View Poll Results: Azhara or Arthas

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  • Azhara

    228 50.22%
  • Lich king

    226 49.78%
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  1. #341
    Quote Originally Posted by bufferunderrun View Post
    is that still canon after the whole illidan is the child of light and darkness story of legion? At this point honestly i don't know if we can make those comparisons without taking into account how blizzard bend and twist it's characters to fit the story completely disregarding past event.

    I mean Malfurion was considered one of the most powerful mortal on azeroth and blizzard has him almost die to a random axe hit in teldrassil, they boosted sylvanas with not apparent reason, nerfed thrall with a poor excuse and so on; it's really hard to imagine Azshara losing to arthas unless he is boosted by some death god that randomly pop out (someone on the level of void lord not the stupid bromwswadi)
    To be fair... im not sure if they have retconned the wc3 fight in Icecrown :/...

    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    Considering the only person she sways in the current story is fodder NPC Ashvane, I'd advance that this says more about demons and how weak-willed they are than about Azshara. And I strongly doubt Bolvar would even listen to her for a fraction of a second in the first place, Arthas is right out.

    In terms of power we can't know. We know the LK is weaker than Lei Shen, but he was an already mighty Mogu who absorbed the power of Aman'thul himself. Azshara scared Mannoroth shitless, but he gets one-shot by Grom every other day so his opinion is suspect.

    If we count armies the Naga don't stand much of a chance against the Scourge it seems. 1v1 Azshara's magical prowess might win out but it's impossible to be sure.
    Well current story doesnt meassure all her power at all... i mean, she was the Night Elf Queen undisputed and made every single elf fall before her. They even replaced their goddess (Elune) for her... add it to the fact that she became a demi-god and that says a lot about her... on the other hand, Lich King required FIVE years to choose between Ner'zhul (an Orc powerful, yet broken Shaman) and Arthas (a broken Paladin) and his decision was to merge both conciousness... so if Azshara made her will fight for the Lich King "mind"... im not sure the Lich King would reject her that easily.

    On the Mannoroth topic it has several explanations... in WoD Gorehowl was heavily retconned to be extremely empowered, they said that Gorehowl holds the hearts of six legendary gronns so it is an extraordinarily-absurd strong weapon which can destroy mighty creatures easily. Before that... in WC3 when Grom kills Mannoroth and Cenarius it is mostly because he had drink Mannoroth blood and had become fel.

    And about armies... there are naga tribes literally EVERYWHERE, they are one of the factions (alongside the trolls and undeads) which can pretty much appear ANYWHERE and can potentially be almost endless. If they fought with their brain, they would only fight on water terrains which would be better "ground" for them than for undeads so i wouldnt say undead armies are greatly above nagas (id say 60-40 in favor of the scourge, but terrain advantages can change it).

  2. #342
    Immortal ArgusTheUnmaker's Avatar
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    The Lich King: Thought he could destroy the Legion by himself with enough prep time. Strong enough to destroy the heroes with ease back in Wrath, and is basically immune to mortal attacks other than the plague.

    Queen Azshara: Base power was surpassed by Archimonde, Kil'jaeden, and Sargeras alone, serves under N'zoth and gained a MASSIVE power boost because of it, capable or raising and drowning entire lands and cities, and has the power to surpass even Sargeras (Thanks to the Void, the Pillars of Creation, as well as Azeroth's Titan within N'zoth's grasp). Oh, and she's also magically badass, smart, and can likely turn the Lich King into a teacup with just a snap from her fingers.

    Azshara easily solos.

  3. #343
    Let's break it down between 1v1 and army wise.

    The Lich King's army is leagues above Azshara's underwater army even with faceless assistance.

    The core of the Scourge took up a whole expansion with many zones involving it and you can still feel his presence even in zones without the scourge. Azshara's core army takes up a single patch. Azshara has sent many scouting parties around Azeroth since vanilla but so did the Lich King's forces. And the LK's army actually did more much more as a big world event effecting all major cities with the plague and necropolis invading.

    1v1 Lich King dominates Azshara without effort or with some effort, I'll say 20% of his powers to deal with her at most. He wipes out the raid of heroes without effort. Now let's see what happens during the Azshara raid fight. She will go down with the help of just Jaina. Out raid beats her and that's it. That's just empowered Gul'dan level and im questioning if it's even at Archimonde and Kil'jaeden's level but we'll see. And this isn't DBZ power level where u can just completely resist weaker attacks. I'm sure our characters gotten stronger and a bit wiser but that doesn't mean we can now suddenly tank LK's attacks unless u counting gameplay which isn't lore.

    N'zoth > Argus > Lk
    Last edited by LarryWithTheWeatherReport; 2019-05-12 at 10:07 PM.
    Sargeras >> N'zoth >> Argus the Unmaker >> Lich King >> Void Lord >> Locus Walker >> Yrel; >> Azshara >> G'hunn>> Jaina >> Sylvanas >> Kil'jaeden >> Archimonde >> Odyn >> Bwonsamdi>> Helya >> Xavius >> Mutated Garrosh >> Deathwing >> Yogg Saron >> Hakkar >> Ragnaros >> Krag'Wa >> Alleria >> Illidan >> Anduin

  4. #344
    Quote Originally Posted by ArgusTheUnmaker View Post
    The Lich King: Thought he could destroy the Legion by himself with enough prep time. Strong enough to destroy the heroes with ease back in Wrath, and is basically immune to mortal attacks other than the plague.

    Queen Azshara: Base power was surpassed by Archimonde, Kil'jaeden, and Sargeras alone, serves under N'zoth and gained a MASSIVE power boost because of it, capable or raising and drowning entire lands and cities, and has the power to surpass even Sargeras (Thanks to the Void, the Pillars of Creation, as well as Azeroth's Titan within N'zoth's grasp). Oh, and she's also magically badass, smart, and can likely turn the Lich King into a teacup with just a snap from her fingers.

    Azshara easily solos.
    You do realize that Azsharah actually got weaker after the WotA, since most of her power came from the well and her constantly drinking from it/experimenting with it. You see what Azerite can do, no imagine her boosting herself up for a few thousands years with that type of stuff. The N'zoth boost can't compensate that loss after the well collapsed. Plus, where exactly was it said that she suddenly has the power to raise/sink entire land masses? Source or i call headcanon. And Sargeras would effortlessly stomp her out, even with all Pillars of creation, the well of eternity and N'zoths boost at once. They are not comparable, sorry.
    Not saying the Lk would win in a straight up 1on1 fight, but you heavily over-rate Azshara.
    Last edited by Houle; 2019-05-12 at 10:20 PM.

  5. #345
    Quote Originally Posted by Houle View Post
    You do realize that Azsharah actually got weaker after the WotA, since most of her power came from the well and her constantly drinking from it/experimenting with it. You see what Azerite can do, no imagine her boosting herself up for a few thousands years with that type of stuff. The N'zoth boost can't compensate that loss after the well collapsed. Plus, where exactly was it said that she suddenly has the power to raise/sink entire land masses? Source or i call headcanon. And Sargeras would effortlessly stomp her out, even with all Pillars of creation, the well of eternity and N'zoths boost at once. They are not comparable, sorry.
    Not saying the Lk would win in a straight up 1on1 fight, but you heavily over-rate Azshara.
    I like this stupid argument about the loss of power after the Well of Eternity. Let me ask you one question.
    At what time was Xavius stronger — with the Well of Eternity or with the power of N'zot?

  6. #346
    Quote Originally Posted by darkoms View Post
    I like this stupid argument about the loss of power after the Well of Eternity. Let me ask you one question.
    At what time was Xavius stronger — with the Well of Eternity or with the power of N'zot?
    I like you comparing Xavius with fucking Azshara. One was an advisor, the other the queen who literally used all her time to power herself up with the well. Yeah, stupid comparison

  7. #347
    Quote Originally Posted by Houle View Post
    I like you comparing Xavius with fucking Azshara. One was an advisor, the other the queen who literally used all her time to power herself up with the well. Yeah, stupid comparison
    That is, Xavius did not spend time at the well? Did not use it?
    Again. Xavius perfectly shows that the gift of the Old God surpasses the power of the Well.

  8. #348
    Quote Originally Posted by darkoms View Post
    That is, Xavius did not spend time at the well? Did not use it?
    Again. Xavius perfectly shows that the gift of the Old God surpasses the power of the Well.
    Again, he didn't power himself up with it like Azshara did, not even close. Literally all she did in her later years was using the well to power herself up. Xavius did no such thing, to our knowledge. And Xavius received a buff from both Sargeras and N'zoth, so that argument is pointless anyway. Ofc a buff from Sargeras himself combined with one from N'zoth will make him powerful af.
    Last edited by Houle; 2019-05-14 at 11:01 PM.

  9. #349
    Quote Originally Posted by Houle View Post
    Again, he didn't power himself up with it like Azshara did, not even close. Literally all she did in her later years was using the well to power herself up. Xavius did no such thing, to our knowledge. And Xavius received a buff from both Sargeras and N'zoth, so that argument is pointless anyway. Ofc a buff from Sargeras himself combined with one from N'zoth will make him powerful af.
    What nonsense. All the Highborne spent a lot of time at the Well, Azshara just did it more than the others, it does not mean that Xavius was some kind of nonentity without magical power.
    My God, what does Sargeras have to do with it? You say that Azshara became weaker after losing the Well, I say that N'zot could have made her even stronger, and the situation with Xavius proves it

  10. #350
    Immortal ArgusTheUnmaker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Houle View Post
    You do realize that Azsharah actually got weaker after the WotA, since most of her power came from the well and her constantly drinking from it/experimenting with it. You see what Azerite can do, no imagine her boosting herself up for a few thousands years with that type of stuff. The N'zoth boost can't compensate that loss after the well collapsed. Plus, where exactly was it said that she suddenly has the power to raise/sink entire land masses? Source or i call headcanon. And Sargeras would effortlessly stomp her out, even with all Pillars of creation, the well of eternity and N'zoths boost at once. They are not comparable, sorry.
    Not saying the Lk would win in a straight up 1on1 fight, but you heavily over-rate Azshara.
    Except she never got weaker. Hell, it's clearly stated that she's stronger now than she ever was way back in her "prime".

  11. #351
    Quote Originally Posted by darkoms View Post
    What nonsense. All the Highborne spent a lot of time at the Well, Azshara just did it more than the others, it does not mean that Xavius was some kind of nonentity without magical power.
    My God, what does Sargeras have to do with it? You say that Azshara became weaker after losing the Well, I say that N'zot could have made her even stronger, and the situation with Xavius proves it
    Lol, where did i ever say Xavius didn't have magical power? Where?? Ofc he had, and ofc he used the well. FFs you just said it yourself, Azshara just did it more than the others. MUCH MORE than the others, which is kind of a big deal. She became so incredibly OP because of her talent and her use of the well.
    "What does Sargeras have to do with this?" Well maybe the fact that you are trying to say that the N'zoth buff was what made him more powerful than he was before, with the well, when it was actually not only N'zoth but Sargeras who gave him that big power-up. You know, making him a satyr, etc? Xavius is so much more powerful than with the well because he got a big power-boost from Sargeras AND N'zoth.
    But ill stop now, since im almost sure you are (badly) trolling at this point.

    Quote Originally Posted by ArgusTheUnmaker View Post
    Except she never got weaker. Hell, it's clearly stated that she's stronger now than she ever was way back in her "prime".
    Yeah you have to give me a canon source for that. Where in canon is it stated that shes stronger now? Also still missing the part where its stated that she is powerful enough to move entire land masses.
    Last edited by Houle; 2019-05-15 at 01:41 AM.

  12. #352
    Arthas = he dies before before he swings his sword.
    Bolvar would rape her ass.

  13. #353
    For those saying Arthas utterly destroyed Illidan during the Frozen Throne, read the Arthas Novel. Its actually quite one handly in Illidan's favor until he gets over confident and arrogant, and makes a stupid mistake, he had the fight in the bag. It was very similar to the Red Viper(Martell) vs the Mountain(Clegane) in Game of Thrones where Martell man handles the Mountain until he gets sloppy and stupid and let's the Mountain get a blow in.

  14. #354
    Quote Originally Posted by Houle View Post
    Lol, where did i ever say Xavius didn't have magical power? Where?? Ofc he had, and ofc he used the well. FFs you just said it yourself, Azshara just did it more than the others. MUCH MORE than the others, which is kind of a big deal. She became so incredibly OP because of her talent and her use of the well.
    "What does Sargeras have to do with this?" Well maybe the fact that you are trying to say that the N'zoth buff was what made him more powerful than he was before, with the well, when it was actually not only N'zoth but Sargeras who gave him that big power-up. You know, making him a satyr, etc? Xavius is so much more powerful than with the well because he got a big power-boost from Sargeras AND N'zoth.
    But ill stop now, since im almost sure you are (badly) trolling at this point.


    Yeah you have to give me a canon source for that. Where in canon is it stated that shes stronger now? Also still missing the part where its stated that she is powerful enough to move entire land masses.
    How do you know how much more time Azshara spent at the Well? Somewhere it says, who did Xavius spend with him for 2 hours a day, and Azshara for 8 hours?
    Oh god, what nonsense. Sargeras made it so significant that Malfurion could turn it into a tree, cool. In fact, Xavius, after becoming a satyr, no showed any exploits or power. Only after he became the Lord of Nightmare he look truly powerful.

  15. #355
    Quote Originally Posted by Houle View Post
    You do realize that Azsharah actually got weaker after the WotA, since most of her power came from the well and her constantly drinking from it/experimenting with it. You see what Azerite can do, no imagine her boosting herself up for a few thousands years with that type of stuff.
    The Well is diluted Azerite from the wound left by the death of Y'shaarj. Azshara build an underwater kingdom at the bottom of the Maelstrom, geographically right on top of that wound. She is most likely sipping Azerite for the past few millenia

  16. #356
    Quote Originally Posted by darkoms View Post
    How do you know how much more time Azshara spent at the Well? Somewhere it says, who did Xavius spend with him for 2 hours a day, and Azshara for 8 hours?
    Oh god, what nonsense. Sargeras made it so significant that Malfurion could turn it into a tree, cool. In fact, Xavius, after becoming a satyr, no showed any exploits or power. Only after he became the Lord of Nightmare he look truly powerful.
    Lol, the toll is starting to get strong with this one. Maybe because she is the fucking queen, lived right next to it, was literally obsessed with the damn thing, and is the only one who is specificlly mentioned to use the well all the time?
    By now its clear u are either a real angry little Azshara fanboy or just trolling. Yes, that power-up from Sargeras was immense, wether you believe it or not, otherwise he wouldn't have given him one. ANd Malfurion, now thta u mention him, also fought off Azshara in Cata at the darkshore, just like that. Yor precious, n'zoth-buffed Azshara got fought of by Malfurion. The dudes just that OP, get over it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    The Well is diluted Azerite from the wound left by the death of Y'shaarj. Azshara build an underwater kingdom at the bottom of the Maelstrom, geographically right on top of that wound. She is most likely sipping Azerite for the past few millenia
    Now that actually may be possible. But the well exploded, and so far we've yet to see if any part of the Maelstrom is still an open wound where Azerite could spawn. I would think that the Naga would've been quite more buffed if they had so much of that stuff for 10k years. In BfA its shown more like they recently started using it, like everyone else, after the wound of the sword made it appear everywhere. But hey, you never know.
    Last edited by Houle; 2019-05-15 at 11:43 AM.

  17. #357
    Quote Originally Posted by Houle View Post
    Lol, the toll is starting to get strong with this one. Maybe because she is the fucking queen, lived right next to it, was literally obsessed with the damn thing, and is the only one who is specificlly mentioned to use the well all the time?
    By now its clear u are either a real angry little Azshara fanboy or just trolling. Yes, that power-up from Sargeras was immense, wether you believe it or not, otherwise he wouldn't have given him one. ANd Malfurion, now thta u mention him, also fought off Azshara in Cata at the darkshore, just like that. Yor precious, n'zoth-buffed Azshara got fought of by Malfurion. The dudes just that OP, get over it.

    All the highborne lived near the Well, did you ever see the art of Zin-Azshari from the Chronicles?
    And of course you can prove that power-up from Sargeras was immense?
    Malfurion did not fight her, she just came and said that she was distracting him from Hyjal, after which she just left, and he ran to Hyjal

  18. #358
    Quote Originally Posted by darkoms View Post
    All the highborne lived near the Well, did you ever see the art of Zin-Azshari from the Chronicles?
    And of course you can prove that power-up from Sargeras was immense?
    Malfurion did not fight her, she just came and said that she was distracting him from Hyjal, after which she just left, and he ran to Hyjal
    My god you don't get it, do you? YES, they had a city around that well, but Azshara literally chilled next to it ALL THE TIME (the dungeon in Cata even confirms it) and was boosting herself up with it. Do YOU have any source that any other highborne did it to the same extent? No? Then they didn't.
    Also, dude, every time Sargeras has given someone a power-up it was immense. Why in all hells would he do differently with Xavius? Also, can you prove that it wasn't? If anything, he showed how much more powerful he became in the fight against Malfurion later (who is literally a demigod at this point).
    Fair enough about Azshara, just looked it up again, she didn't fight. Which yet again raises the question why she didn't just obliterate him and us if she is that powerful. Simple, because the outcome wouldn't have been that much of a sure thing.
    All in all it comes down to one thing: power boost from azeroth (the most powerful titan in existance)>power boost from n'zoth (the weakest old god)
    Last edited by Houle; 2019-05-15 at 12:38 PM.

  19. #359
    Quote Originally Posted by Houle View Post
    Now that actually may be possible. But the well exploded, and so far we've yet to see if any part of the Maelstrom is still an open wound where Azerite could spawn. I would think that the Naga would've been quite more buffed if they had so much of that stuff for 10k years. In BfA its shown more like they recently started using it, like everyone else, after the wound of the sword made it appear everywhere. But hey, you never know.
    We've never really been to the bottom of the Maelstrom though.

  20. #360
    Quote Originally Posted by ArgusTheUnmaker View Post
    and has the power to surpass even Sargeras

    Azshara easily solos.
    no. azshara isn't even a flea compared to a fully realized titan. she doesn't even seem to be more powerful than n'zoth, who was the weakest old god. y'shaarj, the strongest, was popped like a zit by just aman'thul's hand.

    even if n'zoth's plans were to succeed, they're not taking the titan's powers. they're corrupting her to void. azshara gets nothing but what her own dabbles in the void and n'zoth's gifts give her.

    but yes, she would beat the lich king, and it might actually be kinda easy.
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