Dark Arbiter

[Zeol]

Is the DA build still better even without certain legendaries?

[Piz813]

Yes even without CoF

[Yirman]

Depends on the content you are doing as well..

If you are doing Mythic+ content at +10 or higher on a Fortified week Defile definitely has its place as well, even more so if you have Death March. However, during Tyrannical I would personally still go for a DA build.

For raiding I don't think there is any boss in ToS where I would pick Defile over DA.

[Piz813]

Defile worked well on M Hajartararaa but that's it. Soon as I dropped it on mistress the tanks ran away. Bleh

[Deleted]

Defile worked well on M Hajartararaa but that's it. Soon as I dropped it on mistress the tanks ran away. Bleh

I use defile so little that when i do, many of my guildies assume its bad and try not to stand in it

[Dracovian]

So even without any of the good legendaries DA is the way to go for UH?

[Nephcyte]

So i dont have the shoulders, my mastery is at 65% and haste at 14% (so i dont even have the baseline haste needed) with shitloads of crit. Is defile and Soul reaper really that weak compared to DA? I have 905 CoF, 930 Eye of command and 925 Enginie. CoF and eye of command result in higher dps.

I used cold heart and pyrydaz which gave me more haste and mastery but i recently looted the ring and my sim dps dropped by 30k on ST and didnt really skyrocket on 4-5 targets either. Is sim for ring bugged or whats going on here? Or is it because i lost like 10% mastery and dont have minimum 15% haste anymore?

[Bunchy]

I use defile so little that when i do, many of my guildies assume its bad and try not to stand in it

Really I think they have ptsd from "SPREAD".
That's if they know anything.

[Deleted]

I'm also getting some strange results when I sim defile plus leg hat and chest.

Almost same single target as da.

I game it seems very similar too...i had a 9.75m chest hit using defile

[Raiz]

Really I think they have ptsd from "SPREAD".
That's if they know anything.

Well, let's be honest here : it took me me a few weeks to understand that it was the Defile's aoe (same sh.t with poison bomb). And my main is dk unholy... It's just that I didn't play with this talent nor did I try. So I can't imagine what it feels like for someone who never played a dk.
Not to mention this talent is rarely picked.

[Scrotch]

Despite the meme tier status of DA on the forums and the DK discord, it's not so far ahead that you can't get comparable results with SR depending on your level of content. I can't speak for bleeding edge mythic raiders and their end of the gear scaling pool, but at heroic and using SR, I can still parse at upwards of 95% for my item level on purely single target fights like goroth.

DA sims nicely, but dropping clawing shadows for unholy frenzy in the cookie cutter DA build loses a good chunk of your ability to dps while dealing with mechanics/movement in a real raiding environment. All I can suggest is to try both and see which play style fits better for you. And if you end up doing better with or preferring SR, then don't give a second thought to the echo chamber trying to tell you how to play.

[Deleted]

Not sure about Sr...da seems considerably better though I do have 4pc cof leg shoulders

Defile with leg hat and chest is surprising me at the moment however I need to test it more before I make a poor attempt as a priority in simc

[Deleted]

I'm not using Defile on Harjatan(spelling?), but it seems quite good on Mistress. Just wait until the AOE shit (jellyfishes, "move away from middle" something, etc) happens, tank pulls the boss away, and then drop Defile. Also it comes in handy on Desolate Host spirit realm add killing, if they're a bit clumped up... But yeah, otherwise I use DA too.

Funny how Blizzard makes classes switch talents. They really fail to make them equal so you're able to pick the one you like. Before 7.2.5 it was SR all the way, now it's DA almost all the way. Also look at how Frost "had" to switch from MG to BoS... I wouldn't be surprised if they'd buff Defile so much for Argus that it'd be the go to talent even for single target, just to screw with us again, lol.

[xpire]

I'm not using Defile on Harjatan(spelling?), but it seems quite good on Mistress. Just wait until the AOE shit (jellyfishes, "move away from middle" something, etc) happens, tank pulls the boss away, and then drop Defile. Also it comes in handy on Desolate Host spirit realm add killing, if they're a bit clumped up... But yeah, otherwise I use DA too.

Funny how Blizzard makes classes switch talents. They really fail to make them equal so you're able to pick the one you like. Before 7.2.5 it was SR all the way, now it's DA almost all the way. Also look at how Frost "had" to switch from MG to BoS... I wouldn't be surprised if they'd buff Defile so much for Argus that it'd be the go to talent even for single target, just to screw with us again, lol.

Defile might be fun for DPS whoring on those fights, but honestly on mythic having ST damage where it matters means so much more, and if a raid comp ever needs AOE damage there are other classes that are much better equipped to do so. There's literally 0 reason you'd ever go defile on Mistress or host mythic.

[Deleted]

Defile might be fun for DPS whoring on those fights, but honestly on mythic having ST damage where it matters means so much more, and if a raid comp ever needs AOE damage there are other classes that are much better equipped to do so. There's literally 0 reason you'd ever go defile on Mistress or host mythic.

Thing is though outside of da Windows every 1.5 mins, defile might do more single target?

[Nangz]

Thing is though outside of da Windows every 1.5 mins, defile might do more single target?

This reads "When not using my cooldown the non-cooldown talent is better".

Of course every other talent is better in the downtime between DAs, but that doesn't mean its more effective overall.

[Deleted]

This reads "When not using my cooldown the non-cooldown talent is better".

Of course every other talent is better in the downtime between DAs, but that doesn't mean its more effective overall.

I was more thinking that if one needs burst outside of CDs then maybe cs and defile might help progress more than da.

Can't really think of any tos m fights that might need that though...

[Saybel]

Defile is for padding, let your boomkins pad, thats what you bring them for anyway.

[Indil]

My castigator build is coming closer and closer to Da as the gear progresses. I really think it will outscale Da build! currently @ 930 ilvl

[hellhamster]

My castigator build is coming closer and closer to Da as the gear progresses. I really think it will outscale Da build! currently @ 930 ilvl

You mean with Soul Reaper?