Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[soulkeeperx]

That was great speech by Trump, no way they'll let Biden debate him now lmao

[Ausr]

That was great speech by Trump, no way they'll let Biden debate him now lmao

I don't think there is any merit in debating Trump. Not because anyone thinks Trump is a great debater, but what are you going to get out of him other than more bullshit and blaming other people?

[Astalnar]

Another great speech by Trump. The aftermath is even better. People just can't stop talking about it.

Of all the RNC speakers, the one I liked the most, was Nick Sandmann's. That kid got stones. Gives me hope for GenZ.

[Elegiac]

Another great speech by Trump.

I didn't watch it but based on his past history; no, it wasn't.

The man is not physically capable of giving a 'good' speech let alone a great one. I kinda miss the days where oratory and rhetoric were respected pursuits by politicians and not stumbling over your words in front of a teleprompter was considered a high bar.

[SirBeef]

I didn't watch it but based on his past history; no, it wasn't.

The man is not physically capable of giving a 'good' speech let alone a great one. I kinda miss the days where oratory and rhetoric were respected pursuits by politicians and not stumbling over your words in front of a teleprompter was considered a high bar.

I watched it. These Trumpstains are grasping for straws if they think this was a good speech.

Oh by the way, in 1997 the GOP hat a shit hemorrhage over Al Gore making fund raising calls from the White House, citing Hatch Act violations. But this, Pompeo, and other administration officials directly campaigning for Trump is perfectly fine with them.

[Ausr]

I didn't watch it but based on his past history; no, it wasn't.

The man is not physically capable of giving a 'good' speech let alone a great one. I kinda miss the days where oratory and rhetoric were respected pursuits by politicians and not stumbling over your words in front of a teleprompter was considered a high bar.

Every review, aside from people with their dicks so far up Trump's ass they can't see straight, reviewed it as low energy, too long, and Biden this, Biden that.

[Elegiac]

I watched it. These Trumpstains are grasping for straws if they think this was a good speech.

Oh by the way, in 1997 the GOP hat a shit hemorrhage over Al Gore making fund raising calls from the White House, citing Hatch Act violations. But this, Pompeo, and other administration officials directly campaigning for Trump is perfectly fine with them.

I shall keep reposting this until it stops being true: American conservatism is predicated on the notion that there are in-groups the law protects but doesn't bind, and out-groups the law binds but doesn't protect.

What we are seeing in 2020 is the naked end result of that attitude being embraced as the GOP's operating strategy. When Republicans talk about "American citizens", y'all should keep in mind they aren't including Democrats in that statement. They have fully succumbed to a worldview in which glorious Western culture is under attack by an insidious long-running ideological infiltration dating back to before the Soviet Union in which subscribing to said ideology makes you a traitor to your country.

So pretty stock standard ur-fascist nonsense.

[SirBeef]

I shall keep reposting this until it stops being true: American conservatism is predicated on the notion that there are in-groups the law protects but doesn't bind, and out-groups the law binds but doesn't protect.

What we are seeing in 2020 is the naked end result of that attitude being embraced as the GOP's operating strategy. When Republicans talk about "American citizens", y'all should keep in mind they aren't including Democrats in that statement. They have fully succumbed to a worldview in which glorious Western culture is under attack by an insidious long-running ideological infiltration dating back to before the Soviet Union in which subscribing to said ideology makes you a traitor to your country.

So pretty stock standard ur-fascist nonsense.

No I know. That is why any time a conservaturd bitches about something a Dem did or does is hilarious in it hypocrisy.

[Elegiac]

I guess it's yet another case of their projection issues?

Nah, it's honestly just the legacy of garden variety "international conspiracy of Jewish bankers" crap that has been popular in right wing European circles since forever, except because that is no longer as publicly acceptable to bitch about as it was in 1927 we have to hear complaints about George Soros and 'postmodern neomarxism' - whatever the fuck that is supposed to be.

[Draco-Onis]

Another great speech by Trump. The aftermath is even better. People just can't stop talking about it..

It's the news from the day before being reported how did you come to people can't stop talking about it? it will be forgotten by the next headline just like every other rambling speech he gives.

[Breccia]

That was great speech by Trump, no way they'll let Biden debate him now lmao

Another great speech by Trump.

Not sure if sarcasm, trolling, or Russian bots. Trump's speech was loaded with misinformation and outright lies.

"Joe Biden claims he has empathy for the vulnerable, yet the party he leads supports the extreme late-term abortion of defenseless babies right up to the moment of birth."

This mischaracterizes the Democratic Party’s stance on abortion and Biden’s position.

Biden has said he would codify the Supreme Court’s ruling in Roe v. Wade and related precedents. This would generally limit abortions to the first 20 to 24 weeks of gestation.

"When asked if he supports cutting police funding, Joe Biden replied, ‘Yes, absolutely.’"

Amid discussions of defunding the police, this claim is missing context. Biden has said he would redirect some social-services responsibilities away from police departments and roll back investments in military gear, but he also wants to increase federal funding for community policing.

"Biden has promised to abolish the production of American oil, coal, shale, and natural gas – laying waste to the economies of Pennsylvania, Ohio, Texas, North Dakota, Oklahoma, Colorado, and New Mexico."

This is misleading. Biden’s climate plan aims to wean the country off oil, coal and natural gas, not abolish it outright.

"Biden also vowed to oppose school choice and close down charter schools, ripping away the ladder of opportunity for Black and Hispanic children."

This is Mostly False. Biden’s policy platform backs several forms of school choice, including nonprofit charter schools, public magnet schools, and choice within school districts.

"Joe Biden recently raised his hand on the debate stage and promised he was going to give it away, your health care dollars to illegal immigrants, which is going to bring massive number of immigrants into our country."

This is misleading. During a June 2019 Democratic primary debate, candidates were asked: "Raise your hand if your government plan would provide coverage for undocumented immigrants." All candidates on stage, including Biden, raised their hands. They were not asked if that coverage would be free or subsidized.

Biden "has pledged a $4 trillion tax hike on almost all American families."

Yes and no. That’s an accurate estimate for Biden’s tax revenues over a decade, according to the Tax Policy Center. (Other groups have come up with slightly lower estimates.)

But tax analysts say the impact on most American families would be small and largely due to the indirect effects of Biden’s raising the corporate tax rate.

Biden’s proposed increases are heavily concentrated on corporations and the nation’s biggest earners. The Tax Policy Center estimated that more than 90% of the tax increases would be borne by the top 20% of earners.

Biden has vowed not to directly raise taxes on anyone making less than $400,000 per year.

The Obama-Biden administration "spied on my campaign and they got caught."

False. Multiple independent investigations, including a series of bipartisan Senate reports, found no influence by the Obama administration over the FBI investigation of Russian interference in the 2016 election and contacts with the Trump campaign.

Democrats "will demolish the suburbs."

This is a False interpretation of Biden’s proposal to reinstate an Obama administration rule change related to discrimination in housing. The change required certain localities to work with Washington to identify barriers to fair housing and come up with strategies to fix them.

"The top 10 most dangerous cities in the country are run by Democrats, and have been for many decades."

This is misleading. Large cities do have more crime, and they do have more Democrats — both in terms of general voting and local leadership. But the connection to crime is a classic example of correlation without evidence of causality.

"During the Democrat Convention, the words ‘under God’ were removed from the Pledge of Allegiance — not once, but twice."

The phrase "under God" was not excluded from the televised Democratic National Convention. Delegates at two of 30 caucus and council meetings that took place during the convention week omitted "under God" during the Pledge of Allegiance.

"We have already built 300 miles of border wall."

This is wrong. Before Trump took office, the nearly 2,000-mile southern border had 654 miles of primary barriers (the first physical impediment a migrant may face).

More than three years into Trump’s presidency, that has increased by 5 miles.

Trump’s boast refers to the replacement of older barriers with new fences.

"By the end of my first term, we will have approved more than 300 federal judges, including two great new Supreme Court justices."

The 300 number is optimistic. So far, about 200 federal judges have been appointed by Trump and confirmed by the U.S Senate, according to records from the Federal Judicial Center.

"When the anarchists started ripping down our statues and monuments, right outside, I signed an order immediately, 10 years in prison."

This is overstating the law. The 10-year penalty for damaging federal property is a maximum punishment, meaning it doesn’t apply to every violation.

The penalty also isn’t new. It was contained in a previous piece of U.S. Code.

"We have spent nearly $2.5 trillion on completely rebuilding our military, which was very badly depleted when I took office."

This is Mostly False. The $2.5 trillion comes from the total defense budgets for the last four fiscal years. The Pentagon spent or appropriated about $562.5 billion on buying or upgrading equipment, which can take years to build and develop. The rest went to research and development, military personnel, and operation and maintenance costs, among other things.

Experts say most weapons are the same as before, and there is more continuity than change in defense policy from President Barack Obama to Trump.

"Last month, I took on Big Pharma. You think that is easy? I signed orders that would massively lower the cost of your prescription drugs."

Misleading. Trump signed four executive orders on July 24, 2020, that are aimed at lowering prescription drug prices. But those orders haven’t been put into effect yet — the text of one hasn’t even been made publicly available — and experts told us that if implemented, it’s unlikely they would result in significant drug price reductions for the majority of Americans.

"We will always and very strongly protect patients with preexisting conditions, and that is a pledge from the entire Republican Party."

Trump’s pledge is undermined by his efforts to overturn the Affordable Care Act, the only law that guarantees people with preexisting conditions both receive health coverage and do not have to pay more for it. In 2017, Trump supported congressional efforts to repeal the ACA. The Trump administration is now backing the GOP-led efforts to overturn the ACA through a court case. And Trump has also expanded short-term health plans that don’t have to comply with the ACA.

"Over the past three months, we have gained over 9 million jobs, a new record."

The 9 million gain in jobs was preceded by a loss of 22 million jobs due to the shutdown prompted by the coronavirus pandemic. In February, before the pandemic was declared, the United States had 152.4 million people employed in non-farm jobs. That number bottomed out at 130.3 million in April. By July, the number rose to 139.6 million. In other words, only about 40% of the jobs lost due to the downturn had been gained back

"The United States has among the lowest (COVID-19) case fatality rates of any major country in the world. The European Union's case fatality rate is nearly three times higher than ours."

The case fatality rate measures the known number of cases compared to the known number of deaths. The European Union has a rate that’s about two and a half times larger than the United States.

But the source of that data, Oxford University’s Our World in Data project, says that "during an outbreak of a pandemic the case fatality rate is a poor measure of the mortality risk of the disease."

A better way to measure the threat of the virus, experts say, is to look at the number of deaths per 100,000 residents. Viewed that way, the U.S. has the 10th-highest death rate in the world.

"We will produce a vaccine before the end of the year, or maybe even sooner."

It’s far from guaranteed that a coronavirus vaccine will be ready before the end of the year.

"We developed, from scratch, the largest and most advanced testing system in the world."

This is partially right, but it needs context.

It’s accurate that the U.S. developed its COVID-19 testing system from scratch, because the government didn’t accept the World Health Organization’s testing recipe. W, but whether the system is the "largest" or "most advanced" is subject to debate.

The U.S. has tested more individuals than any other country in the world. But experts told us a more meaningful metric would be the percentage of positive tests out of all tests, indicating that not only sick people were getting tested. Another useful metric would be the percentage of the population that has been tested. The U.S. is one of the most populous countries in the world, but has tested a lower percentage of its population than other countries.

You'll note a few of those statements have links in them. That's because they're repeated lies or misinformation. Repeating a lie doesn't make it true. Repeating a lie makes you a gaslighting con man.

Misrepresentations, unkeepable promises, and outright lies. The only way you can defend this as a "great speech" is if you willingly welcome falsehood from your choice of leader.

You're free to find the problems in Biden's speech. I welcome it. If Biden lied, I want him held accountable and even shamed for it. But I don't think you will. Every 24-hour challenge I've given has been failed by even our most dedicated Trump supporters. I think it's far more likely that what we see here are drive-by shitposts, possibly with Russian IPs.

I know some people are at least pretending to like the speech, but you know what they say...there's a сука born every minute.

[Felya]

Another great speech by Trump. The aftermath is even better. People just can't stop talking about it.

Do you see the irony of this being your only post on it? lol

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That was great speech by Trump, no way they'll let Biden debate him now lmao

I have no clue where you guys are getting this from. Have you seen the man debate or talk in any place that isn’t his supporters? It’s bizarre to claim the above, as Trump is literally fighting to change the rules of debates, because he is afraid of moderators he can’t coach.

[Draco-Onis]

I have no clue where you guys are getting this from. Have you seen the man debate or talk in any place that isn’t his supporters? It’s bizarre to claim the above, as Trump is literally fighting to change the rules of debates, because he is afraid of moderators he can’t coach.

Pssst you need to let them keep saying how Trump is the best debater in the entire universe. The strategy is as bigly smart as their leader set expectations sky high for Trump and stupidly low for Biden.

[Thekri]

Pssst you need to let them keep saying how Trump is the best debater in the entire universe. The strategy is as bigly smart as their leader set expectations sky high for Trump and stupidly low for Biden.

Won't matter, debates are useless because they are pure confirmation bias. Everyone sees exactly what they expect to see. In any Presidential debate, both sides will see their candidate as a clear winner. Unless one of them loses consciousness or something, it won't have meaningful impact. Trump could call Harris the N-word during the debate, and Trump supporters would praise him for standing up to out of control political correctness.

[Bodakane]

Won't matter, debates are useless because they are pure confirmation bias. Everyone sees exactly what they expect to see. In any Presidential debate, both sides will see their candidate as a clear winner. Unless one of them loses consciousness or something, it won't have meaningful impact. Trump could call Harris the N-word during the debate, and Trump supporters would praise him for standing up to out of control political correctness.

^This.

I mean Trump had his clock cleaned in the debates by Hillary and what did that prove? Also, Trump is very likely able to goad Biden into saying something he shouldn't. Like you said, Trump supporters literally don't care what Trump says or does so he can't be hurt politically by debating.

[Breccia]

Congratulations to Donald Trump, who passed 20,000 false/misleading statements on the WaPo list. I'd find it highly fitting if he did that while accepting the TNC nomination.

[Elegiac]

Congratulations to Donald Trump, who passed 20,000 false/misleading statements on the WaPo list. I'd find it highly fitting if he did that while accepting the TNC nomination.

He's got a lie for every dollar he's shelled out to six or seven casinos worth of contractors.

[Mekh]

Not sure if sarcasm, trolling, or Russian bots. Trump's speech was loaded with misinformation and outright lies.



You'll note a few of those statements have links in them. That's because they're repeated lies or misinformation. Repeating a lie doesn't make it true. Repeating a lie makes you a gaslighting con man.

Misrepresentations, unkeepable promises, and outright lies. The only way you can defend this as a "great speech" is if you willingly welcome falsehood from your choice of leader.

You're free to find the problems in Biden's speech. I welcome it. If Biden lied, I want him held accountable and even shamed for it. But I don't think you will. Every 24-hour challenge I've given has been failed by even our most dedicated Trump supporters. I think it's far more likely that what we see here are drive-by shitposts, possibly with Russian IPs.

I know some people are at least pretending to like the speech, but you know what they say...there's a сука born every minute.

“Jean-Luc, sometimes I think the only reason I come here is to listen to these wonderful [posts] of yours.”

[Felya]

^This.

I mean Trump had his clock cleaned in the debates by Hillary and what did that prove? Also, Trump is very likely able to goad Biden into saying something he shouldn't. Like you said, Trump supporters literally don't care what Trump says or does so he can't be hurt politically by debating.

Yep, no mater what happens... I can 100% predict that people who think Trump will win the debates, will believe that Trump dominated... perfect timing of the stroke... did you see how Biden didn’t know how to react? Once Trump is out of the hospital.........

Oh and flipping it to Biden doesn’t work... I think a lot of people that will vote Biden, even if Biden dominates debates, will still be pissed there was no one better.

[Thekri]

Yep, no mater what happens... I can 100% predict that people who think Trump will win the debates, will believe that Trump dominated... perfect timing of the stroke... did you see how Biden didn’t know how to react? Once Trump is out of the hospital.........

Oh and flipping it to Biden doesn’t work... I think a lot of people that will vote Biden, even if Biden dominates debates, will still be pissed there was no one better.

Exactly, but it really all boils down to the fundamental issue of this election, which puts historically low expectations on both candidates. The fundamental voter issue is Trump vs. Not-Trump. All Biden has to do is not be Trump. All Trump has to do is be Trump. Since both of those things are already determined, debates are rather useless.

The two Conventions essentially had the same exact message: "Biden is not Trump". Obviously the DNC was that message stated as a good thing, the QNC was that stated as a dystopian indie horror film, but the message was the same.