Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Breccia]

So once again, it's time for Guess the Tweeter!

We have more cases because we have tested far more than any other country, 60,000,000.

If we tested less, there would be less cases. How did Italy, France & Spain do? Now Europe sadly has flare ups. Most of our governors worked hard & smart. We will come back STRONG!

"Sigh."

Correct, it's Trump.

The US has about 25% of the cases in the world, and about 25% of all the deaths in the world, to the lethal outbreak now so disproportionately common in the US that calling it "CHINA VIRUS CHINA VIRUS CHINA VIRUS" is as honest as saying they eat more frankfurters in Frankfurt than America, by claiming that Americans eat hot dogs so it doesn't count.

But it's been a day or two, so let's open it up to another 24 hour challenge. Because cases/deaths are roughly proportional in the US (about 25% of the world each) there are only a few possible outcomes.

1) Trump is lying.

2) Trump is telling the truth, and our caseload is higher because of increased testing. But this also means we have a disproprotionately high death rate, because other countries didn't test as many people and therefore had fewer cases than they would have, if they tested like the US did. This would lower their death rate, since they'd have more cases but the same number of deaths.

3) There is no option three. Trump didn't allow one by, for example, saying "deaths are inflated because rogue doctors are blaming suicides and heart attacks to COVID-19". Therefore you may not invent an alternate scenario to this challenge. Sorry. I don't make the rules, even in my own challenges -- Trump supporters must follow Trump's rules. (Non-Trump-supporters are allowed to add other options)

I will point out, however, the real risk of attempting one of my challenges is the sheer number of previous challenges that Trump supporters have failed. Just to use a name at random, @lockedout has avoided this thread for some time, but he has posted during the time of my previous challenge, and also has posted in other threads. Therefore, he has failed to rebuke Trump for suggesting pushing back the election, and by doing so has admitted he wants to delay the election. Also he has admitted he is a coward, but with the other missed challenges, that's now proven a dozen times over. It's not the strategy I would have gone with myself, but let's face it, Trump supporters are increasingly low on options. "I cannot defend Trump and I am a coward" seems to be something they're more willing to admit in public than "Trump is lying and I am willing to say that Trump lied".

Hell, at this point, we're seeing reports of people who would literally rather die than say Trump is wrong. I'm not even talking about Cain, not primarily. I'm talking about the people who are demanding packed classrooms for their children. Deaths are over 1,000 a day and it's still early August. If schools are being forced to host packed classrooms of children in record-setting case/deaths states, then late Sept/all of Oct, we're going to see the complaints magically shift from "I want my kids in packed classrooms so I can work" to "now I have to keep my kids home because all the teachers are sick" to "my babysitter died".

- - - Updated - - -

My guess is it's because they're expecting more dissent from within than they'd care to admit to the public.

I find that unlikely. One, Trump will hear about any dissent and throw a Trumper Tantrum. We'll find out. Two, I think they'll still broadcast it on TV, I don't know why @cubby said it wouldn't be. Three, there is no point of dissent anymore. Trump insisted he run unopposed, and the GOP is now the Party of Trump. Four, the lethal outbreak that killed Herman Cain is enough of a reason to remove the public -- they don't need a secret ulterior motive, "I don't want to die" is enough.

[Underbottom]

So was the MIS-C scare in April/May not Covid caused or should we be checking who has invested in antipyretics?

[Breccia]

So was the MIS-C scare in April/May not Covid caused or should we be checking who has invested in antipyretics?

It seems to be COVID related.

[Omega10]

Hell, at this point, we're seeing reports of people who would literally rather die than say Trump is wrong. I'm not even talking about Cain, not primarily. I'm talking about the people who are demanding packed classrooms for their children. Deaths are over 1,000 a day and it's still early August. If schools are being forced to host packed classrooms of children in record-setting case/deaths states, then late Sept/all of Oct, we're going to see the complaints magically shift from "I want my kids in packed classrooms so I can work" to "now I have to keep my kids home because all the teachers are sick" to "my babysitter died".

These people are not just willing to die, they are also willing to kill off their family and neighbors and friends.

The summer camp in Georgia that had so many virus positives so quickly, and the speed in which the virus is spreading in the MLB, are MORE than enough evidence to close schools and figure out how to make virutal schooling work.

By the way, Georgia is up to number 5 in number of cases. Right behind California, Florida, Texas, and New York.

New York and New Jersey used to be number 1 and 2 by a lot. Now they are 4 and 6.

At the rate things are going, Georgia will catch up to New York in about 3 months.

[DarkTZeratul]

Two quick additions before I get to one of the best ice cream parlors in the country, and I have looked

Unless you're going to Fentons Creamery in Oakland, CA, this statement is a damned filthy lie.

[downnola]

That seems optimistic. Unless he loses in a landslide so massive it shifts the continents, I doubt it will spur much of a reevaluation of anything. Because the base that supports those things is as fervent as ever. Just look at how easily something that should have been as uncontroversial as wearing a mask during a pandemic was turned into a rallying cry.

In my experience, most Republicans I know are pretty squishy when it comes to policy. With the exception of abortion, there isn't much they won't change their mind about as long as it contradicts and pisses off liberals.

They just march to whoever the fiddler is.

[Redwyrm]

They just march to whoever the pied piper is.

works better , rats and all that

[Breccia]

Unless you're going to Fentons Creamery in Oakland, CA, this statement is a damned filthy lie.

*ahem*

"One of" is not a lie. It is a convenient loophole.

On topic: we've seen Trump go from

It’s one person coming in from China. We have it under control. It’s going to be just fine.

on Jan 22 through the various "stages of grief" to his most recent "wearing a mask is patriotic, which is why I'll do it once then stop".

It's not enough, which is why his latest tweet is

Big China Virus breakouts all over the World, including nations which were thought to have done a great job,

The Fake News doesn’t report this, USA will be stronger than ever before, and soon!

In that tweet, he linked news -- yeah, that's the hypocrisy on full display -- about how Australia has a massive new breakout.

"Oh no! How many Australians died?"

Seven.

"...seven thousand? Seven hundred?"

Seven people. Australia has about as many people as Florida and the spike Trump personally linked wasn't enough people to field a baseball game. If Australia proportionally scaled up to the US, those deaths would be under 100. Or, if you look at it as a total amount, Australia would scale up to about 2,700 deaths total compared to the USA's 150 thousand plus.

Leaving aside Australia's contextual problem (seven is a lot for them, they really have done an outstanding job) Trump is desperate to distract from his horrible leadership and horrible results. Calling out Australia specifically was pretty stupid, but "that country is doing a bad job" in no way refutes "the USA has done a bad job". Making the comparison by lengths of prison sentences and comparing US vs Australia's total deaths, if Trump committed second degree murder (up to 25 years in prison) Australia committed buying a beer while underage (up to six months).

Leaders make results. Losers make excuses. But this isn't even a good excuse.

Also, it begs the question "Trump has the biggest soapbox on the planet. Why didn't he say something sooner, if this was a valid excuse?" Or "Did he really think the US media wasn't reporting info on the EU earlier on? Because we were talking about the EU earlier on."

Trump has nothing.

[Ursus]

These people are not just willing to die, they are also willing to kill off their family and neighbors and friends.

Remember when Trump said he could shoot someone in the middle of 5th Avenue and not lose a single supporter? Well not only that, but he could shoot one of his own supporters and the only thing that supporter would say, "Thank you Sir, may I have another?"

[Breccia]

So let's hear from Dr. Birx.

Birx said Sunday that the COVID-19 outbreak is not under control in the U.S. because Americans "are on the move."

When asked about why the U.S. has not been able to stop the coronavirus spread, Birx said on CNN’s 'State of the Union" that she’s learned through studying epidemics that health officials need a "tailored" message "on the ground."

The White House coronavirus task force coordinator said she’s seen through recent travel to 14 states that Americans “are on the move.”

“Across America right now, people are on the move,” she said. “And so all of our discussions about social distancing and decreasing gatherings to under 10 — as I traveled around the country, I saw all of America moving.”

The public health official also said people who vacationed in “hot spots” should assume they are infected.

Birx added that the U.S. is in a “new phase” of the pandemic and called on all Americans to wear masks and to practice social distancing and proper personal hygiene.

“What we’re seeing today is different from March and April,” she said. “It is extraordinarily widespread. It’s into the rural as equal urban areas. And to everybody who lives in a rural area, you are not immune or protected from this virus.”

Obviously, Dr. Birx is an expert and likely has one of the best-informed views of the subject, along with Fauci.

However, I can't help but read into her statement -- intentionally or otherwise -- seems to criticize a lack of federal leadership. Would it matter if people were travelling from state to state, if every state had the same rules?

[Ursus]

So let's hear from Dr. Birx.



Obviously, Dr. Birx is an expert and likely has one of the best-informed views of the subject, along with Fauci.

However, I can't help but read into her statement -- intentionally or otherwise -- seems to criticize a lack of federal leadership. Would it matter if people were travelling from state to state, if every state had the same rules?

She's been unwilling to push back against Trump since the start of this entire pandemic. Even when he asked her about ingesting bleach and disinfectant, all she could do is sit there with a blank stare on her face. I'm sure it's eating her up inside, but if we're looking for someone to criticize the lack of federal leadership, it's not going to be her.

[Breccia]

Even when he asked her about ingesting bleach and disinfectant, all she could do is sit there with a blank stare on her face. I'm sure it's eating her up inside

Okay, that's clever.

The Sunday morning shows are good for headlines, such as the WH testing czar saying he can't recommend hydrolics and Biden taking a slight edge in Georgia.

[Acidbaron]

So let's hear from Dr. Birx.



Obviously, Dr. Birx is an expert and likely has one of the best-informed views of the subject, along with Fauci.

However, I can't help but read into her statement -- intentionally or otherwise -- seems to criticize a lack of federal leadership. Would it matter if people were travelling from state to state, if every state had the same rules?

Europe is a whole lot stricter and limiting travel does matter, you also generally have to expect to self quarantine for two weeks on arrival and on return. This depends on what nation you are from and how many infected there are, hence the colour codes used in Europe to define a nation or even more specifically a region infection level.

That's simply due to how infectious it is and not everyone follows everything to the letter.

Take note that Europe's approach is also still somewhat fractured as there are no EU wide corona measures or guidelines, but you simply have a whole lot less governments actively working against each other and inspiring people to do the same. The crazy people are still very much a minority.

[Breccia]

Three quick things.

One, the WH/Mnuchin is not optimistic about the chance of a stimulus deal soon.

Two, Fuck Florida broke their weekly and daily death records at the same time.

Three, Trump's own Chief of Staff specifically and directly refuted the idea of moving the election. Big time What He Meant Was on that one.

[Gorsameth]

I love the Republicans talking about how the Democrats should accept a short term solution and then negotiate a long term plan, because that way they can deny all support after November and leave a Democratic President with the massive pile of shit they created rather then having to fix it themselves.

[Breccia]

I love the Republicans talking about how the Democrats should accept a short term solution and then negotiate a long term plan

It should be like the federal budget. "Sure, extend the existing plan for another XXX days/weeks/months. That's what we wanted anyhow. Don't like that? Well, your voters do, so think of something fast."

[kaid]

So let's hear from Dr. Birx.



Obviously, Dr. Birx is an expert and likely has one of the best-informed views of the subject, along with Fauci.

However, I can't help but read into her statement -- intentionally or otherwise -- seems to criticize a lack of federal leadership. Would it matter if people were travelling from state to state, if every state had the same rules?

I think she is playing some games to try to keep at least one scientist speaking for the WH but pelosi called her out on this kind of stuff where she soft balls the obvious conclusions because if she says it she gets the fauci treatment.

[Ialak]

Snipped rant about Australia's new breakout

Yeah Victoria (State) has really let the rest of the country down. But the biggest difference between them and Trumpland is that Victoria is actually taking it seriously. They just declared a "State of Disaster". law enforcement now have MASSIVELY enhanced powers to enforce the new curfew, people aren't allowed to travel more than 5km (just over 3 miles) from your house even to get groceries, large fine for breach (over $1k on the spot and a court hearing for another $10k), masks are mandatory (as they fucking should be anywhere with even a minor problem).

The big worry is that it seems to be spreading to other states now... New South Wales now has an outbreak in Sydney, few new cases in South Australia, and my state (Queensland) is now ramping up testing again (we went like a month without any spread, just imported cases straight into quarantine) because of 3 women who lied to the authorities to breach the ban on travel from Melbourne (and they are now the absolutely most hated people in all of Queensland) and then went about probably spreading it by going to restaurants/shops even after they became symptomatic (thus demonstrating why no preventative measures should be based on peoples honour/honesty). So far 2 new cases related to them in a husband and wife that were at the same restaurant as them...

Luckily the other large, populous state (Western Australia) is smart enough to maintain its hard border with the rest of the country (they've never liked the rest of us anyway).

[Benggaul]

49,038 new cases. About 7k fewer than last Sunday and the first time it's been under 50k for nearly a month. This is good news in the sense that it will give the medical infrastructure time to recover before things inevitably go wahooni-shaped in September once schools reopen.

Florida: 7,104 new cases; 62 deaths
California: 6,395 new cases; 38 deaths
Texas: 4,618 new cases; 75 deaths
Louisiana: 3,467 new cases; 57 deaths
Georgia: 3,165 new cases; 15 deaths
Alabama: 2,095 new cases; 24 deaths
North Carolina: 1,673 new cases; 14 deaths
Illinois: 1,467 new cases; 14 deaths
Arizona: 1,465 new cases; 18 deaths
Tennessee: 1,443 new cases; 6 deaths
South Carolina: 1,189 new cases; 26 deaths
Nevada: 1,131 new cases; no deaths reported

No new records to speak of but this isn't saying much considering it's a weekend and standard "underreporting" warnings apply. The trends do show, however, that the "big four" of this outbreak--California, Arizona, Texas and Fuck Florida--are on the downward slope towards recovery. Neighboring states are still plateauing or showing increases, however, so this wave isn't over and won't be for a while yet...and the deaths are going to be high for a while.

They were slightly higher than the past Sunday at 467, putting the total at 158,365. There's not much else I can say about it except that we can likely expect more 1k+ days in the upcoming week and the secondary-infection states will probably start posting higher totals as well.

Just "finished" Death Stranding today and I've got that post-game depression (and that game punches you right in the feels towards the end), so I'm not going to dwell too much on this topic for now.

Stay safe, folks. Keep on keepin' on.

[bmjclark]

49,038 new cases. About 7k fewer than last Sunday and the first time it's been under 50k for nearly a month. This is good news in the sense that it will give the medical infrastructure time to recover before things inevitably go wahooni-shaped in September once schools reopen.

Florida: 7,104 new cases; 62 deaths
California: 6,395 new cases; 38 deaths
Texas: 4,618 new cases; 75 deaths
Louisiana: 3,467 new cases; 57 deaths
Georgia: 3,165 new cases; 15 deaths
Alabama: 2,095 new cases; 24 deaths
North Carolina: 1,673 new cases; 14 deaths
Illinois: 1,467 new cases; 14 deaths
Arizona: 1,465 new cases; 18 deaths
Tennessee: 1,443 new cases; 6 deaths
South Carolina: 1,189 new cases; 26 deaths
Nevada: 1,131 new cases; no deaths reported

No new records to speak of but this isn't saying much considering it's a weekend and standard "underreporting" warnings apply. The trends do show, however, that the "big four" of this outbreak--California, Arizona, Texas and Fuck Florida--are on the downward slope towards recovery. Neighboring states are still plateauing or showing increases, however, so this wave isn't over and won't be for a while yet...and the deaths are going to be high for a while.

They were slightly higher than the past Sunday at 467, putting the total at 158,365. There's not much else I can say about it except that we can likely expect more 1k+ days in the upcoming week and the secondary-infection states will probably start posting higher totals as well.

Just "finished" Death Stranding today and I've got that post-game depression (and that game punches you right in the feels towards the end), so I'm not going to dwell too much on this topic for now.

Stay safe, folks. Keep on keepin' on.

Unfortunately a lot of places in Texas didn't report today due to a system upgrade and Florida shut down a lot of testing centers due to the hurricane. The situation isn't as promising as the numbers today make it seem.