I've never said my opinion worth something. Its a discussion board, we're discussing things.



    Right, people who have nothing to do with MMOs somehow credible to judge it?



    No I don't really. In the first 24 hours WoD has sold 3.3 million copies with number of subscriptions going up above 10 millions. Oh well, if only all failures in the world were that good. Comparing WoD sales and following subscription numbers to WoW earliest days is like the most retarded thing to do ever.



    Because subscription numbers is the first thing you check before playing new game? Them stopping reporting their subscription numbers have more to do with stock markets than with average Joe playing their game. It doesn't prove that they had to urgently announce something to remedy their 'failure'.
    You claim subscription numbers is not a good indication of quality yet you refer to initial sales as a good metric? At this point you must be trolling.

    By your metric No Mans Sky was a great game then? The hundreds of thousands who demanded refunds must mean nothing because the game SOLD SO MANY COPIES AT LAUNCH!!!!!!!!!!

    Warlords was shit on by fans and critics alike.

    WoD was boosted to 10mil subscribers off the back of the WoW movie and the hype train. Nothing else. What other expansion lost 5 million subscribers? Even Blizzards own developers have admitted their own mistakes.

  10. #1550
    Herald of the Titans In Ogres We Trust's Avatar
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    I scratched my posterior... also, in the morning, I'm having pancakes for breakfast. Umm... !

    The hype train needs some fuel!!!

  11. #1551
    Quote Originally Posted by scarecrowz View Post
    You claim subscription numbers is not a good indication of quality yet you refer to initial sales as a good metric? At this point you must be trolling.
    You clearly don't understand what I'm trying to say here. Let me try again. Whether you and I consider WoD a failure or not, money alone from initial sales and at least couple months of subscription is enough to fund the creation of a new MMO game from scratch. So, WoD performance has nothing to do with Blizzard announcing Legion at Gamescom. There is literally no proof of that. You just like this idea because it sounds somewhat logical, but for all you know Blizzard could have planned that announcement all along.

    Yes they admitted having some problems. But they probably can tell these stories about each and every expansion. Some have bigger issues like WoD.

    When I was younger I could run faster and longer. These day I prefer not to run at all, unless my life depends on it. Should I consider myself a failure then? Maybe dig my own grave and lie in it? I mean whats the point if I can't run as I used to? Same with Blizzard. Their sales and subscriptions numbers for WoD might not have been as good as some suits in management expected, but they don't need to be. They have Heartstone, SCII, DIII, Overwatch now. All these games combined bring them enough money so they can took a hit or two along the way. And they're definitely not desperate to announce their expansions sooner just because their sales dropped. Which was the main point of this discussion.
    Last edited by DelusionalBear; 2017-07-13 at 02:33 AM.

  12. #1552
    Quote Originally Posted by DelusionalBear View Post
    You clearly don't understand what I'm trying to say here. Let me try again. Whether you and I consider WoD a failure or not, money alone from initial sales and at least couple months of subscription is enough to fund the creation of a new MMO game from scratch. So, WoD performance has nothing to do with Blizzard announcing Legion at Gamescom. There is literally no proof of that. You just like this idea because it sounds somewhat logical, but for all you know Blizzard could have planned that announcement all along.

    Yes they admitted having some problems. But they probably can tell these stories about each and every expansion. Some have bigger issues like WoD.

    When I was younger I could run faster and longer. These day I prefer not to run at all, unless my life depends on it. Should I consider myself a failure then? Maybe dig my own grave and lie in it? I mean whats the point if I can't run as I used to? Same with Blizzard. Their sales and subscriptions numbers for WoD might not have been as good as some suits in management expected, but they don't need to be. They have Heartstone, SCII, DIII, Overwatch now. All these games combined bring them enough money so they can took a hit or two along the way. And they're definitely not desperate to announce their expansions sooner just because their sales dropped. Which was the main point of this discussion.
    Literally the dumbest analogy I've ever read.

    Are you a professional runner? No.

    Is Blizzard a game development company still bringing out AAA expansions to a AAA product? Yes. Was WoD dogshit? Yes.

    Why are you still arguing the point? This is a WoW discussion forum. Not Overwatch, Hearthstone etc. We aren't arguing Blizzards merit as a company.

    WoD was DOGSHIT. Everything that has happened since that point has been because of that.

  13. #1553
    High Overlord
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    Wrath remake with the HotS devs fucking it up this time.

  14. #1554
    Herald of the Titans In Ogres We Trust's Avatar
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    Patch 8.0 Challenge: Easter Egg Hunt

    I'm scouting Azsuna for signs of Kul Tiras.

    - - - Updated - - -

    At the moment, we have the following:

    a) Tirasian armor from quest rewards at Shackle's Den.

    P.S. Also, if I had to take a guess, Azsuna, the Eye of Azshara, and Stormheim are the best locations to find an Easter Egg.

  15. #1555
    Quote Originally Posted by scarecrowz View Post
    Was WoD dogshit? Yes.
    um. no. It was okay. Look I can see you don't like me very much, so I cut it short - regardless of your opinion on that you still don't know shit and can't prove that Blizzard did it because you didn't like WoD. Having a fanclub around here isn't proving anything either.

  16. #1556
    Has anyone seen these yet?



    My guess is Blizzard is seeding a sub-race of void-touched elves with Alleria as the racial leader. *Tinfoil hat*

    Source: Handclaw from SOL

  17. #1557
    Quote Originally Posted by Myrok View Post
    We're not getting a South Seas expansion; we're getting a retconned Kul Tiras that's coupled with the surrounding isles of Baradin Bay. Also, Zandalar and Kezan are too important to merely be "zones" in an expansion (they'll be featured in their own expansion settings).
    This would be the lamest and shittiest thing they could ever do. And the first time they'd give me (and alot of people) a reason to unsub.
    Quote Originally Posted by checking facts View Post
    azshara whispers: if you're nice to me, I might let you bang me.
    Quote Originally Posted by lordatomsk View Post
    Bitch you need to go eat a fucking bullet you fucking cunt

  18. #1558
    Quote Originally Posted by Seasz View Post
    This would be the lamest and shittiest thing they could ever do. And the first time they'd give me (and alot of people) a reason to unsub.
    You have to agree with him though.

    Blizzard loves a "Continent" expansion with Zones. We will likely get Kul Tiras as a continent with some zones that were in the lore and some made up ones to boot.

    What we should be getting is a South Seas expansion with boats and Islands as "Zones". I just don't see it happening with how lazy Blizzard is.

  19. #1559
    Quote Originally Posted by Akande Ogundimu View Post
    maybe 6 years from now (in 3 expansions from now) but let's be honest, most of us are probably not going to be around then.
    You severely underestimate WoW fans. As long as this game exists in some shape and form, we'll be back no matter how many times we quit.

  20. #1560
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Kosez View Post
    You severely underestimate WoW fans. As long as this game exists in some shape and form, we'll be back no matter how many times we quit.
    Amen to that.

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