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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Hctaz View Post
    I mean the best guilds in the world complained about it... so...
    Method called mythic KJ the hardest fight mechanically Blizz has ever done. Shits hard yo.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by matheney2k View Post
    Method called mythic KJ the hardest fight mechanically Blizz has ever done. Shits hard yo.
    But the problem is the way it's hard. It gets significantly easier by stacking certain classes and having everybody swap to Goblin if possible. That doesn't sound like a boss that was designed well. And Avatar had that issue as well.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Hctaz View Post
    But the problem is the way it's hard. It gets significantly easier by stacking certain classes and having everybody swap to Goblin if possible. That doesn't sound like a boss that was designed well. And Avatar had that issue as well.
    No yea I get it. I was just being a smart ass to the dumbass comment I quoted is all. I agree with you mythic is tuned too high

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by matheney2k View Post
    No yea I get it. I was just being a smart ass to the dumbass comment I quoted is all. I agree with you mythic is tuned too high
    I mean it wasn't a "dumbass" comment. They legit complained about how it was tuned. Said they felt like Blizzard used them to tune the boss for the rest of the world since they didn't want to do it themselves. Exorsus had a huge write up about where Tomb failed.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Hctaz View Post
    I mean it wasn't a "dumbass" comment. They legit complained about how it was tuned. Said they felt like Blizzard used them to tune the boss for the rest of the world since they didn't want to do it themselves. Exorsus had a huge write up about where Tomb failed.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kazuchika View Post
    It's almost like ToS is a trash raid and people are already tired of it
    says nothing about it being tuned, in fact, suggests that the problem is something else.

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by TOM_RUS View Post
    Tuning has been garbage this tier indeed.
    Seems spot on - after all the whinging about how easy raids were, now we have a truly mythic level ToS and people still whinge.
    narcissistic personality disorder : "Time Magazine called to say that I was PROBABLY going to be named “Man (Person) of the Year,” like last year, but I would have to agree to an interview and a major photo shoot. I said probably is no good and took a pass. Thanks anyway!" (Donald J. Trump - Twitter 24th November 2017).

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Clozer View Post
    Players are just worse.
    Quote Originally Posted by matheney2k View Post
    More like the player base is trash
    Nice summary, but you wouldn't make it far in business if you kept blaming customers instead of serving them what they are inclined to pay for. You can complain all day people eat burgers instead of gourmet steak but you make money by adapting and starting to sell burgers.

    On a side note, when exactly players were "better" and not "trash"? In vanilla when bosses had 2 abilities each? And only remained unkilled for a long period of time because they were either 1) bugged 2) gated behind long attunement 3) gated behind long resist gear farm.

    I think this is the prime example of "you think you do, but you don't", people want back vanilla, but in vanilla you were gated out of raids by things like attunements, onyxia scale cloaks, fire / nature resist gear and so forth. Nowadays Blizzard soft-gated some raids through artifact (like upper Nighthold being tuned around pre 7.2 max 54 traits) and introduced some "attunement like" questlines, and what is the community response? "We hate grinding, we hate gating, we hate having to quest to access a dungeon / raid". And on top of it you have casual solo players complaining that they don't want their lore questlines and professions "force" them into dungeons and raids to see the ending of a story or obtain a pattern.

    So yeah, sometimes Blizzard has to step up and save the community from themselves. People who asked for freedom of uncapped grinding were the first ones to burn out and unsub. Now the people who whined mythic Xavius was too easy are throwing the towel in TOS (or already did in NH or at Helya). I can see it in the guild ranks, my current guild was around 500 rank in HFC, now it's around 250, my old guild was rank 1000 in HFC, now it's 600. Ofc all these players can delude themselves they just got better within the scope of 1 expansion, but I don't believe it. Just there is less competition still playing.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorsameth View Post
    The jump to Sisters is a problem..
    Definitely not, the first 3 are a joke, intentionally, as "free" kills for heroic skill level kills to get before contents over. Mistress is where the issue lies, that should be like 1500.

    Sisters could do with being minorly easier, but it is not at all a big issue.

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by schwarzkopf View Post
    after all the whinging about how easy raids were, now we have a truly mythic level ToS and people still whinge.
    Well tbh Blizzard has big trouble with hitting the happy medium, it's often extremes, like endless dailies in MOP - nearly zero casual content in WOD - overload of content in Legion, which would be cool if half of it didn't feel rushed / bugged / developed just for quantity instead of quality (broken shore questline, hint, hint).

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Baconeggcheese View Post
    The "issue" with KJ was that anyone screwing up any single mechanic was a raid wipe. There was no dying to attrition, there was very little you could make up for on the fly to recover a single mistake. Other fights in the tier had the same issue though not nearly to the extent that KJ did.

    Between the nerfs and the crucible its going to be a very different fight. 14 guilds have killed it in two days since the nerfs, I think that speaks for itself.
    I think a lot of the new kills were from guilds that were already close to a kill. Quinn's guild killed it last night and they had seen last phase many times and had already worked out all the kinks with marker placement for obelisks. They had 508 pulls on it before the most recent set of nerfs.

    For what it's worth, Blizzard said that KJ's tuning was a bit too rough. At least that's what Slootbag said Ian told him when they spoke in person about it. Ian did not appear to think that Avatar was out of line though.

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gravity2015 View Post
    and roughly how many players have enjoyed LFR ?
    LFR is not the same. I can complete LFR by largely afking and auto attacking bosses.
    Quote Originally Posted by mariovsgoku View Post
    Can there be a rule against making 20 threads a day? And isn't it against the rules to create an alt account when your main is banned? It is super obvious who the OP is...

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Tennisace View Post
    LFR is not the same. I can complete LFR by largely afking and auto attacking bosses.
    You could always do that in LFR

  13. #53
    Don't worry, a lot more guilds will kill it after unlocking some crucible thing I keep hearing about.

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodmagix View Post
    Retuned as in 5% KJ nerf? I don't think 5% will suddenly make a few hundred guilds kill KJ.

    I don't mind the tuning personally. If it's too easy threads are just made saying it's undertuned. Also who wants to clear content in 1-2 weeks then farm for months? I like progress as long as people aren't being mongo.
    and at the same time buffing players dps alot with 15 weapon ilvls and a few tier 2 reliq buffs


    Quote Originally Posted by Tennisace View Post
    LFR is not the same. I can complete LFR by largely afking and auto attacking bosses.
    dose this mean you enjoyed it ?
    Last edited by yeto; 2017-09-14 at 03:35 AM.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by akris15 View Post
    That this point in Nighthold there were about 370-400. Personally I thought that number was a tad bit too low but this was during the time where mythic guilds were getting slaughtered and they just killed off AP basically. I think 500 would have been fine by Nighthold standards which would have been about .05% of the population. Using the same standard would take it 220 kills (or 4x the current amount) which ironically would put it near the current Avatar count (232). I would like to see Avatar break past 1% in the next few weeks due to raw power creep but that's still a fight where power creep helps but doesn't fix your problems like you saw in Nighthold.
    I don't know how you even got this number.
    KJ is harder than Gul'dan for sure with current nerfs and crucible is where it should be, kills should be doubled in 2 weeks or more .

    About numbers, has been 79 days since Mythic TOS release , 27/06/2017 release.

    79 days after Mythic Nighthold release ( 24/01/2017) was Thursday, 13 April 2017.

    Checking wowprogress for numbers on 13th of April gives us the following results:

    Apr 13, 2017 21:23 Bloodline +raid EU (DE)-Antonidas 135

    So 135 guilds at this point, the new talents were out and guldan got like 20 kills since 10th or 11 April . The same thing will start happening with KJ .

    Is 64 KJ vs 135 Gul'dan .

    It has been summer and raiding activities probably diminished , there has been small breaks and non optimal setups on many guilds.

    Chronomatic Anomaly had : 6983 Kills
    Harjatan : 4266 kills

    Elisande: 435 kills
    Apr 13, 2017 22:11 Angels Wings +raid EU (FR)-Hyjal 435
    Avatar : 239 kills

    Comparing current participation on Mythic , it was overtuned but i think is comparable now.
    The ratio between avatar and KJ is similiar to Elisande and Gul'dan .

    Lets look at Kj numbers in two weeks, or 1 month for over 400+ kills.

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by vizuk View Post
    Lets look at Kj numbers in two weeks, or 1 month for over 400+ kills.
    There are less than 250 Avatar kills at the moment. 150 guilds which haven't killed Avatar yet certainly won't kill KJ in a month.
    Last edited by Avalrand; 2017-09-14 at 04:57 AM.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Avalrand View Post
    There are less than 250 Avatar kills at the moment. 150 guilds which haven't killed Avatar yet certainly won't kill KJ in a month.
    1 month and 1 week? 2 weeks should be enough for 400 kills on avatar and 3 weeks for KJ on it's current state.
    Fallen avatar got 30 kills in the last 24 hours.

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodmagix View Post
    Retuned as in 5% KJ nerf? I don't think 5% will suddenly make a few hundred guilds kill KJ.

    I don't mind the tuning personally. If it's too easy threads are just made saying it's undertuned. Also who wants to clear content in 1-2 weeks then farm for months? I like progress as long as people aren't being mongo.
    It wasn't just 5% nerf. Crucible adds a ton of DPS so a lot of the DPS checks are a joke now. There were 48 guilds that had killed it (Nurfed being the last) before any of the nerfs, and at the time of the creating of the thread, another 12 guilds killed it in the first raid night after the nerfs.
    Siegecrafter Blackfuse (25-N) testing is complete! Today's Wisdom:
    One man's Trash is another Man's Heroic Boss.

  19. #59
    WoW is so easy these days and caters for n00bs and self entitled bitches. Now when I was playing, in vanilla, the game was really hard. You had to spend months to EVEN get to max level, man. The kids these days... #bringbackvanilla

  20. #60
    As someone who killed Mythic KJ tonight, the nerfs + Crucible changes were huge and made the fight seem reasonable. Consistency went up across the board and we went from making it to Dark Phase once, to killing it post-nerf in 6 hours -- 5 total attempts in P3.

    -- Crucible + 5% health nerf cuts out 2 or 3 armageddon soaks and a good chunk of phase 3. It completely removes any semblance of a DPS check from the encounter making p3 all about survival rather than doing both.
    -- Bursting change looks small, but is actually pretty large as well. Part of the difficulty of Bursting was the combos -- the limited room of P3 and the Tank Dispel, Bursting combo.
    -- Armageddon change is really nice as well. No more tank soaks in the corner. One roar is still probably required, but two definitely not necessary anymore.
    -

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