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  1. #1

    I just can't give up cof

    I wanted a funnier title, sorry

    Anyway...i just can't not use convergents of fate. Valk lining up with appoc and dt just feels like it outweighs the extra on pull burst.

    Should I be ashamed?

  2. #2
    Legendary! slime's Avatar
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    If it's high Ilvl why should you.

  3. #3
    It's 885 other options are 30 higher but I like the flow it brings to our 'rotation'

    Not using cof Sims about 60k more

  4. #4
    I'm just going to keep using CoF till 7.3. Then again I have a 910.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by EodynTheDK View Post
    I'm just going to keep using CoF till 7.3. Then again I have a 910.
    It's not the greatest m+ to pug

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Dkwhyevernot View Post
    ...

    Should I be ashamed?
    I don't like Shadow Infusion + CoF dependence on high uptime to align well each time. It feels like playing the tard BoS-Frost DK from NH all over again, tunnel boss, ignore soaks just to be able to align CD's.

    My CoF is only 905 and I got other 930 options with similar/higher simDPS. A good burst every 2mins without being a useless tunnel DPS feels much better, than playing with CoF and hopping for a boss kill with 1 extra DA or the whole hassle is for nothing.

    But I am just a casual with 933 ilvl and just a bit above 1.250.000 simDPS doing heroic content only.
    Last edited by Ange; 2017-08-07 at 10:09 AM.

  7. #7
    Pit Lord Nnyco's Avatar
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    cof is extremly overated
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Crabs have been removed from the game... because if I see another one I’m just going to totally lose it. *sobbing* I’m sorry, I just can’t right now... I just... OK just give me a minute, I’ll be OK..

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Ange View Post
    I don't like Shadow Infusion + CoF dependence on high uptime to align well each time. It feels like playing the tard BoS-Frost DK from NH all over again, tunnel boss, ignore soaks just to be able to align CD's.

    My CoF is only 905 and I got other 930 options with similar/higher simDPS. A good burst every 2mins without being a useless tunnel DPS feels much better, than playing with CoF and hopping for a boss kill with 1 extra DA or the whole hassle is for nothing.

    But I am just a casual with 933 ilvl and just a bit above 1.250.000 simDPS doing heroic content only.
    Now you see I do like how brings valk to line up with appoc.

    If I don't use cof I hate that waiting around filling in for another 30sec or so

  9. #9
    Dreadlord Saybel's Avatar
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    Prefer none CoF gameplay, way less prone to CoF RNG (sometimes don't have DT up due to too many procs, sometimes get virtually no procs and feel like I have to hold onto everything for ages)

    I prefer just using BRW on CD with DT + valk on CD + apoc on CD without worrying about lining any shit up. Super relaxing gameplay, damage difference is either negligible or a gain because I can use Vial + Specter or Vial + Glaives instead of having to sub 1 trinket for CoF.
    Death Knight
    RIP Breath of Sindragosa - 23/06/2015 - The day fun died.

  10. #10
    If you switch from Shadow Infusion to Infected Claws then it makes life a lot easier. You may also find that without CoF Clawing Shadows sims higher even on single target fights.

    With the Infected Claws build you basically just use everything cooldown and it will naturally sync up with:

    Your First, Third, Fifth etc Apocalypse.
    Every Dark Arbiter.

    So you lose out on a little bonus damage to your Apocalypse ghouls on every second cast but everything else just lines up fine.

    Edit: Just noticed that I said Clawing Shadows where I meant to say Infected Claws. So you drop Shadow Infusion for Infected Claws.
    Last edited by Sulika; 2017-08-08 at 04:44 PM.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Sulika View Post
    If you switch from Shadow Infusion to Clawing Shadows then it makes life a lot easier. You may also find that without CoF Clawing Shadows sims higher even on single target fights.

    With the Clawing Shadows build you basically just use everything cooldown and it will naturally sync up with:

    Your First, Third, Fifth etc Apocalypse.
    Every Dark Arbiter.

    So you lose out on a little bonus damage to your Apocalypse ghouls on every second cast but everything else just lines up fine.
    ta for the suggestion i will give CS a go. So i did and while i prefer the positioning errors CS allows, UF is way to strong for on pull burst (in particular).
    Last edited by Dkwhyevernot; 2017-08-07 at 06:16 PM.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Sulika View Post
    If you switch from Shadow Infusion to Clawing Shadows then it makes life a lot easier. You may also find that without CoF Clawing Shadows sims higher even on single target fights.

    With the Clawing Shadows build you basically just use everything cooldown and it will naturally sync up with:

    Your First, Third, Fifth etc Apocalypse.
    Every Dark Arbiter.

    So you lose out on a little bonus damage to your Apocalypse ghouls on every second cast but everything else just lines up fine.
    I guess the value of the shoulders on the apoc isn't that high?

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Hctaz View Post
    I guess the value of the shoulders on the apoc isn't that high?
    I dunno looking at top ranks and they almost all use shoulders chest and cof

    Maybe my post should been asking which trinket I should pair with it but I'm not in the mood to discuss how much I dislike collecting green balls.

    "Scuse me tanks just passing through oh yeah of course I remember it's kil'jaden...ow...oops'

    I should also point out that i'm really just tweaking - i'm more than happy with my dps atm.
    Last edited by Dkwhyevernot; 2017-08-07 at 06:22 PM.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Dkwhyevernot View Post
    ta for the suggestion i will give CS a go. So i did and while i prefer the positioning errors CS allows, UF is way to strong for on pull burst (in particular).
    I meant Infected Claws, sorry, I did a bit of a brain fart and typed Clawing Shadows instead (obviousy you can't swap out Shadow Infusion for Clawing Shadows). Doing this should actually slightly increase your up front burst since you get a few extra free festering wound stacks to work with.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hctaz View Post
    I guess the value of the shoulders on the apoc isn't that high?
    The shoulders bonus is mainly for Dark Arbiter. It's a nice bonus if you can also get it on your ghouls but not worth holding your Apocalypse cooldown a full 30 seconds to get it. If you know its going to be your last Apocalypse cast either way it would probably be worth holding it for the 30 seconds but other than that just use it on CD.

    The ghouls you get from Apocalypse do around 1 million damage total (in 930ish gear), so you lose out on 40% of that or about 400k damage total per cast if you don't have Dark Transformation ready. So you lose 400k damage every 3 minutes or a somewhere from 2k to 3k total DPS by doing this which is a pretty small loss and would certainly be more than outweighed by getting in an extra Apocalypse in the fight and the extra 18 seconds of increased damage it gives.
    Last edited by Sulika; 2017-08-08 at 05:00 PM.

  15. #15
    Bloodsail Admiral Piz813's Avatar
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    I wish I had a 900 or better CoF... my 890 is o my 17xx str and too many other trinket choices are 22xx str

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Piz813 View Post
    I wish I had a 900 or better CoF... my 890 is o my 17xx str and too many other trinket choices are 22xx str
    Very similar situation to me except mine is 895

  17. #17
    Dreadlord Saybel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dkwhyevernot View Post
    I dunno looking at top ranks and they almost all use shoulders chest and cof

    Maybe my post should been asking which trinket I should pair with it but I'm not in the mood to discuss how much I dislike collecting green balls.

    "Scuse me tanks just passing through oh yeah of course I remember it's kil'jaden...ow...oops'

    I should also point out that i'm really just tweaking - i'm more than happy with my dps atm.
    Top ranks are usually just arbiter lottery

    You can lose 20-40m damage over a fight just from bad arbiters and/or CoF procs and gain it from good ones.
    Death Knight
    RIP Breath of Sindragosa - 23/06/2015 - The day fun died.

  18. #18
    Reading alot of info from Acherus Discord and watching vids, a number of DK's are saying CoF is NOT simming correctly at all. Apparently the coding(?) for its sim results are not correct. From a few people that have tested it, an 890 CoF "can" better then some 930 trinks.

    Keeping in mind CoF is this strong ONLY if you have leggy shoulders.

    TLR - Dont bother using sims for CoF - they are NOT correct. You need to test for yourself and remember you NEED leggy shoulders to take full advantage of it.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Honro View Post
    Reading alot of info from Acherus Discord and watching vids, a number of DK's are saying CoF is NOT simming correctly at all. Apparently the coding(?) for its sim results are not correct. From a few people that have tested it, an 890 CoF "can" better then some 930 trinks.

    Keeping in mind CoF is this strong ONLY if you have leggy shoulders.

    TLR - Dont bother using sims for CoF - they are NOT correct. You need to test for yourself and remember you NEED leggy shoulders to take full advantage of it.
    It also highly depends on encounter timings. If the fights are long enough to squeeze in one or more additional DA casts, then it can be worth it. If not, then you should rather equip a different trinket.

    This is obviously only covered by sims, if they are just long enough so that you benefit from the trinket.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Honro View Post
    Reading alot of info from Acherus Discord and watching vids, a number of DK's are saying CoF is NOT simming correctly at all. Apparently the coding(?) for its sim results are not correct. From a few people that have tested it, an 890 CoF "can" better then some 930 trinks.

    Keeping in mind CoF is this strong ONLY if you have leggy shoulders.

    TLR - Dont bother using sims for CoF - they are NOT correct. You need to test for yourself and remember you NEED leggy shoulders to take full advantage of it.
    Unless there's something that's actually confirmed in simc to not work saying that from word of mouth it's broken, is a bad basis to go off of. Especially since this has been said of CoF since it was first added, and everytime it gets optimized more someone inherently pops up and says "but it's broken!".
    Sim lists use a 5 minute long fight, you'll find better value off of CoF on a longer or shorter fight than that so people assume that means trinket lists are "broken" due to that.

    You do not need in any way the legendary shoulders to make it worthwhile/to take full advantage of it.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dkwhyevernot View Post
    It's 885 other options are 30 higher but I like the flow it brings to our 'rotation'

    Not using cof Sims about 60k more
    There's nothing inherently "flow" based with CoF being used. You can, with slightly more ease, align DT to buff both arbiter and some ghouls but overall buffing the ghouls does almost nothing to them, yeah it's extra damage but when it comes down to it you don't hold apoc at all for DT, when you could use it instead on DA. The two set and Death stacks don't even affect DA damage, so it's really just "I enjoy things all being used at once" more so than anything.

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